[Lore]

Teddy Roosevelt was a progressive. Like most independents today having to wear the shoes of one of the major parties. I see the Pope in the sane light.

[Graeme]

NY Times Disregards Times Staffers' Advice On Avoiding Term "Climate Change Skeptic"
Times Story On Pope Encyclical Gives Unwarranted Platform To Climate Science Deniers

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A') June 13 New York Times article about the pope's forthcoming climate change encyclical failed to follow leading Times staffers' recommendations by using the term "climate skeptic" to refer to those who blatantly deny established climate science.

The Times article stated that the Vatican's stance on climate change has "rankled ... climate change skeptics, who have suggested that Francis is being misled by scientists[.]" It added that "a group of self-described climate skeptics, led by the Heartland Institute" organized a protest of the Vatican's position in Rome, and described Marc Morano, a member of the Heartland delegation to Rome, as a former "aide to Senator James M. Inhofe, an Oklahoma Republican and climate change skeptic."

But these descriptions of Heartland, Morano, and Inhofe run counter to the recommendations of The Times' public editor and one of its environmental reporters, each of whom has firmly gone on record against referring to climate science deniers as climate "skeptics."

Just last month, Times public editor Margaret Sullivan responded to an open letter from a group of Fellows from the Committee for Skeptical Inquiry and a petition by Forecast the Facts (which Media Matters supported by conducting research into media coverage) asking media outlets to stop incorrectly referring to climate science deniers as "skeptics." Sullivan stated: "The difference between skeptic and denier ... may seem minor, but it's really not. Simply put, words matter." And in February, Times environmental reporter Justin Gillis wrote that the term "skeptic" should not apply to those who "make scientifically ludicrous claims, such as denying that carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas or rejecting the idea that humans are responsible for its increase in the atmosphere."

But making "scientifically ludicrous claims" about climate change is precisely what the Heartland Institute, Morano, and Sen. Inhofe have done:

The Heartland Institute frequently makes claims about the causes and impacts of climate change that directly contradict the nearly unanimous findings of climate scientists. Heartland made it's climate science denial perfectly clear when it organized a publicity stunt to disrupt the Vatican's April climate change summit, stating that the purpose of the effort was "to inform Pope Francis of the truth about climate science: There is no global warming crisis!"
Morano, who was recently featured in a documentary about climate science deniers titled Merchants of Doubt, has long denied that human activities are responsible for climate change. He's described climate science as "primitive" and "crumbl[ing]," and climate change models as "akin to medieval witchcraft."
Inhofe is the author of a book titled, "The Greatest Hoax: How the Global Warming Conspiracy Threatens Your Future." In February, he brought a snowball onto the Senate floor to dispute the scientific finding that 2014 was the hottest year on record.
In addition to wrongly describing these deniers as "skeptics," The Times again failed to note that they are funded by fossil fuel interests or that their claim that humans are not responsible for global warming is firmly rejected by the vast majority of climate scientists.

At one point, the article reported that Bishop Marcelo Sanchez Sorondo "postulated that many of the attacks have been underwritten by oil companies," but The Times did not confirm the strong evidence that this is indeed the case. The Heartland Institute has received over $700,000 from Exxon Mobil, as well as significant funding from organizations with ties to the oil billionaire Koch Brothers; Morano's blog is financed by the Exxon- and Chevron-funded Committee for a Constructive Tomorrow (CFACT); and Inhofe has received nearly $1.8 million from the oil and gas industry over the course of his congressional career, more than twice as much as he's taken from any other industry.

[Sixstrings]

Off topic to climate change, but this is in the news:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')b]Pope Francis says 'great powers' failed to act when Jews taken to death camps

Pope Francis on Sunday denounced what he calls the "great powers" of the world for failing to act when there was intelligence indicating Jews, Christians, homosexuals and others were being transported to death camps in Europe during the Second World War.

He also decried the deaths of Christians in gulags in Russia under the Stalin dictatorship, which followed the war.

The pope's harsh assessments came in impromptu remarks during his visit to Turin, northern Italy, when he told young people he understands how they find it hard to trust the world.

"The great powers had photographs of the railway routes that the trains took to Auschwitz to kill Jews, Christians, homosexuals, everybody," Francis said, citing the death camp in Poland, and asked: "Why didn't they bomb" those railroad routes?

Referring to the gulags in Russia, Francis said: `'How many Christians suffered, were killed" there.

Lamenting the cynicism of world players in the 1930s and 1940s, Francis said: "the great powers divided up Europe like a cake."

He also cited what he called the "great tragedy of Armenia."

"In the last century, so many, millions, (of Armenians) died. But where were the great powers then? They were looking the other way," the pope said.

In April, the pope angered Turkey when he referred to the slaughter of Armenians by Turkish Ottomans as "genocide."

In today's world, he told the young people: "Everything is done for money." He criticized those advocating peace while manufacturing or selling arms.

Francis reiterated his view that conflicts in the world today are tantamount to "a Third World War in segments."
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/pope-francis-says-great-powers-failed-to-act-when-jews-taken-to-death-camps-1.3122090

[Timo]

In the couple of weeks since the Pope finally brought the issue of climate change into the realm of faith, i've seen plenty of Republican POTUS wannabes trying to rationalize their distaste for following the Word of God (via the Pope), and not acting on that Word to mimimize or reverse our present course. It appears that these wannabes are placing their own political agendas before their own faith, if in fact they had much faith to begin with. Nonetheless, politics and elections trumps God.

