[Livewire713]

America went belly up in 2008. George Bush was able to kick the can off to Obama who gave it one hell of a big kick in 2009. Not only in stimulus and securities but also on false hope that everything would eventually get better. I find it amusing that people blame the Government for the job situation when they also admit that those lost jobs were fluff and we still have more fluff to get rid of. I dont see Washington letting a default happen but in every game there are winners and losers. If there was a default who would come out ahead and who would lose?

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cog', 'I') wouldn't be too awful happy about the Republicans caving on the debt ceiling talks Sixstrings unless you want to live in a 21st century Zimbabwe.

[ohanian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', 'R')epublicans haven't caved. But neither are they serious about the deficit. Cog, deficit is 1.5 trillion per year. The "grand bargain" was 200 billion per year, the new "bargain lite" is a cut of 100 billion per year. Neither one makes a hill of beans difference if the deficit is 1.5 trillion annually.

And another thing, Obama and Boehner are both full of it because their cuts are all on the backend like ten years from now. They assume there will be economic recovery by then. All kinds of assumptions that won't pan out.. they'll all be out of office when the cuts are due to hit, so most likely a future Congress will just change it.

It's all kabuki, enjoy the dancing and the rice wine..

[Sixstrings]

You know it's funny, here Boehner has walked away from gutting Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid and veterans but Obama won't let up. They had another meeting and Obama is still pushing the "Grand Bargain," Obama really really really wants to gut these programs.

Here's an article out today, Obama is telling us we've got to "eat our peas:"

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'O')bama On Deficit Talks: Time To "Pull Off The Band-Aid, Eat Our Peas"

"I will not sign a 30-day or a 60-day or a 90-day extension. That is just not an acceptable approach. And if we think it's hard now, imagine how these guys are going to be thinking six months from now in the middle of election season when they are all up. It's not going to get easier, it's going to get harder. So, we might as well do it now. Pull off the band-aid. Eat our peas. Now is the time to do it. If not now, when? We keep on talking about this stuff, and we have these high-minded pronouncements about how we've got to get control of the deficit, how we owe it to our children and our grandchildren. Well, let's step up. Let's do it," President Obama said at his press conference today.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/07/11/obama_on_deficit_talks_time_to_pull_off_the_band-aid_eat_our_peas.html

[Sixstrings]

This whole thing stinks, it's embarassing.. Obama's throwing everything and everyone under the bus trying to at least get some corporate loopholes closed. We're going to end up with a debt deal with just cuts to seniors, vets, the jobless and poor.. no tax increase on the rich, corps, not even corp loopholes.

According to Huffpost, Obama offered up raising eligibility age for Medicare:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')b]Obama Offered To Raise Medicare Eligibility Age As Part Of Grand Debt Deal

According to five separate sources with knowledge of negotiations -- including both Republicans and Democrats -- the president offered an increase in the eligibility age for Medicare, from 65 to 67, in exchange for Republican movement on increasing tax revenues.

The proposal, as discussed, would not go into effect immediately, but rather would be implemented down the road (likely in 2013).
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/11/obama-medicare-eligibility-age_n_894833.html

[Novus]

Obama could up with some big cuts if he just ended the wars.

[AgentR11]

I don't think I've seen anyone suggest it anywhere, but since the Republican resistance to tax increases is largely based upon the belief that the cuts written, will never happen; how about attaching tax increase authorizations to demonstrated reductions in total government outlays. IE, Tax increase X self-repeals, and refunds prior year, if sum of all government expenditures in all areas exceeds $Y.

I think there is real suspicion on the right, that if tax increases happen; spending would just be increased despite promises and the annual deficit level would stay the same. Basically, the 2011-2012 congress can not bind the actions of the 2013-2014 congress; but if there was an auto-repeal function in the tax language of 2011; the 2013 congress would have to also vote and pass removal of the auto-repeal and thus take the hit for "tax increase" legislation; making the spending caps set in 2011 more likely to be realized.

[Serial_Worrier]

Grandma better go get an Engineering degree and bust ass competing against 20year olds.

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Novus', 'O')bama could up with some big cuts if he just ended the wars.

[the48thronin]

and where do you think the millions of dollars necessary to campaign for office come from, working stiffs and ss recipients? Which President since Harry Truman left office as a middle class American and not part of the super rich?

[careinke]

[quote="Sixstrings

But no.. rather than tax millionaires or cut Defense one red cent, Obama wants to take it out of Social Security and Medicare. That's what Boehner wants too, all they're arguing about is whether the super rich should keep a few loopholes.[/quote]

Would you agree to doing both?

[Keith_McClary]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('the48thronin', 'a')nd where do you think the millions of dollars necessary to campaign for office come from, working stiffs and ss recipients? Which President since Harry Truman left office as a middle class American and not part of the super rich?

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('careinke', 'W')ould you agree to doing both?

[Cog]

So Sixstrings, you have proved that 60% of the American people are stupid enough to believe in a free lunch. I'm not surprised at them as much as I am you in joining in to that delusion thinking.

[vision-master]

Cog, what kind of retirement program do you offer your employees?

[Cog]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vision-master', 'C')og, what kind of retirement program do you offer your employees?

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cog', 'S')o Sixstrings, you have proved that 60% of the American people are stupid enough to believe in a free lunch. I'm not surprised at them as much as I am you in joining in to that delusion thinking.

[Cog]

Its called paying for the program Sixstrings. I know this concept might be a bit strange to you having grown up on the idea of printing and borrowing money all your life.

But of course my ideas are much more radical. I would end Medicare and Social Security and let you take care of your own parents. That is, if they haven't disinherited you yet.

[Sixstrings]

Wow.. Obama says if the debt ceiling isn't raised, he won't send out Social Security checks:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')resident Obama on Tuesday said he cannot guarantee that retirees will receive their Social Security checks August 3 if Democrats and Republicans in Washington do not reach an agreement on reducing the deficit in the coming weeks.

"I cannot guarantee that those checks go out on August 3rd if we haven't resolved this issue. Because there may simply not be the money in the coffers to do it," Mr. Obama said in an interview with CBS Evening News anchor Scott Pelley, according to excerpts released by CBS News.

The Obama administration and many economists have warned of economic catastrophe if the United States does not raise the amount it is legally allowed to borrow by August 2.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20078789-503544.html