[KaiserJeep]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Outcast_Searcher', '-')snip-

Two things occured to me:

1). If I want to pass and want a lower gear, I don't have to mash on the gas to get the car to downshift. I can just tap on the downshift paddle, and then pass, and then tap on the upshift paddle. Should save a little gas (I think -- I haven't tested that, as I don't pass that often).

[Shaved Monkey]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AdamB', '
')We are soft, but on the bright side, peak oil apocalypse hasn't been do bad that we can't drive around the country examining its horrifying effects, counting the cranes in the big cities, checking out the help wanted signs in various towns, observing the lack of breadlines or absence of rolling blackouts, making sure that cheap and plentiful fuel caused by peak oil is still available, that kind of stuff.

[SeaGypsy]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KaiserJeep', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Outcast_Searcher', '-')snip-

Two things occured to me:

1). If I want to pass and want a lower gear, I don't have to mash on the gas to get the car to downshift. I can just tap on the downshift paddle, and then pass, and then tap on the upshift paddle. Should save a little gas (I think -- I haven't tested that, as I don't pass that often).

[AdamB]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Shaved Monkey', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AdamB', '
')We are soft, but on the bright side, peak oil apocalypse hasn't been do bad that we can't drive around the country examining its horrifying effects, counting the cranes in the big cities, checking out the help wanted signs in various towns, observing the lack of breadlines or absence of rolling blackouts, making sure that cheap and plentiful fuel caused by peak oil is still available, that kind of stuff.

[Shaved Monkey]

Its the year of the alternative truths

[Outcast_Searcher]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KaiserJeep', '
')The fact that you are thinking about optimizing performance via gear shifting indicates that you should be driving a manual transmission. Such gearboxes are cheaper to buy, have cheaper routine and repair service costs, and higher reliability - as long as the operator doesn't make a mistake that damages the gearbox.

[SeaGypsy]

MD is wrong, KJ is right. Ask any auto gearbox mechanic.

[Revi]

Some of the best mileage is with automatic transmissions nowadays. The prius is an example. I drive my wife's Honda Fit a lot and I find that the cruise control helps with mileage. It also helps me not to get tickets!

I think the figure for an average car in the US is now around $9000 a year. That includes paying for it, etc.

It's hard for a lot of people to scrape that much up nowadays, and I have noticed that a lot of younger people are living without cars. They take a taxi, walk, etc.

The age of the individual car is coming to an end soon enough. We aren't going to like it, but we don't seem to be adapting to the demise very well. I would like to see more mass transit options even in small towns.

[SeaGypsy]

Obviously not paying attention- the argument against automatic transmission is about long term total cost, which will always come out cheaper for a well driven manual.

[yellowcanoe]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SeaGypsy', 'O')bviously not paying attention- the argument against automatic transmission is about long term total cost, which will always come out cheaper for a well driven manual.

[jedrider]

Our Toyota Sienna Van, our first automatic actually, has never had a transmission problem with 120K miles now. We've taken it everywhere, terrain wise.

Manuals usually require a new clutch at 90K miles.

However, if a problem did ever occur on an automatic, I presume it is a very big expense.

[KaiserJeep]

Periodic clutch replacement depends more than anything else on driver habits. I would not be surprised if my 2003 Jeep Wrangler requires a clutch replacement at 100,000 miles, for example. That is because even though I prefer manual transmissions, I drive that Jeep in extreme offroad conditions, using the clutch as a manual traction control:

As for the relative gas mileage, today's automatics typically offer more gears and a higher overdrive ratio than do manual transmissions, and have "locking torque converters" that end the slippage that formerly compromised an automatic in the highest cruising gear - the autos are the newly crowned kings of maximum gas mileage. It takes a really expert driver with a manual, driving in just the right variable slope terrain, to best an auto transmission in efficiency.

Not so long ago (2013), on a trip to Moab UT I achieved 23 mpg, in a heavy square-shaped modified vehicle that was in stock form rated 15 mpg city, 19 mpg highway. There is no secret, the 33.1" tires I had fitted in place of the original 30.7" factory tires had effectively "geared up" the 5th or overdrive gear from 0.78:1 to 0.72:1 (0.78 x 30.7/33.1). My highest mileage tank ever was produced by accelerating gradually, then maintaining a constant speed in the early morning on a level straight desert highway, using the cruise control. The Jeep was heavily loaded with camping gear and I did use the A/C when the ambient air climbed above the 80 degree mark.

Yes, I admit engineers are obsessed with measurements and numbers.

[evilgenius]