That got me thinking. How would these apiring politicos react if the Pontiff took the next step and started excommunting those who publicly and loudly act out, and capaign and preach, the opposite of what the Pope has communicated to the world through his Encyclical? If a POTUS candidate came right out and said not to pay any attention to the Pope (Word of God), and that perpetual growth of the economy is more important, that could be grounds for excommunication. No? Of course, not all POTUS wannabes are Catholic (same for me), so one size does not fit all. Still, it would be well worth paying the price of admission watching these self-appointed political morons try to defend the prioritization of their political beliefs ahead of their religious beliefs.

Please, if there is a God, bring it on!

[Lore]

It has just illustrated that faith for politicians is nothing more than a useful tool. To be used when that faith conveniently supports your agenda.

[Timo]

My point was to blatantly illustrate that fact. Bring it to light. Force the issue of being excommunicated by the Church for your beliefs into the MSM. Make them answer for their priorities, or watch them go groveling back, begging forgiveness, and repenting their sins, doing all the millions of Hail Mary's they'd have to do in order to get back into the Church. That's what i want to see.

Seeing Ted Cruz in that position would make me very happy.

[TireFire]

How many of you have read the pope's encyclical?

[Timo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TireFire', 'H')ow many of you have read the pope's encyclical?

[Keith_McClary]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he Dalai Lama endorsed the Pope’s encyclical on climate change yesterday while speaking at Glastonbury festival, a massive five-day festival that takes place in Somerset, England. The Buddhist leader spoke at a panel on climate change, praising the encyclical and saying it was the duty of everyone to “say more. We have to make more of an effort, including demonstrations.”

[Cog]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Timo', 'M')y point was to blatantly illustrate that fact. Bring it to light. Force the issue of being excommunicated by the Church for your beliefs into the MSM. Make them answer for their priorities, or watch them go groveling back, begging forgiveness, and repenting their sins, doing all the millions of Hail Mary's they'd have to do in order to get back into the Church. That's what i want to see.

Seeing Ted Cruz in that position would make me very happy.

[Keith_McClary]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Timo', 'T')hat got me thinking. How would these apiring politicos react if the Pontiff took the next step and started excommunting those who publicly and loudly act out, and capaign and preach, the opposite of what the Pope has communicated to the world through his Encyclical?

[Timo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Keith_McClary', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Timo', 'T')hat got me thinking. How would these apiring politicos react if the Pontiff took the next step and started excommunting those who publicly and loudly act out, and capaign and preach, the opposite of what the Pope has communicated to the world through his Encyclical?

[Tanada]

I heard a Rabi of the most traditional type explain at a lecture question and answer session that he and his fellow traditional believers do not burn and fossil fuels on the sabbath day and try not to use electricity generated with fossil fuels because Leviticus commandments. Something about not kindling a fire from 6 PM Friday through 6 PM Saturday.

So there are people who use very little fossil fuels for faith reasons in the modern world, but most of us just go along our way happy motoring burning whatever we feel like whenever we feel like.

[Timo]

Some part of me hates to admit it, Tanada, mostly because i am not religious, myself, but faith does have a role to play in our collective task of addressing AGW. You also correctly point out that this faith and concern re AGW is not limited to only Christian denominations. It's a universal problem, and needs to be adddressed in a universal capacity.

Ibon has often called for the establishment of a new religion, or perhaps just a new faith, focused on our provider (earth) and not on some supernatural being. I can't argue against that, and would love it if some version of that faith became firmly established, and went global. However, in the mean time, and perhaps being more realistic, i see nothing wrong with using existing faiths and religions addressing the issue on their own merits. The more the merrier.

And aethiests, too.

[Cog]

The earth will care not if you worship it or not. Waste of time.

[Ibon]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cog', 'T')he earth will care not if you worship it or not. Waste of time.

[onlooker]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')In the end worshiping our planet is just bare bones survival strategy.

[Graeme]

Poll: Voters in 3 Swing States Back Pope Francis on Climate Change

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A') clear majority of voters in the crucial presidential election swing states of Colorado, Iowa, and Virginia agree with Pope Francis' call to action on the issue of climate change, according to the results of a new Quinnipiac University poll.

When asked, “Do you agree or disagree with the message from Pope Francis calling on the world to do more to address climate change?” a substantial majority of voters in all three states indicated that they agreed.

In Colorado, 62 percent of voters said they agreed, while just 31 percent said they did not. In Iowa, the margin was 65 percent who agreed versus 25 percent who did not. In Virginia, 64 percent of voters said they agreed with the pope, while 27 percent disagreed.

The pontiff has often spoken out on the need for the world to try to combat climate change, and in June issued a papal encyclical aligning the church with the conclusions of the vast majority of scientists that global warming is being caused by human activity.

[Cog]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ibon', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cog', 'T')he earth will care not if you worship it or not. Waste of time.

[ennui2]

Don't get hung up on terminology. Replace the word worship with respect or value. It's not necessary to literally bow down and pray to mother earth in an idolatrous way. You simply have to appreciate our dependence on nature's services, because once you do that, then maybe you'll protect it better. It's ultimately a sort of pragmatism. Only when you consciously value it are you mindful enough not to sh*t it up, since people tend to take things for granted (i.e. tragedy of the commons). So "worship" and associated rituals (kind of like saying grace before a meal) is ultimately a mind-game used to prevent taking things for granted.