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Do you notice any effects from high gas prices in your town?

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Do you notice any effects from high gas prices in your town?

Postby jdmartin » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 01:17:59

This of course is completely unscientific, but I am curious about the effect of gas prices on everyone's locality. Mostly I'm guessing this post refers to the US, since Europe's gas prices have a hefty dose of tax and therefore don't increase as dramatically, but Europeans feel free to contribute. It would help to create a picture if you identify what your locality is.

Here in Northeast Tennessee I have noticed it big time, some ways obvious, others inferred. My wife works in the framing business and says that their suppliers have increased the costs of everything in big ways, with some things almost doubling in price. Because of this, they've had to raise prices dramatically, and so more people are opting for cheaper frames or saying "forget it" altogether.

I have also noticed the local retailers being unusually empty, almost as a whole. I was in Lowe's today and there were 4 or 5 cashiers standing around waiting for shoppers, unheard of for a Saturday afternoon. Went to dinner (O Charley's) and was seated immediately. This was at 6:15 - a year ago, there would have been an hour wait. There was literally no one in the restaurant. Curious about this, after dinner we went and drove by several other restaurants that are usually hour-plus waits. Didn't go in and check but they all had empty parking spaces in the lots and no one waiting outside to be seated. This has been the case for the past month or two, and usually summer is exploding around here with people eating out. Thinking about this, I've noticed the same thing over the past couple months in the bookstore and movie theater. Just driving down the main strip in the city this evening after eating dinner, there was an unusual dearth of cars on the road. This street, 7 lanes wide in spots, is usually backed up from light to light.

Again, completely unscientific, and no real data to back anything up, but I suspect the lack of activity I've noticed lately is definitely due to the price of gas eating up discretionary income. Friends of ours, that we usually eat out with once a week, have been suggesting cheaper places or suggesting lunch instead of dinner. They both work and are barely scraping by, and I am guessing they just don't have the money to eat out for regular dinner anymore.

I'm interested to hear about the rest of the country (and the world)...
After fueling up their cars, Twyman says they bowed their heads and asked God for cheaper gas.There was no immediate answer, but he says other motorists joined in and the service station owner didn't run them off.
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Lack Of Traffic

Postby AQIUS » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 01:33:01

hello yes ... I've noticed a very big change in the traffic patterns around here in North Highlands, CA. ( Sacramento)
While " temporarily " marooned in a decent apt in a bad area of town (due to nonstop house price increase for 5 years), there are a lot less gang bangers, kids, and other people just out cruising around. Every night there would be non-stop bass stereos thumping in n out of the complex entrance... all night ... now its quiet as a pindrop .. been that way for months now !!
Also the used ripoff ... er " secondary " car lots are bursting w. SUVS.
Hummers also ... I've been laughing my arse off at all the Hummers now at Buy Here-Pay Here places. Any used asian 4cyl truck is worth its weight in gold. No matter what year or condition.
Just a few results of definate peak oil effect/ drawdown.
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Postby katkinkate » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 03:07:49

I've not noticed much change here in Brisbane. I've been looking forward to it though. My bedroom is just 20 feet from the main highway into Brisbane and some nights it gets very difficult to get to sleep. A drop in traffic would be most welcome around 10.00 pm on weeknights.
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Postby lowem » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 03:50:21

I have a sort of counter-anecdote - the petrol (/gas) stations are having price wars here (again!). It was a 20% discount (I got an additional 1% with my Esso/Mobil card), then it went to 25% and I just heard that the national petroleum company SPC is practically giving it away with a 30% discount!!

But nobody expects them to carry on with this for long. The margins are getting very thin in the downstream petrol (/gas) retail market.
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Postby Rod_Cloutier » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 03:51:11

My wife works in a restraunt drive-thru part time. She has noticed more people complaining about waits in the drive-thru line due to the high price of gas. One person who had to wait 20 minutes in the drive-thru said the price of gas idling was more than the meal.

A fair bet drive-thru's will be a thing of the past when gasoline reaches into the $3.00- $5.00 range per litre here in Canada. People won't want to idle their cars!
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Postby jmacdaddio » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 04:19:37

Not really any effects to report in NJ yet. Still the same horrible traffic. Although I did see a security guard at a gas station on a busy highway - I wouldn't be surprised if he was there to deter a rising number of gasoline thefts.

