[basil_hayden]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gorm', 'B')icycles are way more efficient then horses for personal transport, horses will not make a comeback as a mean for personal transportation.

[Gorm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gorm', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gorm', 'B')icycles are way more efficient then horses for personal transport, horses will not make a comeback as a mean for personal transportation.

[Gorm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('basil_hayden', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gorm', 'B')icycles are way more efficient then horses for personal transport, horses will not make a comeback as a mean for personal transportation.

[dolanbaker]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dohboi', '[')img]http://taurangacyclecommute.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/cars-are-coffins.jpg[/img]

[onlooker]

I would say Gorm that a problem for the US was that it was - is a lot bigger country then Sweden so the use of cars made more sense here then it would in Sweden or another small country. However, the real catalyst and impetus for the car culture was as many things in the modern world , the greed of the industrialists , bankers etc. the oil and cars certainly have made fortunes for some. Also, in terms of the waste disposal well we just have been slow in adopting this , we are after all THE country of waste known as such throughout the world. We are slowly trying to catch up with recycling etc. especially where I live in New York city. By the way , I do not own car. I ride bus to outskirts (suburbs) on weekends to visit my girlfriend.

[dolanbaker]

It's not all one way traffic here though, some road schemes still being developed to make travelling easier. It's important to remember that any trend away from private cars will be very slow and these schemes will be worn out by the time there is any real change.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')
Roads funding: £15bn to be spent on schemes for England
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-30269231
A tunnel on the A303 at Stonehenge is among dozens of new road plans to be announced by the government, as part of a £15bn "roads revolution" for England.

The money - initially announced in 2013 - will involve 100 road improvement schemes and add 1,300 new miles of extra lanes to motorways and A roads.

The projects include the tunnel to tackle a bottleneck at Stonehenge on the A303 and improved M25 junctions.

[Gorm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('onlooker', 'I') would say Gorm that a problem for the US was that it was - is a lot bigger country then Sweden so the use of cars made more sense here then it would in Sweden or another small country. However, the real catalyst and impetus for the car culture was as many things in the modern world , the greed of the industrialists , bankers etc. the oil and cars certainly have made fortunes for some. Also, in terms of the waste disposal well we just have been slow in adopting this , we are after all THE country of waste known as such throughout the world. We are slowly trying to catch up with recycling etc. especially where I live in New York city. By the way , I do not own car. I ride bus to outskirts (suburbs) on weekends to visit my girlfriend.

[dohboi]

Onlooker, there's another element that encouraged the adoption of the car in the rural US that I hadn't considered till I took a cross country bike trip recently. Traditionally, roads and paths tended to follow the contours of the land, so you mostly didn't have to climb or descend too steep of an incline.

But the wise folks who set up the system of (most) country roads in the US just set up a grid with mile-square blocks and, whether the roads went up and down sharp undulating hills or whether it was perfectly flat, the roads just went straight across the terrain as if they it were all the same. In hilly country, I can only imagine how hellish that often was to try to move across in a horse drawn vehicle--either the horse was pulling the cart up very steep inclines, or the cart was in danger of running down the horse on the steep declines. And when the roads were covered with ice (as they can be for nearly half the year up here in the north country), those undulations would have been even more treacherous if not impossible/impassible.

So when a car suddenly comes along that can go up and down hills with only a shift of a gear and no sweat for anyone, it must have really felt like a heaven-sent gift to many (especially when they figured out studded tires or chains on tires could give traction on snow and ice).

[onlooker]

Well yes Dohboi, their is in fact a number of good practical reasons to have adopted the use of cars. But I do question, the widespread use of personal use cars. Certainly for commercial use trucks and such were necessary but did we really need to equip every American family with a car? I think not. In the end GREED, the economic expansion imperative , to me is the underlying reason for the widespread adoption of the car culture. I wish to always differentiate between us sheeple who like children buy up whatever new gadget, toy etc that is put before us from the planners, architects (elite) of the modern world who have steered us in certain directions. We never got to VOTE for the widespread use of cars. Yes we bought them up but they (elite) put them there in front of our faces, so to me not much of a choice.