I think automatics are better for off road. They creep over things better. Being lazy, I enjoy the ease of an automatic on the open road, but prefer a stick. I can usually get a couple miles per gallon more with a stick than what the car was rated at. I like that better than the ease of driving an auto in traffic. Automatics get the advertised mpg. The best reason for downshifting with a manual transmission is not to slow the car down with the engine but to be in a gear that you can accelerate with should you run into a problem that requires picking up speed. I do use the engine to slow down, but you can't forget about the brake. I think the trick is to be smooth about it, not forceful. You don't want to jam it down a gear. You want to shift into the lower gear after you've either braked first or let off on the gas and slowed some. You use the engine to finish the job, not to do the job. I think KJ is right about driver habits making all the difference. If you have the feel for it you can drive a manual transmission for a very long time without ever having to do any work on it, except change the fluids. Honestly, I've had more trouble with the synchros going out on a manual transmission than ever needing a clutch. I think that's been because the people who owned the car before I did didn't take very good care of it. I think a lot of people fail on the routine maintenance front when it comes to transmissions, and this is worse for the car when done with an automatic. Bad synchros are annoying when trying to go fast, but what can happen with a poorly maintained automatic can be undriveable. If I buy a used car and don't know what kind of maintenance was done I will change the fluids in the transmission, and the filter if it was an automatic. Shops these days want you to use their machine that sucks the fluid out and replaces it. They don't change the filters anymore. I'd rather change the filter if I don't know if it's ever been done. If I've changed it before then that kind of shop service is ok. It's more expensive than you need to pay, however. People don't realize it, but automatic transmission fluid is cheap compared to the price of a shop service. You can change the fluid, run the car for a little while, and then change the fluid again far more cheaply than going to a shop.

[KaiserJeep]

I noted when I was teaching offroad driving at the local 4x4 club that new drivers improved faster with an automatic. It simply demands more skill to drive off-road with a manual transmission. Note however that the most challenging terrain and the most extreme angles are difficult with an automatic, because when you uncover the fluid pickup in the transmission sump, it sucks air and totally loses drive. That same 4x4 club has developed a series of mods for the Jeep Wrangler's auto transmission, and will probably end up manufacturing a new transmission sump with modified baffles and new fluid pickups some day.

Until then, they have been making do by overfilling the transmissions. This risks blowing tranny fluid past some seals. There are a couple of obstacles at the nearby Hollister Hills SVRA where you can tell from a quarter mile away that a Jeep has an automatic, when the overfilled transmission drips out the dipstick tube onto a hot exhaust, causing a puff of white smoke from underneath the Jeep.

[evilgenius]

I've always been very practical about 4 wheeling. I do it to get to places in the back country that I want to visit. I'm usually prospecting and just want to check out a place. The thrill of getting there doesn't appeal as much to me. As such, my ventures have usually been on old logging roads that have experienced erosion. I'm not into the extreme stuff, so it didn't occur to me to think about how useful a standard tranny might be. I think you are right about them being better for extreme off roading. To tell you the truth, because I prefer a standard over an automatic for every day driving most of my off roading has been done with a standard tranny.

[AdamB]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Revi', 'S')ome of the best mileage is with automatic transmissions nowadays. The prius is an example. I drive my wife's Honda Fit a lot and I find that the cruise control helps with mileage. It also helps me not to get tickets!

[AdamB]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KaiserJeep', '
')Yes, I admit engineers are obsessed with measurements and numbers.

[KaiserJeep]

The Chevy Bolt EV has been shipping for a few weeks now:

Specifications:

MPGe: 128 highway, 110 city
0-60 mph: 6.5 sec
Top Speed: 93 mph
HP: 200 hp
Range: 283 mi EPA, or 175 mi at 75 mph cruise.

Car and Driver magazine ranked it first in class:

1. Chevrolet Bolt EV
2. Volkswagen e-Golf
3. BMW i3
4. Ford Focus Electric
5. Nissan Leaf
6. Kia Soul EV
7. Mercedes-Benz B-class Electric Drive
8. Smart Fortwo Electric Drive
9. Hyundai Tucson Fuel Cell
10. Toyota Mirai
11. Fiat 500E
12. Mitsubishi i-MiEV

I was looking forward to this one, but color me disappointed. The seats in it are fairly narrow and pinched my butt. The interior is a mix of textured plastics that give a very contemporary feel. Overall, although it drove comfortably and competently, my impression was it was a first car for teenagers.

[AdamB]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KaiserJeep', 'T')he Chevy Bolt EV has been shipping for a few weeks now:

Specifications:

MPGe: 128 highway, 110 city
0-60 mph: 6.5 sec
Top Speed: 93 mph
HP: 200 hp
Range: 283 mi EPA, or 175 mi at 75 mph cruise.

Car and Driver magazine ranked it first in class:

1. Chevrolet Bolt EV
2. Volkswagen e-Golf
3. BMW i3
4. Ford Focus Electric
5. Nissan Leaf
6. Kia Soul EV
7. Mercedes-Benz B-class Electric Drive
8. Smart Fortwo Electric Drive
9. Hyundai Tucson Fuel Cell
10. Toyota Mirai
11. Fiat 500E
12. Mitsubishi i-MiEV

I was looking forward to this one, but color me disappointed. The seats in it are fairly narrow and pinched my butt. The interior is a mix of textured plastics that give a very contemporary feel. Overall, although it drove comfortably and competently, my impression was it was a first car for teenagers.

[KaiserJeep]

The Chevy Bolt battery is liquid cooled and in fact is part of the floor structure of the vehicle, a so-called "stressed member". It uses nickle-doped flat plastic pouch lithium batteries, as opposed to the cylindrical cells used by Tesla and other manufacturers. I have not seen any more details than this, other than isolated battery pack images which showed no external cooling plumbing. The electrical arrangement is 3 parallel strings of 96 cells in series.

Cooling might be as simple as a molded heatsink on the bottom of the battery pack, and a small circulator pump inside the battery. Or even passive circulation using "heat pipes" containing refrigerants in partial vacuum.