[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kublikhan', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', '
')
I have no time for obfuscation, or speeches, just the facts please, the Energy (not money) it takes

[Newfie]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')
Orsted’s troubles are the latest in a series of struggles for the wind-power industry, just as countries around the world demand more of the clean energy technology. Rising supply chain costs have clouded the outlook for some developers’ revenue, with others facing turmoil from critical mechanical issues.

[theluckycountry]

Look at the scale of this stuff



Has any of it been through a hurricane yet?

Turbulent Times For Biden's Offshore Wind Farms
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... #xj4y7vzkg

Or if you don't have a bloomberg account
https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/turbu ... jects-real

[Newfie]

Saw a destroyed wind farm in Puerto Rico.

Current hurricane Lee may opens some eyes. Unlikely.

[theluckycountry]

New York rejects Orsted, Equinor, BP requests to charge more for offshore wind

Someone made a mistake in the cost calculations for offshore wind power.

October 13, 2023 https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/ ... 023-10-12/

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')ew York regulators on Thursday denied requests by European energy firms Orsted (ORSTED.CO), Equinor (EQNR.OL), BP (BP.L) and other renewable developers to charge customers billions of dollars more under future power sale contracts.

The state denial could force some developers whose contracts may not cover project costs to scrap plans to sell power to customers in New York, cancel or delay projects, as happened with a couple of offshore wind projects in Massachusetts. Developers were looking to renegotiate contracts on four offshore wind and 86 land-based renewable projects...

The New York Public Service Commission said amending contracts would have resulted in increases of as much as 6.7% for residential customers' monthly bills. New Yorkers already pay some of the highest rates for electricity in the country, according to federal energy data.

[kublikhan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'A')fter all these years you would think someone would have made a Renewable powered mine or foundry, since the tech is so cheap, but the simple fact they haven't proves it's not practical. There is a lot you can do with electricity, but there is a lot you cannot.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'D')iesel has been the dominant source of power for Australia's mines, which are often located in remote areas and not connected to major power grids.

[kublikhan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'W')ell it makes sense to use wind or solar plants to electrify mineral processing plant and accommodation facilities at remote mines far from conventional power stations. But that's only a fraction of the energy used on site compared to the earth movers that actually mine it and the transporters that get the product from the remote area to market. It's all dug out on diesel machinery, transported away on diesel trucks and diesel trains. And forget electric drag-lines. They are a niche application and only suitable at certain mines with flat terrain and softer earth. They are no use in hardrock mining.

What you have posted kub is what we call "Green Washing" Superficial blurb that gives the impression, to people who have no idea what goes on at a mine, that mines are going 100% renewable. Nothing could be further from the truth. None of those articles mention What the electricity was being used for. And for good reason, it would open up too many questions.

So ignoring the powering of the worker's dongas and the electric motors for the grinding and pumping of ore, you need Earth Moving machinery, and lots of it. That means lots of diesel. Mining without diesel is a myth, as is farming with diesel, as is making new steel from the ore in the earth. Just look at the energy used to make steel from ore!

[theluckycountry]

This is taken from a peakoil topic referenced below.
Steel, quality structural steel is the key to modern industry. The nub of the topic is that due to copper contamination all the recycled steel will be useless by 2050 and new steel will have to made from virgin iron ore, using fossil fuels. This may sound like bad news, but that depends of which country you live in.


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Steel recycling is unsustainable
https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.7b00997#
Steel is the world’s most recycled material, with end-of-life recovery rate estimates as high as 90%. (1) Making steel from scrap in an Electric Arc Furnace (EAF) leads to around one-third the greenhouse gas emissions associated with steelmaking from ore. (2) As steel production accounts for approximately 25% of industrial emissions, (3) further reliance on recycling to supply demanded products is key to climate change mitigation. (4)
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Oda et al. (5) show that steel recycling has historically been constrained by the availability of scrap. Using a dynamic stock model, Pauliuk et al. (6) find that by 2050 the global supply of end-of-life scrap will triple from current volumes. From this expanding volume of scrap, Allwood (7) argues that all projected future growth in demand for steel could be met by recycling, but it is unknown whether the secondary route can supply the demanded quality requirements.

End-of-life steel scrap is often contaminated with other metals. If these cannot be extracted from the EAF melt, then they are known as “tramp elements.” Nakajima et al. (8) identify the key tramp elements in steel recycling by thermodynamic analysis, of which copper and tin are most important. Concentrations of copper over 0.1 wt % cause hot shortness, a phenomenon leading to surface cracking in hot rolling and forming. Tin exacerbates hot shortness, even at concentrations as low as 0.04 wt %. Rod et al. (9) review the mechanism of hot shortness, which is now well understood.

Copper is pervasive in end-of-life scrap, originating mostly from copper wires and motors in automobiles, appliances, and machinery that attach to steel during shredding. (10) Tin contamination originates from packaging tinplate, which makes up a much smaller (<1%) portion of the scrap stream, (11) and can be isolated and treated more readily prior to melting. The focus of this paper is therefore on copper, as it is currently the main barrier to producing high quality steel from recycled scrap.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kublikhan', 'Y')ou must have only skimmed what I posted because it directly contradicts what you just said.