[basil_hayden]

As I've said before, you'll have to pry the steering wheel from my cold, dead hands.

[dohboi]

It's always much more complex than one story line, but this is definitely and important part of the development of transportation in the US: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFhsrbtQObI

[Gorm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('basil_hayden', 'A')s I've said before, you'll have to pry the steering wheel from my cold, dead hands.

[dohboi]

"more to the point: a fully loaded modern jet is more fuel efficient per passenger than a single-occupancy auto."

Oh Lord. Not this again. It is about as far from the point as can be imagined. Even setting aside all the problems with what kind of car or plane you're talking about and just accepting this claim at face value, who the hell gets in their 'single-occupancy' auto and casually goes on vacation or to a meeting that is 3000 miles away. Hardly anyone. So the comparison is mostly irrelevant. In fact, it just points out how much more likely it is that people will choose to transport themselves to far distant place by plane that they wouldn't have even considered traveling to (or only once in a long time/in a life time) had the plane not been available to them.

I agree that air travel is becoming unpleasant and dehumanizing, even more so since I stopped flying from what I've heard. Maybe their trying to tell us this is not a human way to travel??

[sunweb]

Bikes, especially modern bikes, are high tech and are not renewable like a horse. There is no free lunch. We need to deal with the system of energy, resources and environment that makes a bike.
The car culture is insane.
I don't know how to put an image here. I have a great one of a NASCAR stadium filled with people. People who drove how many miles to watch cars go in an oval. Also sports stadia around the country and that is just here in USA. Here is the URL where I have these pictures among other info.
http://sunweber.blogspot.com/2011/11/saving-energy.html

[SeaGypsy]

The relative efficiency of build for the most wiz bang bicycle is massive. The relative efficiency of cycling vs walking means payback time in energy terms should be minimal. The technology required & energy inputs are simple & tiny compared to building & maintaining cars. The suggestion we will suddenly devolve to the point of not being able to build & maintain a bike fleet seems pretty Luddite to me.

[Loki]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SeaGypsy', 'T')he relative efficiency of build for the most wiz bang bicycle is massive. The relative efficiency of cycling vs walking means payback time in energy terms should be minimal. The technology required & energy inputs are simple & tiny compared to building & maintaining cars. The suggestion we will suddenly devolve to the point of not being able to build & maintain a bike fleet seems pretty Luddite to me.

[rdberg1957]

The question "Where do we go from here?" is the order of the day. If Personal Rapid Transit could work in larger applications than airports, that would be beneficial. There are still only a few installations in the world. The advantage of Personal Rapid transit is that it is distributed rather than mass transit, taking people to their destinations and only their destinations, non-stop. If I have a choice between a 1 stop flight and a non-stop flight, I always pick non-stop, even if the 1 stop is cheaper. Bicycles can be a part of the solution and their use can be extended by other transit such as buses and light rail. Given that we don't have good alternative liquid fuels, I think electric is the way to go.

Currently I travel 24 miles one way to work. Moving closer to work is not a practical option as my condo is still a bit upside down. I will somehow have to find a way to work closer to home.

[dinopello]

US Auto Sales on a Tear

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he rest of the economy may be stuck in the slow lane, but the auto industry is on a tear.

Auto sales in November continued to strengthen, hitting an annualized rate of 17.1 million vehicles, according to Reuters, which is comparable to the boom year of 2006.

Even better news for the automakers: the average buyer paid about $33,750 for a vehicle in November, the highest average transaction price on record, according to car-research site KBB.com. The biggest beneficiaries are General Motors (GM) and Chrysler (FCAU) which are selling pickup trucks and SUVs as if gas were once again below $3 per gallon. (Wait…. It is!)

American love affair with cars seems to persist, despite many premature reports of its demise. Here are three reasons cars sales have been so strong:

Auto loans are the only kind of credit many people can get.

Gas is cheap.

Cars are old.