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THE Al Gore Thread pt 2 (merged)

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General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Lore » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 19:05:30

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ColossalContrarian', 'D')idn't he invent the "Internets"?


You mean there's more than one Internet?

I believe, that choice Al Gore myth, has long since been debunked.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 19:14:46

I think DARPA invented the Internets.

The idea was that after the apocalyptic nuclear holocaust megadoom showdown with the Soviets, information and communications would be more secure if de-centralized to a redundant network.

Apocalypse didn't happen, so now we play Farmville and watch funny cat videos. And argue on forumz.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Lore » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 19:30:24

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', 'I') think DARPA invented the Internets.


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '&')quot;Internets" is a Bushism-turned-catchphrase used humorously to portray the speaker as ignorant about the Internet or about technology in general, or as having a provincial or folksy attitude toward technology. Former United States President George W. Bush first used the word publicly during the 2000 election campaign. The term gained cachet as an Internet humor meme following Bush's use of the term in the second 2004 presidential election debate on October 8, 2004.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 19:47:06

Lore everybody knows that.. people are being humorous when they say "internets," we all know it's not literally a series of tubes..

Image

Another issue is why is modern humor so juvenile. It's down to kindergarten level. First grade style misspellings, no complex thoughts longer than can fit in a twitter tweet. Grown men trade funny cat pictures, what the hell happened to the world?

But we're getting off topic here. Al Gore didn't invent the Internet but he does seem to have coined the "Science Denier" mantra. What do you think Lore.. economics is science.. 97% of economists agree the debt ceiling must be raised and we'll collapse if we don't take on more debt.

So is Al Gore right, are those against more debt "Science Deniers?"
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Lore » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 19:53:55

What's amusing is using a Bushism in reference to Al Gore.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 20:06:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', 'W')hat's amusing is using a Bushism in reference to Al Gore.


I know I'm right when you keep changing the subject.

The subject of this thread isn't a big deal, other than that fanaticism is wrong whether people shout "cuz the Lord Your God says so" or if they're shouting "Science Denier! Science Denier!"

Fact is, fundamentalism should never be a part of science. It should always be okay to have questions, without getting shouted down as a Denier. Science is all about questions.

If Al Gore thinks the keynsian economic scientific consensus is that we must continue taking on debt, then he should bolster his debt arguments with scientific evidence -- not just say "anti debt ceiling is like denying climate change." Al Gore is making an appeal to authority here, it's very much like a religiously based argument. He doesn't explain the scientific reasons why we need infinite debt, but rather throws out the Science Denier label instead.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Lore » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 20:13:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', 'W')hat's amusing is using a Bushism in reference to Al Gore.


I know I'm right when you keep changing the subject.

The subject of this thread isn't a big deal, other than that fanaticism is wrong whether people shout "cuz the Lord Your God says so" or if they're shouting "Science Denier! Science Denier!"

Fact is, fundamentalism should never be a part of science. It should always be okay to have questions, without getting shouted down as a Denier. Science is all about questions.

If Al Gore thinks the keynsian economic scientific consensus is that we must continue taking on debt, then he should bolster his debt arguments with scientific evidence -- not just say "anti-debt ceiling is like denying climate change." Al Gore is making an appeal to authority here, it's very much like a religiously based argument. He doesn't explain the scientific reasons why we need infinite debt, but rather throws out the Science Denier label.


If 97 out of 100 expert doctors said you had terminal cancer, two said maybe and one said you didn't, would you call yourself yet a hopeful skeptic, or just someone who is in denial?
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby peeker01 » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 20:18:20

If I had terminal cancer, I would like to spend my remaining days with Al Gore. Because every
day spent with Al would feel like a year.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Plantagenet » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 20:19:41

Of course Al Gore boasted that he had "created the internet". He said it during a CNN interview in 1999 when he was running for president and making his pitch as to why people should elect him president.

See for yourself: Al Gore explains that people should elect him president because he is responsible for creating the internet!!!

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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 20:30:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', 'I')f 97 out of 100 expert doctors said you had terminal cancer, two said maybe and one said you didn't, would you call yourself yet a hopeful skeptic, or just someone who is in denial?


Medicine is a great analogy, glad you raised it.

Medical consensus is wrong all the time. I used to take Vioxx for my back. It was FDA-approved, my doctor said it was a fantastic drug. Well turns out it can give you a leaking heart valve. Oops, scientific consensus was wrong, they took it off the market. Knock on wood I took it rarely so hopefully I'm okay.

On big pharma drug after drug, it quite often turns out the scientific consensus on their safety was wrong. The same can be said for medical treatments.. it behooves you to be a Denier and ask lots of questions before you make a decision.

I don't want this thread to be about climate change, my issue here is about dragging the "Science Denier" label into economics. That's a scary thought there, that we can't have political change or even a debate on the debt because "Economic Science" says we can't.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby peeker01 » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 20:44:14

I remember back in 2006 when my sister dragged me kicking and screaming to see "An Inconven-
ient Truth". The theater was vibrant with eco-fervor. The enthusiasm was palpable. Now, 5
years later, Gore has to hang a porkchop around his neck to get his dog's attention. Everyone knows
we can't afford Gore's get rich quick scheme, even if someone were to prove it is necessary.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Lore » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 21:01:54

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', 'I')f 97 out of 100 expert doctors said you had terminal cancer, two said maybe and one said you didn't, would you call yourself yet a hopeful skeptic, or just someone who is in denial?