[ralfy]

There's also peak mining. That means any transition will have to deal with switching to lower energy returns plus achieve increasing production (because industries are mostly for-profit) plus deal with diminishing returns:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFyTSiCXWEE

[kublikhan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'T')his is taken from a peakoil topic referenced below.
Steel, quality structural steel is the key to modern industry. The nub of the topic is that due to copper contamination all the recycled steel will be useless by 2050 and new steel will have to made from virgin iron ore, using fossil fuels. This may sound like bad news, but that depends of which country you live in.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kublikhan', 'O')h I forgot, you have this strange aversion to anything hybrid. Ok if you want to only look at BEV equipment we can do that.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ralfy', 'T')here's also peak mining. That means any transition will have to deal with switching to lower energy returns plus achieve increasing production (because industries are mostly for-profit) plus deal with diminishing returns:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFyTSiCXWEE

[theluckycountry]

It's all bad news, all the truth is finally coming out as it always does eventually. You have two camps basically. The companies trying to sell the shit (Always good news). And the realists telling it how it is.

From GE to Siemens, the wind energy industry hopes billions in losses are about to end
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/04/17/from-ge ... o-end.html

Why wind and solar power are running out of juice
https://nypost.com/2023/09/02/why-the-p ... o-deliver/

Analysis: Wind power industry drifts off course
https://www.reuters.com/sustainability/ ... 023-09-28/





The Inadequacy of Wind Power
https://www.thegwpf.org/content/uploads ... energy.pdf

The plan dramatically to cut the combustion of fossil fuels was
accepted at the 2015 Paris Conference. The instinctive
reaction around the world has been to revert to ‘renewables’, the
sources of energy delivered intermittently by the power of
the Sun. Unfortunately this power, attenuated by the huge
distance that it must travel to reach the Earth, is extremely
weak. That is why, before the advent of the Industrial Revolution,
it was unable to provide the energy to sustain even a
small global population with an acceptable standard of living.

Today, modern technology is deployed to harvest these
weak sources of energy. Vast ‘farms’ that monopolise the
natural environment are built, to the detriment of other creatures.
Developments are made regardless of the damage wrought.
Hydro-electric schemes, enormous turbines and square miles
of solar panels are constructed, despite being unreliable and
ineffective; even unnecessary...

In particular, the generation of electricity by wind tells a
disappointing story. The political enthusiasm and the investor
hype are not supported by the evidence, even for offshore
wind, which can be deployed out of sight of the infamous My
Back Yard. What does such evidence actually say?

That the wind fluctuates is common knowledge. But
these fluctuations are grossly magnified to an extent that is
not immediately obvious and has nothing to do with the
technology of the wind turbine. The energy of the wind is that
of the moving air, and, as every student knows, such energy...

[mousepad]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', '
')That the wind fluctuates is common knowledge. But
these fluctuations are grossly magnified to an extent that is
not immediately obvious...

[kublikhan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'N')o! I've wasted enough time on this BS. And don't try to spin all that mining equipment as Hybrid either, Cat is just using that word to greenwash it's products. We all know what a hybrid is, it has both an oil powered engine and a battery electric component, a gimmick basically, an inner city yuppies car. All that gear you referenced is powered by Diesel engines period! Just like diesel electric trains. The use the electric component, as I pointed out, is just to stabilize the drive train.

I don't care what your links claim as EV mining equipment, I have waded through enough falsehood, it will be greenwash or niche mining plant and nothing substantial. All mining of consequence uses diesel equipment and will continue to. Your promotions of a renewable "Everything" have sailed I am afraid. All that is left is marketing by corporations trying to cash in on the Green dollar.

[kublikhan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'I')t's all bad news, all the truth is finally coming out as it always does eventually. You have two camps basically. The companies trying to sell the shit (Always good news). And the realists telling it how it is.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mousepad', '
')
Yes. I don't think renewables will be able to support the 24/7 power on-demand life we are living now. Life will become more like planning your activities around availability of power. Wind is going strong tonite? Sweet, let's watch some TV.

[theluckycountry]

Catastrophic Failures: 300 Tonne Wind Turbines Keep On Collapsing in Terrifying Fashion

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'F')ebruary 12, 2023
Wind industry spin doctors are struggling to explain away a troubling uptick in catastrophic and terrifying wind turbine collapses. Gravity is not kind to these 300-tonne monsters; hundreds of them have collapsed around the world and the rate of collapses appears to be increasing, over time.

Over the last few years, there have been hundreds of ‘structural failures’ – where either 10-15 tonne blades are shredded or flung in all directions; or their 90-100m towers implode, unceremoniously delivering the 80-100 tonne nacelle to terra firma, with exhilarating effect.

Then there are the hours-long pyrotechnic displays when these things self-immolate; exploding into balls of flame and toxic smoke and sending a shower of molten metal and over 1,000 litres of flaming gear oil, hydraulic fluid (see our post here) and burning plastic composites earthwards. By the way, wind turbine fires are ten times more common than the wind industry and its parasites claim