I think the closest station to me is also the most expensive in the state - $2.33 for regular, $2.45 for midgrade, and $2.55 for premium (most other stations are about 10 cents lower).
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Postby jaws » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 04:49:45

Gas stations had to upgrade their signs with an extra digit. The lazy ones just stuff '10' into a one-digit slot. Other than that people just complain more and keep buying, which is why the price keeps going up.
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Postby chargrove » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 06:40:45

I've noticed a definite difference up here in Seattle, the retailers in particular. This past weekend I went on a hunt for some Coleman Illumisticks (for a party) at some big-box stores like Target and Fred Meyer, and _nobody_ had them, which was extremely surprising and rare. So I walked around these stores and looked around and noticed that they were out of a whole lot of items. Many shelves and racks looked like they were more empty than not, and the items that remained were some of the cheapest crap you could find that even people low on cash didn't want to bother with.

In some sense it was terrifying, and in another, absolutely cathartically awesome. Seeing so many shelves empty actually almost felt cleaning in some way, like the consumer culture filth slowly washing away.

When people who spend their entire lives consuming eventually run out of things to consume, they'll either finally wake up to what life really is supposed to be, or ultimately consume themselves. Either way, it's fine, and exactly what's supposed to happen.
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Postby killJOY » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 07:34:40

Here in my little town in the Northeast US, we're fighting over the construction of one of the largest filling stations in the area.

My neighbors continue to drive their enormous egos, I mean pickups.

Children still powerbrake around the corner in their parents' SUVs here at 3am.

In short, we're f*cked.

P.S. $this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')Seeing so many shelves empty actually almost felt cleaning in some way, like the consumer culture filth slowly washing away.


Not to be too bitchy, but what were you doing there in the first place?

I've been boycotting corporate america as best I can for twenty years now.
Peak oil = comet Kohoutek.
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Postby Claudia » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 08:43:06

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('chargrove', 'T')his past weekend I went on a hunt for some Coleman Illumisticks (for a party) at some big-box stores like Target and Fred Meyer, and _nobody_ had them, which was extremely surprising and rare. So I walked around these stores and looked around and noticed that they were out of a whole lot of items. Many shelves and racks looked like they were more empty than not, and the items that remained were some of the cheapest crap you could find that even people low on cash didn't want to bother with.


That was the fourth of July weekend! All kinds of stores sold out of all kinds of stuff. I haven't noticed any changes in stocking of items in stores, not long-term.

The only change here is that various town construction projects were in crisis this past year because of increased materials costs (including fuel). They're still moving ahead, though. People are also moving away from installing oil heating systems. I also have had to reimburse various workers (at my house) for high transportation costs.
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Postby MD » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 08:53:54

There does not appear to be much impact in my area, yet. I almost wish there were more visible effects, because it makes it look more like heading for a cliff instead of bumping down a rough slope.
Stop filling dumpsters, as much as you possibly can, and everything will get better.

Just think it through.
It's not hard to do.
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Postby thor » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 09:52:38

Although this concerns Europe, but ordinary supermarkets over here are seeing a huge demand for olive oil and vegetable oil because people can use this for their diesel cars. The price of vegie oil in the supermarket is cheaper than the diesel from petrol stations. It smells nice when you drive your car, much like a pop corn. :)
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Postby gnm » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 10:05:07

The used car lots around here are stuffed with SUVs and even Hummers. :lol:
I've seen a huge increase in prius and honda hybrids where I work. And the motocycle parking area is a lot fuller - also with shiny new scooters..

inexplicably empty shelves at a lot of stores for normally haevily stocked items - I think they are taking just in time shipping a little too seriously. Ive even had to order stuff which used to be stocked....
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Postby hotsacks » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 10:21:17

Food. Where it cost two of us $80 CAN a year ago for groceries,we're now paying $120 for pretty much the same items. It's odd and noteworthy that so much time and ink is spent on rising fuel costs while next to nothing is said about food. We've taken cheap food for granted for so long that increases go unnoticed. That will change if prices continue to rise as quickly.
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Postby whatpeak » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 10:29:06

I haven't noticed any obvious changes in San Diego since gas prices started rising again. Some gas stations have started to display the price of regular unleaded only. The other grades are left to your imagination.

