[seldom_seen]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', 'T')hings will be shitty but this country is still vastly underpopulated and blessed with more arable land (and building materials) and opportunity then 10 US populations need.

[Liamj]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Zardoz', 'P')lease re-read my question. I asked why people were the way they were back then, rather than the ravenous beasts Jack insists we all are, deep in our black hearts. Why did they not slaughter each other by the millions?

[Pops]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Zardoz', 'P')lease re-read my question. I asked why people were the way they were back then, rather than the ravenous beasts Jack insists we all are, deep in our black hearts. Why did they not slaughter each other by the millions?

[holmes]

If we all conserved, recycled and built "green" everything will be just fine!

You know what its too late. The ones that arent thinking reality will be cleansed form the gene pool and if their offspring is anything like them they too get bleached. No need to explain unless your a newbie to the ecology scene. then I would love to discuss stuff.
there will be strife.
civil war is just hyperbole. ok.
cheap energy has made humans solely sacks of semen and egg carriers. Non thinking breeders.
conservation, yeah right. theyll be conserving with their cool eco friendly hybrid and refrigerator as the streets are filled with blood. Theyll come out one day and the hybrid will be firebombed.
In fact lets stuff these chimps in their ecofriendly refrigerator and shove it off the 20th story roof.
Its a whole differnet over crowded world. 2.2 million acres getting consumed each year in the US alone. But dont change the system just make things eco friendly and conserve. Pathetic irresponsibility.

[holmes]

Pops I have to disagree with you on not being a people problem. maybe if we kept all out farmland and wetlands in tact then the human load would not be a problem. But as it is now we have lost much of our ability to sustain this load. the load is increasing each year. Food now is coming in from other countries and many parts of the country are dependent on the foreign food now. the ability for the US to feed even ourselves is strained. and much of our country is not agrarian oriented or set up to even sustain small popualtions. The biggest mismanagement in the history of mankind, the US. and without oil (coal and ammonia will never meet oil efficiency) the yeilds will be even lower.

[holmes]

Also if u look geographically at the United States it was made for herding beasts, game birds, fish, seafood.... basically wildlife protiens. It is a second rate agrarian continent. Not nearly as fertile as other continents were. especially now. It was ideal for a hunting/agrarian civilization. That abilty to maintain the wild animal protiens on a large scale is gone.

[SoothSayer]

>> OR have seen their little sister die for lack of food and medicine?

Good point. Death is now a taboo subject in the western world.

Everyone now lives in an idealised world of plenty where nothing bad happens ... except of course to those nasty fuzzy-wuzzies in some distant land.

I have NO idea what would happen if you took away all the ice cream, gasoline, hi-tech toys, central heating & air conditioning from 200+ million unfit, self-obessed people ...

[Aaron]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Zardoz', 'P')lease re-read my question. I asked why people were the way they were back then, rather than the ravenous beasts Jack insists we all are, deep in our black hearts. Why did they not slaughter each other by the millions?

[holmes]

The good old days were not that good indeed! The goal here for positive advancement of evolution of man would be to take the good of the "good old days" such as large open spaces, self perpetuating wild protien stocks, large amounts of fertile soils, etcc and merge them with the modern advances such as medicine, technology (especially using solar, wind and hydro), earth ship biotechture(true green development), composting toilets, use our wastes as fertilizers, advance organic agriculture instead of oil based, etc... The good of both worlds. but the only way to have had this "utopia" so to speak was to keep our breeding and immigration rates at replacement levels or slightly above. That time is sadly over. Time for the backlash of irresponsibilty. pass the buck so to speak.
If you dont have a "bring it on" attitude your getting trampled to death.

[holmes]

http://www.learner.org/exhibits/collapse/mayans.html

The mayans overdeveloped. They consumed their forests in the process of making lyme. The lyme was used on there massive temples and the elites structures. The ensuing siltification of their fertile wetlands and soils created hunger and starvation. The incessant "need" to keep adding onto these buildings and developing killed them off. Basically cannibalization. and modern humans have advanced? where? We are exponentially larger than the comparatively small mayan civilization. Chaco canyon? There will be no glory in this collapse. I was raised rural tough. Not much machines in my upbringing. I have a hard time relating to urban/burb folk. Just not on the same wave length. Seldom seen and I consider the swarm a plague. Im not sure where Jack an Aaron fit. The only blaze Ill be doing is firing up a spliff laying low down in the canyons. Im just hoping it doesnt go down in my llife. It looks like it will tho.

[holmes]

Pstarr I notice u live in NYC. Nuff said.
and here comes the "your using a computer" satements. like that has to do with anything. There is nothing left to say. I recieve the farmers literature for whats left of the farms in the southern teir down there. ItIts a listing of all the farms in southern NY, NJ and I believe conneticut. I grew up in rural ulster county. Like rural folk are not supposed to use computers only urban folk. ok. There is one Truly working farm left down there. I need to get the name of the farm and the family that runs it. They actually are going more towards it being a hay ride/family outing farm. A recreational farm. UGHHH. I forgot it. they will supply your city with all they need. I am intimately familiar with the NY ecological scene. The southern tier will be one of the centers of Mayan collapse. But you can make all the statements about the computers and such. You have no clue how I live and just how close I am to the canyons. But hey keep reaching. I do not dislike u none the less. and Ill spliff up if I want to. Or maybe ai wont. its my choice. The socialist cities havent controlled all of us out here yet. Thats attempt will come soon enough.

[Pops]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('holmes', 'P')ops I have to disagree with you on not being a people problem.

[Aaron]

Look folks I'm not saying there are no exceptional people... many right here on this board I believe.

I'm just saying that the vast majority of people who have ever lived, are a rather vile group of uneducated, violent narcissists who will take every possible personal advantage available to them, including murdering all of us & destroying the planet, attempting to obtain what they desire.


The illusion of safety in the herd is useful to prevent a premature stampede only...

Eventually, all of you will realize where the chute at the other end of the corral leads.

But of course by then... it's too late.

[holmes]

I agree with you pops (as almost always, just lettin u know).
well I apologize pstarr! Who the heck is from NYC then? Hey The redwoods! Now there is one amazing ecosystem. Jebidiah Smith state park is beutiful. was there in 1998. whats the town by it? I forgot the name. It was so nice with no crowds when I went.
and that is true capitalism and communism are one in the same. There lockstepping cult members will kill there mothers to get resources. Those that can not deviate and adapt the system in the face of reality are the ones you have to watch out for. and there are alot of them. More than we think. They will resist any changes if it mean they will have to sacrifice one iota of pleasure or materialism. Thats about 70 percent of the USA. I just need to look at the percentage of people who either support illegal immigration or want amnesty/guest worker visas to see the situation. Can not give up those slaves. I thought it was 50/50 here. But only about 30% of the USA will be "peaceful" when the shit goes.

[Zardoz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Aaron', '.')..I'm just saying that the vast majority of people who have ever lived, are a rather vile group of uneducated, violent narcissists who will take every possible personal advantage available to them, including murdering all of us & destroying the planet, attempting to obtain what they desire...