Your favorite UN institution

by **lorenzo** » Sat 28 May 2005, 13:18:19

Global opinion polls show that the world likes the UN. The world agrees that the UN is an essential institution trying to strengthen peace in the world, by bringing justice, safeguarding standards of international decency, by helping the billions of people who are being oppressed either by economic or social exclusion, by political systems, by tyrants, dictators or by Americans. Moreover, the UN is a fantastic body which accumulates and redistributes knowledge, to the benefit of mankind.
But that is only part of the UN. It is also the only multilateral body which tackles global health problems, poverty, inequality, trade and economic problems, environmental problems and a whole host of other issues which must be dealt with so that the people on this planet can live in dignity and harmony.

This is a globalized world, and most of its problems can only be tackled by a global effort, which supersedes narrow national interests. Global warming is not one single nation's fault, and it threatens us all. Nuclear proliferation is a transnational affair. Threats to health have become global and prevention of the spread of epidemics requires cooperation by all states. Economic actions of states have global repercussions and affect us all.

Only a body like the UN is suited to tackle these enormous and diverse problems. In order to do so, it has created a number of institutions doing fantastic work. Which one is your favorite one?

(Of course, this is not an exhaustive list, there are countless more UN institutions doing absolutely superb work, without us noticing and without which the world would be a dreadful place.)

by **The_Virginian** » Sat 28 May 2005, 14:14:54

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')lobal opinion polls show that the world likes the UN

by **lorenzo** » Sat 28 May 2005, 14:24:22

Good boy, Virginian, obey your Führer and nothing bad will happen to you.
The UN is soo err... nucular, evil, terror, etcetera![smilie=5bullwhip.gif]

by **The_Virginian** » Sat 28 May 2005, 15:13:48

collectivist = United behind UN

you mention lovers of the UN as united, haters as collectivist.

Are you serious, on meds, or just trolling?

PS I dislike the uN for reasons like this:

http://emperors-clothes.com/yugo.htm

that and their anti balfor stance, hardly in the popular press/media leadership.

that and the WHO started the AIDS epidemic by not using singel use needles (even now they say you can "sterilize" up to 200 times).

What's there to like about the new "tower of babel"?

by **smallpoxgirl** » Sat 28 May 2005, 15:51:54

Well...I have to say, I did not realize till just now that the WHO was part of the UN. WHO, IMHO, does a lot of good. In fact the UN as a whole does a lot of good. But then that's how big government is. If it didn't do some good, people wouldn't tolerate it. All things being equal, I think we would be much better off without the UN. That is assuming of course that the US did decide that it should be the world government instead.

by **ArimoDave** » Sat 28 May 2005, 16:11:49

I voted for the FAO. Since the FAO is in effect the organization which allows countries to exceed
their carrying capacity -- and thus will ultimately be responsible for a catastrophic die-off.

Yep! The UN sure does do good work.

ArimoDave

by **seldom_seen** » Sat 28 May 2005, 16:31:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lorenzo', 'T')his is a globalized world, and most of its problems can only be tackled by a global effort, which supersedes narrow national interests.

by **Tyler_JC** » Sat 28 May 2005, 16:33:12

I said UNICEF, helping children is fine. Other than complaining about the United States’ actions, the UN does not really do anything constructive. It stops sovereign nations from being able to protect themselves. It contributes to the coming die off. It encourages overpopulation and food aid. It encourages energy consumption. It interferes with the sovereign rights of free nations. It steals money from the wealthy nations in order to siphon off half and give the rest to dictators. The UN is made up of inferior nations attempting to circumvent the authority of the more powerful ones. It is a massive bureaucracy in the very nature of it. It helps terrorists escape punishment. It allows ruthless dictators to remain in power and doesn’t even condemn their actions (Read, Sudan, Rwanda…), the UN sucks and if it were to disappear tomorrow, I would NOT miss them.

Concerning One World Government:
“Liberty is the soul's room to breathe. The state confines us, controls us, directs us. Each new law is a choice ripped from us. Every new bureaucrat a master over us and yet we instinctively assume it should solve all our problems in the name of freedom. More bureaucracy is not an option.”

