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John Walling Heirs

What's on your mind?
General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Postby cspchief » Sat 23 Jul 2005, 05:52:14

:shock: I had no idea that people on this string actually believe this is a fabricated lawsuit...is that really the case? Or did I read that reply wrong? There are countless documents from the courts in Texas for the initial filings of this case and the appeals.

I was actually shocked when I did a recent search for these documents and could not find them. I remember several years ago I was able to read the courts decision online and now my search results in nothing but the trash these guys are talking about.

Oh well, I would love to provide more "proof" but I just don't see the point...if you don't want a share in the suit...don't buy one! The evidence I have seen I cannot talk about in this forum. If you really want to hear it, see it and understand it then you have to take the leap and join the association...but I understand how difficult that is when you really believe it is a scam...however, I think that makes it easier for you to pass it up...I am sure you have heard of sour grapes?

Anyway, It appears that our great news of a "real" lawsuit that has real history and a real potential (not guaranteed) but potential of taking back from the oil companies what they took from our family falls on deaf ears. And that's okay because we really do not just want financial support to attack these large companies but we really need public support...the reality is that we cannot expect everyone to be able to wrap their arms around this and believe it.

But to believe that this is NOT a real case that has been filed in the courts is crazy....sure, the files are not readily accessible on the net anymore but go to the Texas courts and court of appeals and look up Bea Thedford vs Unocal and you WILL find the documents. You just will NOT know the whole story.

Good day! 8O
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Postby bobaloo » Sat 23 Jul 2005, 13:48:15

Here's the actual facts of this case if anyone's still interested. Used my google mojo and found a legal article written by a good oil and gas attorney laying out the facts. If the legalese makes your head hurt I've written a summary at the end.

***********************************************************

"ADVERSE POSSESSION AGAINST COTENANTS

Talk about heirs coming out of the woodpile! Unocal, Exxon, and others were recently sued by the heirs of an original grantee of the patent of land which encompassed all of a lucrative oil field. The case, Thedford v. Union Oil Company of California, 3 S.W.3d 609 (Tex. App.--Dallas 1999), is a good review of Texas law on adverse possession against cotenants.

In 1838, John Walling received one league andone labor of land. Walling died testate, devising 320 acres to each of nine children from his first marriage, and the remaining 2,862 acres (the Walling Survey) to his second wife and their two children, Richard and William. When the second wife died, the entire 2,862 acres went to Richard and William. William died intestate, having never married nor had children. Richard then conveyed the entire 2,862 acres to R.W. Berry, by aduly recorded deed. Later, the land was sold in parcels to various parties. In 1927, portions of the land were leased for oil and gas,leading to the discovery of the oil field.

The plaintiffs were over 100 individuals who claimed to be heirs of the children from John Walling's first marriage. Since, under the laws of intestacy, each of the half-siblngs inherited fractional interests from William, but only the full sibling, Richard, conveyed to Berry, the plaintiffs claimed ownership of substantial undivided, unleased interests in the WallingSurvey. They argued that the time period for adverse possession had never commenced running against them, since, under Texas case law, a cotenant may not adversely possess against another cotenant unless it clearly appears he has repudiated the title of his cotenant and is holding adversely to it. Notice of such repudiation must be clear,
unequivocal, and unmistakable. The heirs argued that the deed was insufficient to repudiate their ancestors' title.

Significantly, the deed to Berry purported to convey the entire property, not just William's interest. The property was then occupied by strangers to the Wallingfamily. The court, following existing Texas case law, noted that "(w)hen a party obtains title to property from one cotenant through an instrument purporting to convey the entire title..., such conveyance constitutes ouster ... of the nonparticipating cotenant, especially when the grantee is a stranger tothe cotenants." Quoting theTexas Supreme Court, the court noted the "vast difference between the noticeof adverse claim conveyed by the presence of a stranger in possession and thatof a cotenant in possession." The court affirmed a summary judgment in favor of Unocal and the other defendants based on adverse possession.

