[Quinny]

+ 1 but my multiplier would be x10. Need not greed!

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('careinke', 'I') used to be against a minimum wage pay raise, because I knew it would not help. I still do not think it will help, but I don't think it will hurt either, and it may help reduce consumption as prices rise.

The real problem is the disparity of pay between the lowest and highest paid in the corporation. Since corporations can only legally exist at the pleasure of the government, the government can legally set a pay rate.

So instead of a minimum wage, I would suggest the highest paid employee, counting all compensation, should not be allowed to make more than 50 times the amount of the lowest paid employee based on an hourly bases.

This helps reduce pay disparity as some CEO's now make 600 times more than their lowest paid employees. At the same time it does not limit how much the CEO makes, he just has to drag his employees along with him/her.

Civilizations have a habit of collapsing when wealth disparities become too great. This would be a relatively easy way to mitigate the wealth disparity we have today. A win win for both the rich and the poor.

[joewp]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '
')The man is doing his best to do a good job as President. O isn't perfect, but he's trying to do the right thing under difficult circumstances.

[Keith_McClary]

The Middle Class Is Steadily Eroding. Just Ask the Business World (NYT)$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he post-recession reality is that the customer base for businesses that appeal to the middle class is shrinking as the top tier pulls even further away.

If there is any doubt, the speed at which companies are adapting to the new consumer landscape serves as very convincing evidence. Within top consulting firms and among Wall Street analysts, the shift is being described with a frankness more often associated with left-wing academics than business experts.

“Those consumers who have capital like real estate and stocks and are in the top 20 percent are feeling pretty good,” said John G. Maxwell, head of the global retail and consumer practice at PricewaterhouseCoopers.

In response to the upward shift in spending, PricewaterhouseCoopers clients like big stores and restaurants are chasing richer customers with a wider offering of high-end goods and services, or focusing on rock-bottom prices to attract the expanding ranks of penny-pinching consumers.
...
In 2012, the top 5 percent of earners were responsible for 38 percent of domestic consumption, up from 28 percent in 1995, the researchers found.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Keith_McClary', '[')url=http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/03/business/the-middle-class-is-steadily-eroding-just-ask-the-business-world.html?_r=0]The Middle Class Is Steadily Eroding. Just Ask the Business World[/url] (NYT)

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'Y')up.

And now another ca. 2.3 million jobs will be destroyed by Ocare, according to the CBO.

The trend is not our friend.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'Y')up.

And now another ca. 2.3 million jobs will be destroyed by Ocare, according to the CBO.

The trend is not our friend.

[careinke]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n 2012, the top 5 percent of earners were responsible for 38 percent of domestic consumption, up from 28 percent in 1995, the researchers found.

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'B')ut the CBO says most of the people affected will be low wage workers who will avoid working more hours to keep their subsidized Ocare.

The net effect will be huge....the equivalent of 2.3 million lost jobs.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'B')ut the CBO says most of the people affected will be low wage workers who will avoid working more hours to keep their subsidized Ocare.

The net effect will be huge....the equivalent of 2.3 million lost jobs.

[ROCKMAN]

"...the CBO didn't consider the effect of the BUSINESS mandate in Ocare". I won't pretend to be smart enough to guess where all this will eventually settle out. But consider the title of this thread. We have the current relationship between corporate profits and wages. So if corporate profits decrease for whatever reason (Ocare, energy cost increases, economic cycles, etc.) should we expect wages to increase or decrease? The primary considerations of anyone owing a business is their income/profit. The income of their employees is secondary. Like it or not that's the nature of capitalism. Obviously gov't expenditures don't fit his model. Their job is to transfer the wealth from the more affluent portion of society to support the poorer end. And that's how it should be in a democratic society IMHO. But you can't escape the dynamic of capitalism: the businesses will first supply the gov't with it's share...that's the law, the owners/investors will then get their share...that's capitalism. And what ever is left will be paid to the employees. So given that the middle class obviously has a much higher income than the folks down at the poverty line this is where much of the cash flow has to be retained by the investors/owners. So while it's fine that the small percentage pays a very disproportionately large chunk of the taxes they also pay the bulk of salaries. Reduce their can flow they have a simple choice to make: reduce their income/rate of return or reduce their overhead. An overhead which salaries are a big chunk. Reduce the portion of their work force earning around minimum wage doesn't save much money. Getting rid of employees making $80,000+/year + benefits saves a lot of money.

