[Plantagenet]

The rapid growth in Portland has been going on for decades:

"....the Portland Urbanized Area sprawled out across 39 additional square miles (25,000 acres) from 1980 to 1990. In its first decade of vigorously applied Smart Growth techniques, Portland could not stop the urbanization of rural land. The reason? The population grew by 146,000 during the decade. "

And the rapid population growth continues now.

And why not? Wages are good, houses are cheap and there are nice places to live in and around Portland.

Its the kind of place that local boosters can tout as being progressive and "anti-growth" while it actually is one of the more rapidly growing places in America.

[BlisteredWhippet]

Heres some phun phacts:

Less than 2% of the food calories consumed in the Seattle Metro area are locally sourced. If restricted to "local" sources, this figure would amount to much less than 10%.

Water rights allotment for the western cascades exceeds actual amount of drawable water by a factor of six.

"Copper River Salmon" is considered "local". The Copper River is abouot 1500 miles Northwest of Washington State, which, just 100 years ago, produced most of the world's canned salmon.

Net migration to the Seattle area is well over 100,000 and growing annually at phenomenal rates.

Washington state is illegal-immigrant friendly, with social services, schooling, and driver's liscenses for illegal aliens.

[eastbay]

And this crime wave is happening during happy times with fairly plentiful jobs, relatively cheap food and housing, and, looking back from next year, very cheap energy.

This is why we won't ride MAX. Imagine what mass public transportation will be like when the current 'happy times' pass and chaos begins to kick in. Those of you banking on taking the light rail to work and on errands when gas gets too costly.... think again.

[thuja]

Dude- so negative...where's the aim for community solutions? Where's the talk about how to help your neck of the woods mitigate the coming crisis? Or are you one of the folks who believes they can hide out in the woods with your cans of beans and ammo?

[eastbay]

thuja!!! Dude, I knew I would wake you up with this posting!

We're all for community solutions. I'm also all for safe trains. Maybe this new police presence will provide it. It's obvious that without lots of cops riding the trains, MAX is, and will be, a very unfriendly ride. Dial time a few years into the future. Then ride MAX. If the trains are this unsafe now think how nasty they'll be when things get dicey. Then we'll both talk negative.

That's why the good mayor ordered cops to ride the trains. MAX is responsible for patrolling trains, but the $10.00/ hr security guards they hire to patrol the trains aren't up to the task of making the trains and train stations safe. It's not the security guards fault they're unarmed, with no arrest authority and no power. All they can do is pretend to patrol and they're widely ignored. Ask one. They can't even write tickets. If you dare, get on a train at 162nd. Heading east. With a loved one. Or alone. At night.

[thuja]

OK got my attention mr. inflammatory over there (a favorite tactic of mine)...

Yeah I spent some time talking creating scenarios for city living and one of the main things I forsee is that cities will appear to breakup into little neighborhoods- some good to live in and some very unsafe. One of the first things I advise is that people who live in the city try and move to an area of town that will not beplagued by rampant crime, violence and chaos.

Like the Third World, cities will shift to haves and have-nots...with the have-nots getting very very grumpy and mainly taking it out on each other. So living and taking mass transit east of 162nd at a bad time of the day...not so smart and down right dangerous 5-10 years from now...

So more cops on MAX- yeah that's good as a stop gap- and I sure would love to have a police presence if I went out to 162nd at 11 at night. But long term I think the police will cede whole sections of town to the gangs and thugs who live there. Ugly but very likely- its happened to many cities in America already...

So what to do- make your area of town better man- let me hear something positive from you before I start to believe you are simply a cynical naysayer who doesn't truly want to do something to prepare your community for the future...

[eastbay]

Now, now, thuja, there's no need for harsh talk.

We're all friends here, remember? We've all discovered PO and what it'll mean for the future and we're all further here to discuss all the various facets and manifestations of our Common Disaster. Bright spots will indeed be difficult to find when unbelievable civil unravelling and mass die-off is about to be served. Happy riders on light rail won't be among those few bright spots.

Now, I bet if you try you can communicate in a friendly manner. Go ahead, give it a try. It'll make you feeel better too!

[thuja]

Got it...MAX bad...

[eastbay]

10-4.

But starting Wednesday: MAX good again!!

I might add: .... as long as you're lucky enough to be on a train sitting near a few cops.

Otherwise, yup: MAX = bad. Very bad.

[kadoomsoon]

Very easy.
Give everyone a hand gun with a clip.
sure innocents will die, but so will all the thugs.

when the smoke clears, what is levft is sane people with brains.

[thuja]

Agreed- Seattle is a definitely a step of for all the reasons you described- I have friends and family in towns and cities throughout the NorthWest and I think the whole area is great even with overpopulation problems. The problem I fear most is a mega-influx of GW related refugees.

Those who cannot tell a difference between NorthWest towns and cities and Las Vegas- what can I say...

[Plantagenet]

Seattle sounds like a virtual Ecotopia.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('HydroLuver', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'S')eattle sounds like a virtual Ecotopia.

[eastbay]

Darn double posting...

[eastbay]

Seattle is both sustainable and green. The coming disaster will hardly be noticed by those living there. I strongly urge everyone on earth to move there before it's too late to do so and thereby forever happily enjoy this sustainable and green ecotopia.

You better hurry and get up there too because those of you left behind living in all those other cities are doomed, as in '10.0 on the doomerosity scale' doomed.




(Important note for those of you who are humor- challenged: the above is meant only as humor)

[thuja]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('HydroLuver', 'I') am late to this debate, and most of it has been about Portland, but one of the reasons I think the Seattle region is a good city is for some of the following reasons:

[Plantagenet]

Seattle has a very active "Peak Oil Awareness" group, and they are politically active. They've drafted a resolution for a law to make Seattle deal with Peak Oil issues.

Seattle Peak Oil Resolution

[thuja]

That's great- I hadn't heard that Seattle was proposing a Peak Oil resolution to the city council. Hopefully this will become a strong regional issue for the NorthWest in which cities and towns and the farmlands throughout the Northwest collaborate for developing mitigation plans.