In Louisiana, this case would have the same end result. Possession by one co-owner in Louisiana is generally considered as being exercised on behalf of all co-owners. Civil Code Art. 3478, however, provides that a co-owner "may commence to prescribe when he demonstrates by overt and unambiguous acts sufficient to give notice to his co-owner that he intends to possess the property for himself. The acquisition and recordation of a title [by] a person other than a co-owner thus may mark the commencement of prescription.� A recorded deed is only one example of an overt act sufficient to give notice. Franks Petroleum, Inc. v. Babineaux, 446 So.2d 862 (La. App. 2 Cir. 1984).

Mr. Byrd, a former landman, is licensed inTexas and Louisiana,and, in Texas, is Board Certified inOil,
Gas & Mineral Law. He is with the Houston office of Cotton, Bledsoe, Tighe & Dawson."
******************************** END QUOTE

To simplify, Mr. Walling left land to his first wife, and land to his second wife. When the second wife died, all her land went to her two sons, Richard and William. William died, without a will or heirs, and Richard took over all his land. Later, Richard sold all the land to a Mr. Berry, who subsequently ended up breaking up the land into smaller parcels and selling it off to various buyers.

Now here's the basis for the "current" lawsuit. The legal argument is that the heirs of Walling's FIRST wife were by Texas law entitled to a small portion of William's land, because he died without a will and without heirs. So, many years later, they file a lawsuit against people god knows how far down the chain of subsequent purchasers and demand their rights to "their" land. The court threw the case out via summary judgment, which means they never even got to trial, the court read the submitted brief and in effect said "even if you prove all your claims at trial you're still going to lose, there's no sense wasting time at trial." This is extremely rare, and tells a great deal about the value of their argument.

Think about it, someonne shows up and files a lawsuit against you saying that 100 years ago their great grandfather was entitled to an interest in your property and now they want it back. How likely do you think it is the law or a court will support that action?

Note that the citation to the case appears in the article, Thedford v. Union Oil Company of California, 3 S.W.3d 609 (Tex. App.--Dallas 1999), go to any law library at a county courthouse and they can find that for you and read it for yourself. For some reason I pissed away most of an hour on a beautiful Saturday morning doing this to keep someone from getting ripped off, because I HATE con artists, so please do the reasearch before throwing your money away.

If anyone doubts the authenticity here's the google cache link "http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:T3KpnGCaRUcJ:www.cbtd.com/news/june.pdf+Thedford+v+Unocal&hl=en&client=safari"
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Well, Now that THAT is settled...

Postby cspchief » Sat 23 Jul 2005, 16:43:40

:wink: I respect your opinion, however, at least we ALL now believe there really is a legal action being sought and this is not a ficticious act as some would try to convince you.

Thank you for finding that document, there is more out there...I have it in hard copy. It is fascinating to read and a lesson in law. Perhaps if the suit gets presented completely this time there will be a different result...but lets not bore you with all that. Anyway, thanks for finding that I think it adds at least a little more credibility to both sides of the argument.
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Postby anglgrl » Mon 25 Jul 2005, 22:06:32

So tell me, i've read about this bea thedford and even done some studying up on her and this lawsuit and i'm curious why there is no mention of the lawsuit pending against her in Oklahoma with alot of people that say she frauded them. I think the lead guy is that chucky bivens. why no mention of him here?
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Re: walling heirs

Postby WebHubbleTelescope » Mon 25 Jul 2005, 23:32:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('resqueen', '
')3-Boiling, bless your little heart. I know I should ignore these people that have a hard time pouring a boot out, (EVEN WITH INSTUCTIONS) but you know this is getting to be more fun than a family reunion. Thank you I did need that.

4-cschief thank you dear, you are most eloquent. Hang in here with me and boiling and da grizz, please.


Notice the condescending sweetness in the tone. Only one person talks like that on this message board....

All these posts are from BiGG. Guaranteed.
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Postby OilsNotWell » Mon 25 Jul 2005, 23:34:29

ok, I'll bite, another first-poster angel-girl..who knows...