Medicine is a great analogy, glad you raised it.

Medical consensus is wrong all the time. I used to take Vioxx for my back. It was FDA-approved, my doctor said it was a fantastic drug. Well turns out it can give you a leaking heart valve. Oops, scientific consensus was wrong, they took it off the market. Knock on wood I took it rarely so hopefully I'm okay.

On big pharma drug after drug, it quite often turns out the scientific consensus on their safety was wrong. The same can be said for medical treatments.. it behooves you to be a Denier and ask lots of questions before you make a decision.

I don't want this thread to be about climate change, my issue here is about dragging the "Science Denier" label into economics. That's a scary thought there, that we can't have political change or even a debate on the debt because "Economic Science" says we can't.


I'm talking about a prognosis by many experts. Not a treatment, which is akin to a discussion of what do we do to remedy AGW.

By nature of being a scientist questions are always asked. Most scientists are skeptics regarding new research until which point a 'theory' becomes more than just a simple hypothesis.

If you cannot begin to accept a proven theory in the first place you cannot, therefore, proceed to address its implications or build further upon it. Just as in a medical treatment. This is exactly what the denialists are hoping to accomplish.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby ColossalContrarian » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 21:11:19

Al Gore makes a lot of money because of AGW and he tried to get on the same boat with the Internet but was promptly shot down. I don't know who this guys connections are but he'll take credit for anything he can make a buck off of so if he calls you a science denier by god you're a science denier and automatically anti capitalist too because being a science denier means you won't invest in his carbon credit programs.

The guy's got a slick deal going. Just like the Fed creating money out of thin air, Al Gore creates carbon credits out of thin air and gives a bunch a people warm fuzzes in their stomach knowing their saving the planet by participating in the carbon credit market.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 21:20:32

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', 'I')'m talking about a prognosis by many experts. Not a treatment, which is akin to a discussion of what do we do to remedy AGW.


Could you at least agree the "Science Denier" labels aren't winning anyone over, but rather scares people and pushes them away? It shuts down discussion and debate. It's persuasion by intimidation and I don't like that. On climate change your reason for shutting down debate is ostensibly because we have to "do something" about it right now and so there's no time for debate.

But now Al Gore has applied the Science Denier label to the debt issue. So does the world blow up if we don't take on more debt? I smell a rat, seems like TARP all over again. Is this what the IMF tells the Irish and Greeks, pass all this austerity or you're a Science Denier?
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Lore » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 21:29:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', 'I')'m talking about a prognosis by many experts. Not a treatment, which is akin to a discussion of what do we do to remedy AGW.


Could you at least agree the "Science Denier" labels aren't winning anyone over, but rather scares people and pushes them away? It shuts down discussion and debate. It's persuasion by intimidation and I don't like that. On climate change your reason for shutting down debate is ostensibly because we have to "do something" about it right now and so there's no time for debate.

But now Al Gore has applied the Science Denier label to the debt issue. Is this what the IMF tells the Irish and Greeks, pass all this austerity or you're a Science Denier?


What would you call someone that has been addressed consistently with the evidence, yet refuses to accept it? I make no appologies for applying the appropriate label.
The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Lore » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 22:17:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'O')f course Al Gore boasted that he had "created the internet". He said it during a CNN interview in 1999 when he was running for president and making his pitch as to why people should elect him president.

See for yourself: Al Gore explains that people should elect him president because he is responsible for creating the internet!!!

Image


Gore never claimed to have "invented" the Internet. What he said was:

"During my service in the United States Congress I took the initiative in creating the Internet."

Which was in reference to opening the Internet to commercial traffic which he helped play a role in.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby peeker01 » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 22:35:06

He's still a dousche bag.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Plantagenet » Tue 26 Jul 2011, 22:57:29

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', 'G')ore never claimed to have "invented" the Internet. What he said was: "During my service in the United States Congress I took the initiative in creating the Internet."

Jeez. Surely you aren't so gullible as to believe that Al Gore created the internet.

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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby Lore » Wed 27 Jul 2011, 07:53:33

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'J')eez. Surely you aren't so gullible as to believe that Al Gore created the internet.

Certainly not as gullible as some right wing stooge that believes and posts everything the conservative media feeds them. You would have to be pretty gullible to accept that any politician would even make such a boast to the actual invention of the Internet, thinking they could get away with it.

While Thomas Edison is credited with inventing the light bulb, he certainly cannot be solely credited with the marketing and commercialization of the invention. You could give equal credit for that creation to all the industrial engineers, bankers, government and scientists who perfected the invention and got it out to everyone. Otherwise it would have been just an interesting curiosity.

Likewise, Steve Jobs didn’t invent the PC but created and marketed a different version of such.

My grandfather helped to create the first aerodynamic production automobile back in the 30s as head engineer at Chrysler, but he didn’t invent the first aerodynamic automobile.

Invention and creation are two different things.
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Re: Al Gore: opposing debt ceiling = denying climate change

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Wed 27 Jul 2011, 08:26:03

It is nice to hear those important (and also impotent...) dickheads people warning about more and more serious consequences, while the Empire is getting bankrupt.
They are sounding very much like Roman Cezars of III-V centuries AD.
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