[Ibon]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Homesteader', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Serial_Worrier', 'T')he American people are not buying the slavery meme. It's-Not-Working.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gollum', ' ')The one regrettable aspect of all this is that it didn't happen years ago in the private sector

[PrestonSturges]

How's that whole "We surround them" thing working now?

Scott Walker is on Fox right now, not talking about how Fox funneled money to his campaign using the RGA.

Scott claims that the union won't lose it's rights, the union has offered concessions. So according to Scott this whole thing is........what? Nothing? Scott's telling the truth and 100,000 people are lying?

From here, it looks like Scott is a lying sack of s**t, and if he can't tell the truth, then he should not get a vote, period.

They ned to let the state shut down and have all state workers and nurses join the picket line.

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PrestonSturges', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', '
')Working class should call a general strike? They will stop doing... whatever is that they are doing? I dont think anyone will notice anything, since obviously they dont do much. Working class is living in China now. How good is your Chinese?

[PrestonSturges]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PrestonSturges', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', '
')Working class should call a general strike? They will stop doing... whatever is that they are doing? I dont think anyone will notice anything, since obviously they dont do much. Working class is living in China now. How good is your Chinese?

[Ibon]

Germany up until just a couple of years ago was the leading export country on value of goods exported. They also have a tradition of having very strong unions (Gewerkschaft) I worked as a Regional Director in the 1990's for a German optical and fine mechanic manufacturer and witnessed firsthand the negotiations that went on between the local union, local government and the company when part of the manufacturing was transferred to the far east to in order to be competitive with labor costs. Those negotiations where impressive in how the unanimous importance of preserving the local manufacturing jobs was understood by all parties at the same time as the need to concede to the global marketplace required shifting some production over to Asia.

What was most striking is that this company had a US competitor that in the 1970's had 7000 employees in a northeast rust belt city. They shifted 100% of their production to China and during the 1990's their manufacturing was shut down completely and there were only 30 employees in the US remaining. This competitor eventually was bought up and is no longer US owned.

I never had a political position for or against unions prior to living in Europe. But what I saw there certainly brought clear what is possible when positions aren't polarized as they are in the US. To be fare I think unions in the US also have demonstrated their fare share of spoiled abuse just as the government and private sector has done.

In the end sometimes it isn't really about the polarized positions but rather the integrity of the players. In the US in general all parties, whether its the union, private sector or the government are all suffering from the malaise that there is a free lunch. Why else are we trillions in debt.

To think we can blame any one party in this decline is failing to see that a society based on consumption (70% of our GDP) is a society that has lost its integrity. Whether your talking about unions, the political left, political right, corporations, citizens, mega churches, etc.

I think integrity returns and grows in America once again inversely proportional to economic decline.

[Cloud9]

"I can hire one half the working class to kill the other half." Jay Gould 19th Century Robber Baron

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gollum', '[')b]I think it's absolutely great to see middle class people getting involved in supporting their own interests in this country and not getting sidetracked on abortion, gun control, or Obama's birthplace. I also agree with Ludi who posted that the working class should call a general strike. I think the tea party was a great thing before it was taken over by nutty establishment republicans, and it's nice to see them outnumbered 100 to one in these protests!

[PrestonSturges]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cloud9', '&')quot;I can hire one half the working class to kill the other half." Jay Gould 19th Century Robber Baron

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PrestonSturges', '
')You sound like someone that was born with a trust fund, got bailed out by daddy every step of the way, and never missed a hot meal.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', ' ')

The other talking point you see being pushed is how state workers' benefits are so out of line with the private sector. But the problem there isn't that state workers are living so large, it's that the rest of America in the private sector has become serfs...

[Lore]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', ' ')

The other talking point you see being pushed is how state workers' benefits are so out of line with the private sector. But the problem there isn't that state workers are living so large, it's that the rest of America in the private sector has become serfs...

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '
')
Its the people of Wisconsin who pay the salaries of government workers through their taxes.

The public employee unions want people in Wisconsin who don't have nice pensions to pony up their taxes to pay for nice pensions for government workers who, by most measures, are doing a crappy job of educating their children.

[Lore]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '
')
Its the people of Wisconsin who pay the salaries of government workers through their taxes.

The public employee unions want people in Wisconsin who don't have nice pensions to pony up their taxes to pay for nice pensions for government workers who, by most measures, are doing a crappy job of educating their children.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lore', '
')Private sector workers are paid by you and I and everyone that buys their goods and services. Since you use the services of the government, then it stands to reason you should pay for those too.

[vision-master]

But keep management.

Planted, do you know how top heavy Government is? Get rid of the useless paper shufflers/ all the suits. The ones making the BIG salary's.


Consider this analysis the Economic Policy Institute conducted comparing total compensation -- that is to say, wages and health-care benefits and pensions -- among public and private workers in Wisconsin.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-k ... local.html

[gollum]

I think one of the ways the wealthy play the poor is to blame unions and set workers against each other, instead of bitching union workers make too much maybe working people of this country need to ask why they aren't making more at a time management and CEOs are taking home record bonuses. Americans are slowly waking up and understanding that in a race to the bottom they come out losers and with the living standard of Pakistan and the rights of Chinese.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gollum', ' ')instead of bitching union workers make too much maybe working people of this country need to ask why they aren't making more at a time management and CEOs are taking home record bonuses.

[vision-master]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gollum', 'I') think one of the ways the wealthy play the poor is to blame unions and set workers against each other, instead of bitching union workers make too much maybe working people of this country need to ask why they aren't making more at a time management and CEOs are taking home record bonuses. Americans are slowly waking up and understanding that in a race to the bottom they come out losers and with the living standard of Pakistan and the rights of Chinese.

[vision-master]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gollum', ' ')instead of bitching union workers make too much maybe working people of this country need to ask why they aren't making more at a time management and CEOs are taking home record bonuses.