What can one say to this?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')N THE DISTRICT COURT IN AND FOR OKLAHOMA COUNTY, OKLAHOMA
Charles L Bivens Jr,;
JANET L. BIVENS; SCOTT E. BIVENS;
JOSEPH K BIVENS; CRAIG O.
PARHAM; PATTY D. PARHAM;
KEITH A. BURGHART; LOUISE M.
BURGHART; RICHARD A KINDER;
BRADLEY S. GARNER; MARIE L
KERR; DONALD R. BOGGES;
NANCY J BOGGES; BOBBY G
BOGGES; LINDA D. BOGGES;
PATRICK H. PARKER; PHILLIP D.
PARKER; PATRICIA H. PARKER;
PAUL D. PARKER; PHOEBE D. PARKER;
THOMAS J. HARRIDGE;
AND RONALD E. PERRY,
PlaintiffS,

v.

Beatrice Thedford, INDIVIDUALLY,
AND DOING BUSINESS AS JOHN WALLING
HEIRS AND JOHN WALLING HEIRS
COORDINATING COMMITTEE,
Defendant.

No. CJ-2003-7615
(Civil relief more than $10,000)
Filed: 09/09/2003

Judge: Dixon, Bryan C.

Issues
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For cases filed before 1/1/2000, ancillary issues may not appear except in the docket.


Issue # 1.
Count as filed: FRAUD, FRAUD, in violation of FRAUD O.S. FRAUD Issue Filed: 09/09/2003

which can be read in more detail by searching here:
OCSN Case Records


It looks to be in the middle of litigation, so I guess we'll just have to let the wheels of justice turn and see how it turns out.
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Postby OilsNotWell » Mon 25 Jul 2005, 23:41:53

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')ebHubbleTelescope Posted: 2005-07-25, 20:32:05 Post subject: Re: walling heirs

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

resqueen wrote:

3-Boiling, bless your little heart. I know I should ignore these people that have a hard time pouring a boot out, (EVEN WITH INSTUCTIONS) but you know this is getting to be more fun than a family reunion. Thank you I did need that.

4-cschief thank you dear, you are most eloquent. Hang in here with me and boiling and da grizz, please.



Notice the condescending sweetness in the tone. Only one person talks like that on this message board....

All these posts are from BiGG. Guaranteed.


You know, that might be an interesting possibility...

But I see there are no more posts after 7/19 for BigG..just like DriveElectric...(who was, BTW, I heard, aka JayHMorrison)...strange, huh?
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Postby WebHubbleTelescope » Mon 25 Jul 2005, 23:51:31

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilsNotWell', '
')But I see there are no more posts after 7/19 for BigG..just like DriveElectric...(who was, BTW, I heard, aka JayHMorrison)...strange, huh?


Oh yea, the one and many J-Mo. He first left in a huff threatening to sue everyone on the board.

Nice investigatin' BTW
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Postby OilsNotWell » Mon 25 Jul 2005, 23:56:22

but this is strange...the fact that resqueen says:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')8-Chucky Bivens listen to this man speak. It is unbelievable.


Tells me that he has heard him speak before...someone who's either seen the video that they sell on the website (and who would buy that? A: Someone perhaps part of the JWHCC thing), or worked with, or is part of the lawsuit, perhaps?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '9')-Our Lawyer, Tony is a prince of a man. His picture does not do him justice.


"OUR" lawyer? Would that be for the JWHCC then? Also shows that the poster has met him in person if "the picture does not do him justice"

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '1')0-In my opinion it is unwise to speak ill of Bea Thedford or her family....How about death threats??????had any of those lately ONW?


Sounds like pretty threatening language resqueen...I perceived those words as terroristic threats, by the way...perhaps you'd care to clarify them?
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Postby OilsNotWell » Tue 26 Jul 2005, 00:39:57

The following is an example of what I believe is known as 'the law of unintended consequences':

We begin our story with many folks, including me, on this board, who don't have a clue who or what the John Walling Heirs Coordinating Committee is, but here's the first post, in what may have been a PR exercise:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'D')aGrizz
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Posted: 2005-03-23, 18:32:47 Post subject: John Walling Heirs (was OIL PRICES)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Are rising oil prices really the result of a group called the Walling Heirs getting ready to take a few of the MAJOR OIL companies back to TEXAS court?? Or is it really from OPEC?? Did anyone hear of this lawsuit?? I hear it's gonna be HUGE!!....


But then, time goes by...a few more posts...a few more responses...most people ignore it...still some more attention is gathered...then a suggestion that it may not be what it's supposed...it still could have been left alone and the thread would have died...BUT NO. Seems some folks wanted to press the case. So now we see a bit more of the bigger picture...