All that being said, the UN does offer diplomacy more time. Therefore, as long as it doesn’t go beyond a forum for diplomats, I’m ok with the organization. Unfortunately, they UN DOES go way beyond a simple forum for debate and that is why they must be stopped.

by **lorenzo** » Sat 28 May 2005, 20:09:55

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tyler_JC', 'I')t encourages overpopulation and food aid.

by **lorenzo** » Sat 28 May 2005, 20:17:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'T')hat is assuming of course that the US did decide that it should be the world government instead.

by **lorenzo** » Sat 28 May 2005, 20:21:32

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('seldom_seen', 'I')t is the peak of utopian naivete to assume that a debt ridden highly politicized organization like the UN has the capability to solve global problems

by **The_Virginian** » Sun 29 May 2005, 05:22:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')t's the Bush administration who's against advocating the use of condoms and against birth control. The UN is massively implementing the contrary!

by **Chocky** » Sun 29 May 2005, 20:17:42

If you want to learn a lot about the United Nations (and human nature), you need to read 'We wish to inform you that tomorrow we will be killed with our families' by Phillip Gourevitch. It's a fascinating account of the genocide in Rwanda, and the UN's complete inability or unwillingness to act. Something that has been repeated several times.

by **lorenzo** » Sun 29 May 2005, 20:21:57

I agree that the UN is often paralyzed by the cowardice of certain memberstates. That's why we need a stronger UN. We can start, e.g., by eliminating the veto-power of the members of the Security Council.

by **Chocky** » Sun 29 May 2005, 20:22:16

I noticed you didn't put the security council up, why is that? I like them the best because they're a great symbol of the impotency and uselessness of the UN...

by **lorenzo** » Sun 29 May 2005, 21:24:28

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Chocky', 'I') noticed you didn't put the security council up, why is that?

by **Tyler_JC** » Sun 29 May 2005, 22:04:20

You want to know my real problem with the United Nations? I fear equality. I fear global democracy. And I fear anyone advocating either.

People are not equal. Attempting to make them equal leads to tyranny. (Pointing out the fact that people aren't equal and attempting to get rid of the "inferior" people also leads to tyranny). The global average is a very low level in my mind. I would not be willing to give up my lifestyle in order to bring a few poor South American maize farmers up to that mean level.

I enjoy a higher standard of living than 99% of humanity (kudos to Capitalism

). Should I have to adopt a Buddhist monk lifestyle so that others may move up a bit? I don't think so! Peak Oil will force me to downsize. But I'm ok with downsizing do to economic conditions. I will be very unhappy if I must downsize because of some Bureaucrat's Cornucopian Idealism. The truth of the matter is that the planet has limited resources. There simply isn’t enough stuff to give everyone my lifestyle. Heck, there isn’t enough stuff to give everyone in the Western Hemisphere my lifestyle! I like eating high on the food chain. Yes, it is technically possible to feed more people if everyone gave up meat. However, I’m not giving up meat in order to feed a few ungrateful foreigners. And even if they are thankful, it still doesn’t justify the infringement on my right to eat whatever I damn well feel like eating. (Jack will back me up on this one)

Democracy is dangerous on a large scale. Surely you must understand this. Having 50% + 1 doesn’t make it right. The United Nations wants to bring Democracy, not Constitutional Republicanism (like the US used to have), to the third world. Democracy leads to tyranny of the majority. Laws get passed that restrict freedom. Religious groups can hijack the system (like what is happening to some extent in the USA) and make people vote according to passion rather then intellect. I believe this because most people are not particularly clever. Most people have an IQ of 110 or lower. It takes a certain level of intelligence to be worthy of a vote in my opinion. If you can’t find your nation’s capital on a map, you should not be allowed to vote for its president. My apologies if this sounds elitist because that is not my intention at all. Democracy is fine for a small town or even a small country like, say, Iceland. But when you try creating a Democracy out of a large country…Bureaucratic Nightmare!

by **Chocky** » Mon 30 May 2005, 00:58:15

I was flicking through that book I mentioned and I found a fantastic quote, where the author is in Rwanda not long after the genocide occurred:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')...Listening to him, I was reminded of a conversation I had with an American military itelligence officer who was having a supper of Jack Daniel's and Coca-Cola at Kigali bar.

"I hear you're interested in genocide," the American said."Do you know what genocide is?"

I asked him to tell me.

"A cheese sandwich," he said. "Write it down. Genocide is a cheese sandwich."

I asked him how he figured that.

"What does anyone care about a cheese sandwich ?" he said. "Genocide,Genocide,Genocide. Cheese sandwich, Cheese sandwich, Cheese sandwich. Who gives a shit? Crimes against humanity. Where's humanity? Who's humanity? You? Me? Did you see a crime committed against you? Hey, just a million Rwandans. Did you ever hear about the Genocide Convetion?"

I said that I had.

"That convention," the American at the bar said, "makes a nice wrapping for a cheese sandwich."

by **erl** » Mon 30 May 2005, 01:51:27

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lorenzo', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'T')hat is assuming of course that the US did decide that it should be the world government instead.

by **ECM** » Mon 30 May 2005, 02:37:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'L')orenzo wrote:

That is so because I see it as my paternal duty to educate the American children whenever they demand it.

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