We still have our annual migration of people driving from Arizona to vacation at the area beaches. I understand that it has been pretty hot in Phoenix. I suspect that the price of gas would have to get pretty high before the people from Arizona stop visiting here in the summer.

I heard that the Del Mar Fair has been well attended, but don't know what the other attractions like the Zoo or Sea World have experienced.

Conjestion on the freeways has been as bad as usual, but that may be due to the construction.
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Postby KiddieKorral » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 10:36:42

We've been having weird pricing, i.e. the gas stations aren't using the traditional 10-cent differences between grades. It's been 8-cent or 9-cent differences.

Attractions are still well-attended, to the best of my knowledge. However, I've noticed more people than usual at the zoo. Cheaper substitute for other attractions, possibly?
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Postby Leanan » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 10:51:07

I've noticed my grocery bill has gone up a lot, too. Usually in summer, it goes down, because of all the fresh produce available locally. Not this year. Even the produce that's in season is wicked expensive.

Still, food prices tend to be volatile. That may be why it's going unnoticed. They blame drought or floods or storms or whatever, and people think the increase is temporary.

I've cut back on my purchases of prepared foods and eat out less. (I hate cooking, but I figure I should get used to it.) I invested in a good toaster oven, which uses less energy than my regular oven, and doesn't heat up the kitchen when I bake in the summer.

A lot of people in my office are griping about the high gas prices. I can (and often do) walk to work, but many of them drive an hour or more each way. Some of them have put in for transfer to somewhere closer to their home, or are actively looking for another job.

Other than that, I haven't noticed any real changes. Five years ago, my office went on a crash energy diet. We get a discount from the power company if we agree to shut down during energy emergencies. It was a bad year, with frequent threats of rolling blackouts, plus we were suffering budget problems. So they actually removed half the light bulbs in the building. The halls were dark, and you had to use your desk lamp if you wanted to read at your desk. (I mostly work at a computer, so I didn't mind the darkness.) They started turning the airconditioner/heater off for 15 minutes of each hour. And they came through and confiscated people's personal appliances. (Toasters, space heaters, fans, etc.) We were allowed to keep a group coffee maker, fridge, and microwave.

They haven't started doing that again, but I figure it's only a matter of time.
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Postby strider3700 » Sun 10 Jul 2005, 14:26:24

The biggest thing around here is a new natural gas powerplant that was due to start construction was successfully stopped. The people complaining where more vocal about polution then about the costs though so thats not really PO related. Dairy is far more expensive but I remeber hearing that the last of the small competition was bought up recently and theat allowed the big guys to increase the prices across the board. Meat is cheaper then last year but the price of beef has been all over up here since the mad cow discoveries last year.

Overall I don't think much has changed yet. There are a lot of highend muscle cars for sale pretty damn cheap. I guess that 572 big block isn't that cool suddenly.
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Postby katkinkate » Mon 11 Jul 2005, 06:27:39

I asked a couple of people at work if the gas prices have been affecting their driving habits much.

One said (paraphrased) "Nope, we still have to go to the same places, the Nick (the kid) to school, hubby and I to our jobs, shopping at the supermarket, Nickolas's tennis, soccer, music lessons..... We just pay the extra.

The other said she tops up her tank with $20 each time she buys petrol and she needs to visit the petrol station more often than before. One visit and $20 used to last a full week and now just 5 days.
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Postby alpha480v » Mon 11 Jul 2005, 06:51:33

I have noticed groceries have gone up in my area.My wife and I re-located to the town where my job is to save on gas.I was spending $40 a week to drive back and forth every day.We shop at the same grocery chain store here in this town where the cost of living should be lower,and we get the same stuff we got before,but the total is about$30 more.

Gas prices are weird here as well.One day they will go up 7 cents a gallon,then 2 days later go down 4 cents.Averaging around $2.25 a gallon though.
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