Now guess what happens if one googles "walling heirs"?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=walling+heirs

Yup! That's right! #3 result:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')eak Oil News and Message Boards >> Forums >> Current Events ...
3) A lawsuit alleging fraud against Beatrice Thedford dba Walling Heirs Assoc.
was initiated, and a default judgment was issued against her, and it seems it ...
www.peakoil.com/fortopic6196-75.html - 106k - Cached - Similar pages
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Postby anglgrl » Tue 26 Jul 2005, 02:03:27

you're right ONW, that is exactly how I found this sight was by googling "walling heirs". It seems as though this forum is split, some for the family, some thinking the family is taking everyone for a ride. I haven't seen any hard evidence myself, as to the whole lawsuit thing. Everything shown here has been found through public records. Does anyone out there have any real proof of this? Anywhere I could go to find proof WITHOUT having to pay 1200 dollars?
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Postby WebHubbleTelescope » Tue 26 Jul 2005, 02:09:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilsNotWell', '
')Now guess what happens if one googles "walling heirs"?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=walling+heirs

Yup! That's right! #3 result:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')eak Oil News and Message Boards >> Forums >> Current Events ...
3) A lawsuit alleging fraud against Beatrice Thedford dba Walling Heirs Assoc.
was initiated, and a default judgment was issued against her, and it seems it ...
www.peakoil.com/fortopic6196-75.html - 106k - Cached - Similar pages


Google embodies the Sixth Sense. I have a sneaking suspicion that it uses cookies as well to monitor your own navigation history. FWIW, I got #3 as well, but that frequently seems to happen with this board when I google.
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Postby OilsNotWell » Tue 26 Jul 2005, 03:16:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'y')ou're right ONW, that is exactly how I found this sight was by googling "walling heirs". It seems as though this forum is split, some for the family, some thinking the family is taking everyone for a ride. I haven't seen any hard evidence myself, as to the whole lawsuit thing. Everything shown here has been found through public records. Does anyone out there have any real proof of this? Anywhere I could go to find proof WITHOUT having to pay 1200 dollars?


Not sure what you mean here. Hard evidence of what lawsuit? Proof of what?

Is that what 'THEY' are telling you? That when you pay "$1,200" (your words) "THEY" will show you the real 'proof' of their lawsuit that supposedly 'just might' win BILLIONS against the oil companies? So once 'they' get you on the hook, you pay more money to find out even more 'proof', and perhaps an even greater % 'claim'..? Puh-leaze..

Honestly, and I mean this is the nicest, most sincerest way I can say this...either you are fairly naive (or letting greed get the better of you), or that you are somehow working an angle in this...

I think it might be good for all to remember that PT Barnum had a special quote that might be appropriate...

"There's a sucker born every minute"

Maybe this one, too: "A fool and his money are soon parted"

And, I would counter that I don't believe this board is even close to split on the issue...

Oh, and from my understanding, there are lots of hungry lawyers as well as large firms out there who would jump at a chance to sue deep-pocketed oil companies....if there was a chance in hell of it winning, or even if it didn't, put up enough of a legitimate argument to get paid to go away...(but be in mind, there are definitely risks for a lawyer or firm to be sanctioned for filing what may be viewed as a frivilous lawsuit) So what's with the need to collect payments for 'memberships' like passing the church plate? (It seems as if their response would be that the big bad oil cos control all the big firms, courts, legislature, govt. in TX, OK, wherever)..but I don't buy the fact that you could get a firm outside of the area who'd take on the case if it was strong enough...Jeez Louise...if there were a whole lot case pleadings to refer to (and I'm not saying there isn't)...IT WOULDN'T BE SECRET...It's filed in open court (unless it really was a secret case, like natl security, stuff like that)
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Postby MD » Tue 26 Jul 2005, 08:08:09

This thread has great entertainment value along with reminding us just how many wackos wander cyberspace(remember that word? where did it go?)
Stop filling dumpsters, as much as you possibly can, and everything will get better.