The gov't can tax the wealthier portion of society all they want and raise minimum wage...even double it. But the gov't can't force businesses to hire and pay middle class wages. And as the middle class makes less money the gov't needs to tax businesses more to cover it's overhead. And the more businesses send to DC the less they have to pay middle class salaries once they taken their cut. The rich will always be rich regardless of how high their taxes may get. The poorer end of society will maintain their support from the gov't and those low end salaries from businesses. So it seems rather logical that the middle class takes the biggest hit. The obvious: no matter how much the gov't taxes the wealthier portion of society it will not be able to provide middle class incomes for the masses. Except, of course, for middle class govt jobs. If folks think the middle class has taken a hit just subtract the number of middle class gov't jobs that have been created. How many middle class workers do we have that are drawing pay from private businesses? And while you're t subtract the number of middle class income earnings drawing salaries from companies getting paid on gov't contracts. I'm now sure how those middle class stats are measured but I suspect there are a lot fewer than we might guess who aren't getting paid from some portion of the gov't cash flow. And then we can consider ho much of that middle class income from the gov't has been borrowed.

[Loki]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ROCKMAN', 'R')educe the portion of their work force earning around minimum wage doesn't save much money. Getting rid of employees making $80,000+/year + benefits saves a lot of money.

[Loki]

Another good graphic on how the Great Recession has affected middle class jobs:

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Loki', '
')
Pew recently released a study on the current state of the American middle class. Ain't looking so good

[Loki]

More on the role of automation in the decline of the middle class:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')url=http://www.voxeu.org/article/job-polarisation-and-decline-middle-class-workers-wages]Job polarisation and its cause[/url]

Pioneering research by Autor, Katz, and Kearney (2006), Goos and Manning (2007), and Goos, Manning, and Salomons (2009) found that the share of employment in occupations in the middle of the skill distribution has declined rapidly in the US and Europe. At the same time the share of employment at the upper and lower ends of the occupational skill distribution has increased substantially. Goos and Manning termed this phenomenon “job polarisation” and it is depicted for US workers in Figure 1.

In an influential paper, Autor, Levy, and Murnane (2003) provide a compelling explanation: they found that middle-skilled manufacturing and clerical occupations are characterised by a high intensity of procedural, rule-based activities which they call “routine tasks”. As it happens, these routine tasks can relatively easily be coded into computer programs.

Therefore, the rapid improvements in computer technology over the last few decades have provided employers with ever cheaper machines that can replace humans in many middle-skilled activities such as bookkeeping, clerical work and repetitive production tasks. These improvements in technology also enable employers to offshore some of the routine tasks that cannot be directly replaced by machines (Autor 2010).

Moreover, cheaper routine tasks provided by machines complement the non-routine abstract tasks that are intensively carried out in high-skill occupations. For example, data processing computer programs strongly increased the productivity of highly-skilled professionals. Machines also do not seem to substitute for the non-routine manual tasks that are intensively carried out in low-skill occupations. For example, computers and robots are still much less capable of driving taxis and cleaning offices than humans. Thus, the relative economy-wide demand for middle-skill routine occupations has declined substantially.

This routinisation hypothesis, due to Autor, Levy, and Murnance, has been tested in many different settings and it is widely accepted as the main driving force of job polarisation.

[Loki]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Loki', '
')
Pew recently released a study on the current state of the American middle class. Ain't looking so good

[PrestonSturges]

Glenn Kessler rates the GOPs claims of Obamacare causing 2.3 million jobs lost as bullshit. Kessler leans right and I think he used to be a speechwriter for George Bush.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/ ... story.html

And the CBO director also says these claims are bullshit.

http://takingnote.blogs.nytimes.com/201 ... ffice&_r=0

And even Paul Ryan says these claims are bullshit.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/p ... job-losses

But hey, if the GOP can convince their voters to kill off members of their own families, let them.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PrestonSturges', 'O')bamacare causing 2.3 million jobs lost ...

[PrestonSturges]

OK you keep imagining that I read your posts while I imagine you eating a big bowl of something that looks like chocolate pudding.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PrestonSturges', ' ')I imagine ... eating a big bowl of something that looks like chocolate pudding.

[phaster]

the simple reason corporations have generated record profits is because they produce a product that is in great demand by the public at large and by using technology it enables corporations to produce more product with fewer workers

hence "Corp profits at new high, wages all time low"

QED

the big question that needs to be addressed is what can be done to "educated" displaced workers so they can create products that would generate "profits" in the marketplace all w/in the context of ever diminishing natural resources and also give "workers" a sense of respect/responsibility

I had that answer to that question I'd win the nobel prize in both peace and economics!




$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', 'T')hese charts tell you everything ya need to know..

Corporate profits:



Wages:



Worst employment number in 30 years: