[ralfy]

Slow crash, fast crash, it's still a crash. We can even have both: a painful, slow crash punctuated by fast crashes.

The most important points to consider:

What we have is a global economy where middle class conveniences involve linkages, extensive supply chains, and dependence on increasing consumption to keep income levels and returns on investment propped up. All of the "solutions" given to deal with that, including "technology" and "efficiency," leads to the need for more productivity, and hence more consumption.

The energy and resources needed to maintain that arrangement are experiencing diminishing returns. Credit creation doesn't reverse that. It also leads to more financial volatility.

The result of energy and resource use include environmental damage on a significant scale and global warming. Those will amplify previous problems mentioned as well as others, including major increases in arms use and deployment, the spread of disease, etc.

The past has described these issues, and the present continues to do so. Given that, there is no "mausoleum to the doomer mindset." Just futile attempts to keep the dog and pony show going.

[ennui2]

There's nothing wrong with more of a vague sense of dread about limits to growth and a general pessimism about the future.

The doomer mindset I've been mocking is the one that insists on always pegging doom as "nigh". Always saying "8-ball, corner pocket". The series of bad calls ensconced in these halls is the mausoleum I'm talking about, one that is still seeing contributions with the ETP zealots.

[Ibon]

Take the time to read this article and reflect on how much of your social life, news, world view and entertainment has been channeled down this digital tube and how this affects the way you communicate and relate to others.


http://restoringmayberry.blogspot.co.uk ... scape.html

I see my friends grow increasingly militant for a cause – political, religious sexual – after those ideas suddenly became popular in online “communities.” I doubt that so many people came up with the same strained ideas at the same time; rather, people find meaning in being part of something, and they don’t find it in the real world anymore. And since they get all their information this way, they never have to hear news that doesn’t affect their own beliefs, talk to people from different bubbles than their own, or test their attitudes against reality.

[ennui2]

I see it more like this:

https://www.amazon.com/Shallows-What-In ... 0393339750

Haven't read it, and frankly, don't need to. I know it.

[AgentR11]

I think its because most people latch on to the "outrage" of whatever the issue is, or the shock factor on whatever article they read, and go from there to championing the related cause; as opposed to using that interest to dig down deep into something in order to gain information and perspective, and thereby come to the conclusion that there isn't a cause there worthy of championing, but rather a simple conflict of various interests that will resolve over time in the deliberative process of governance.

Not to say that there aren't causes worthy of Champions, but they aren't to be discovered in a brief 1000 word article in a newspaper dedicated to the sale of soap.

[ennui2]

Or an article dedicated to the sale of survival gear or paranoid conspiracy videos. You know, the sites that many posters here treat as authoritative.

[AgentR11]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ennui2', 'O')r an article dedicated to the sale of survival gear or paranoid conspiracy videos. You know, the sites that many posters here treat as authoritative.

[AgentR11]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ennui2', 'T')he doomer mindset I've been mocking is the one that insists on always pegging doom as "nigh". Always saying "8-ball, corner pocket". The series of bad calls ensconced in these halls is the mausoleum I'm talking about, one that is still seeing contributions with the ETP zealots.

[ralfy]

More than four decades of real data tracking forecasts:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... g-collapse

Given that, one has to figure out what will dramatically reverse availability of resources, as well as the effects of global warming (which was not factored in) on the same.

[ennui2]

Thought I'd bump this thread with an article every cranky doomer should read.

"How Complaining Rewires Your Brain for Negativity"

https://www.entrepreneur.com/article/28 ... gn=iScroll

[AdamB]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ralfy', 'S')low crash, fast crash, it's still a crash. We can even have both: a painful, slow crash punctuated by fast crashes.

[ennui2]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AdamB', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ralfy', 'S')low crash, fast crash, it's still a crash. We can even have both: a painful, slow crash punctuated by fast crashes.

[C8]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ennui2', 'T')hought I'd bump this thread with an article every cranky doomer should read.

"How Complaining Rewires Your Brain for Negativity"

https://www.entrepreneur.com/article/28 ... gn=iScroll

[ROCKMAN]

C8 - "...that is painting with a very broad brush". Of course. If one is "color" blind what choice does one have? IOW their world is all white...except where the slap some black paint on it. LOL.

[ralfy]

If one takes the idea of moving on literally, then one ultimately realizes that there is no other place to consider. Due to physical limitations and environmental damage, population and consumption have to go down eventually.

The phenomenon is clearly seen in oil production, which is a subset of resources used by the global population, and is experiencing diminishing returns, which is one outcome of physical limitations. The "solution" for that involves more credit creation to ensure continuous economic "growth" through other sources of energy combined with money-making schemes in service and finance sectors. Not only does that not reverse diminishing returns it even creates more problems, such as chronic financial crisis due to higher debt levels.

With that, there is no "mausoleum to the doomer mindset" but only one for fantasizing about unlimited economic output on a planet that won't allow it for painfully obvious reasons.

[ennui2]

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/believe- ... picks=true

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')when we have learned something, there’s this thing called belief perseverance. Having learned something, we tend to cling to that belief, even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

New information comes in all time, and the thing we ought to be thinking about doing is changing our beliefs as that new information comes in.
...
We need to take a step back, and realize that not everything we encounter is true. You don’t want to be gullibly accepting everything as true, but you don’t want to be cynically rejecting everything as false. You want to take your time to evaluate the information.

[davep]

Didn't most of the uber-doomers disappear years ago?

[Ibon]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('davep', 'D')idn't most of the uber-doomers disappear years ago?

[ennui2]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('davep', 'D')idn't most of the uber-doomers disappear years ago?