Just think it through.
It's not hard to do.
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Postby fletch961 » Tue 26 Jul 2005, 11:35:53

cspchief wrote:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'i')f we do not prevail then every one walks away and at least we tried to right a wrong. If Bea walks away with a million in her pocket then so be it...good luck to her...


Seems to me that Bea's own PR dept is admitting that she is pocketing money that is supposed to be going to this "bonafide" (frivolous} lawsuit. Oh there's a lawsuit alright-she'll lose. She'll tell her members to keep sending in money so she can keep up the charade. Meanwhile, her bank account will get nice and fat.
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Postby Boiling » Fri 29 Jul 2005, 19:27:45

Just in case any of you are in doubt as to what "Adverse Possession" means, in layman's terms it is "Squatting". In other words, someone wants your property and they take it.

Now I realize some people on here feels that we should all think how horrible those Walling people are for trying to get what is rightfully theirs and to stand up against those "helpless rich Oil Corporations", but I for one am for the underdog. That family got screwed out of what was theirs by law and some of you are condemming them for trying to fight for their rights.

Some have said here that they knew how they would feel if someone came after property that was in their family which was ill gotten 100 years ago. Ok, how would you feel if you inherited rights to a massive oil field but you could not have what was by law yours due to "Squatters"? Two way street I would say. Like the poster said earlier, there are two sides to this story.

Another thing, you might check into Texas Laws about "Statue of Limitations" regarding mineral rights. If I understand correctly, there is none.

At any rate, I wish the Walling's all the best and great success in winning what is legally theirs.
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Postby And_Justice_For_All » Wed 10 Aug 2005, 22:57:03

It seems that the Walling Family has posted the agreement with the Oklahoma State Security Office. It would appear that all this clever investigative work missed a few important details. They have alwsy said that they had an agreement. Why woldn't the SEC post the agreement on their sight? At least those of us who are wondering can now see both sides of the story instead of just the heavy handed ones on this board.

I believe those that condem them the most have the most to loose. That is just my opinion since everyone else's is flying around here. Could it be that it really is a legit lawsuit? Could it be that there really is a lot of money in it? Could it be that some of you here are threatened by these people? If they have a legal right to do it, they should do it. If they don't the judge will see they get whats coming to them. None of us should try to try this case here like some judge and jury. WHy not wait to see the outcome and then discuss it? There sure is a lot of venomous statements here. I guess I'd be concerned if I were about to loose my lease on minerals to some family too.

Any thoughts? Or am I the only one here that thinks this is slanted to one side?
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Postby And_Justice_For_All » Wed 10 Aug 2005, 22:57:52

It seems that the Walling Family has posted the agreement with the Oklahoma State Security Office. I saw it in the download button on their website. It would appear that all this clever investigative work missed a few important details. They have alwsy said that they had an agreement. Why woldn't the SEC post the agreement on their sight? At least those of us who are wondering can now see both sides of the story instead of just the heavy handed ones on this board.

I believe those that condem them the most have the most to loose. That is just my opinion since everyone else's is flying around here. Could it be that it really is a legit lawsuit? Could it be that there really is a lot of money in it? Could it be that some of you here are threatened by these people? If they have a legal right to do it, they should do it. If they don't the judge will see they get whats coming to them. None of us should try to try this case here like some judge and jury. WHy not wait to see the outcome and then discuss it? There sure is a lot of venomous statements here. I guess I'd be concerned if I were about to loose my lease on minerals to some family too.

Any thoughts? Or am I the only one here that thinks this is slanted to one side?
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Walling Heirs update

Postby aahala » Mon 10 Oct 2005, 23:34:13

This summer we had a long thread about a group that claimed they had
been flim flammed out of oil money, going back to a Texas land transaction
in the mid 1850's and were going to sue the oil companies.

Some of us believed the leader of the group was flim flamming the
members themselves. Bingo!

http://www.wallingheirs.net/

Then click the link on the left "What's new".
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Re: Walling Heirs update

Postby OilsNotWell » Tue 11 Oct 2005, 01:50:25

Well, well, well! :wink: But, of course, as they say, their allegations are unproven...

For some truly entertaining reading, read the original thread in its entirety...

peakoil.com Walling Heirs Thread

Something still smells about the whole deal in my opinion...strange, very strange.

Oh well.
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