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Peak Oil and the 21st Century

General discussions of the systemic, societal and civilisational effects of depletion.

Peak Oil and the 21st Century

Unread postby Graeme » Wed 21 Mar 2007, 06:47:44

Peak Oil and the 21st Century

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')s Stuart and Sean-Paul noted at the end there really are two ways to deal with peak oil - the peaceful technological and societal approach of conservation and changing how we use energy; and the violent approach of fighting over energy.

The problem is that other countries aren't so concerned with protecting their current billionaries and their sunk capital. Stuart mentioned that Silicon Valley is rife with energy startups these days, and perhaps they'll be able to retake the lead, but as of right now the leader in solar technology is Japan and the leader in wind technology is Europe - not the US. Japan and Europe don't like being dependent on oil imports and they don't care who it's making rich, they know that it's making them poor and vulnerable to foreigners.

Their public policy, in other words, is driven to at least some extent by what is good for the mass of people in their countries, rather than what is good for the rich. In the US, where government policy is quite literally mostly written by lobbyists; where government is bought and paid for by billionaires and multi-millionaires; where a House member has to raise a million dollars a year, the interest of the majority is of minor consequence.

As with organisms, societies that lose their adaptability, that refuse to change, eventually die or go into decline. How societies respond to peak oil is one of the determinants of which nations will be the best to live in, the most powerful, and the most likely to have their values spread, in the twenty-first century.


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Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe. H. G. Wells.
Fatih Birol's motto: leave oil before it leaves us.
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Re: Peak Oil and the 21st Century

Unread postby Newsseeker » Wed 21 Mar 2007, 19:55:11

Ummm.... react violently? It would be nice if the US acted for the majority of the citizens but I doubt it ever will....
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Re: Peak Oil and the 21st Century

Unread postby nth » Thu 22 Mar 2007, 21:17:46

I disagree with them completely.
Advanced solar technology are in the US domain.
Advanced wind turbine technology are in the US domain.

The Japanese and European firms have licensed US technology to built their solar and wind products. Does that mean they have superior products than US? Well, US is behind in producing the end product, but the key pieces are all US inventions. Reminds of US consumer electronics: US invention, but Japanese perfection.

I am not sure we are at that point as far as solar and wind.
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Re: Peak Oil and the 21st Century

Unread postby seldom_seen » Thu 22 Mar 2007, 23:55:56

Another in a long list of flawed articles with the premise that peak oil is a technology problem to be solved.
But how the world turns. One day, cock of the walk. Next, a feather duster.
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Re: Peak Oil and the 21st Century

Unread postby TreebeardsUncle » Fri 23 Mar 2007, 00:07:08

Well, PO will be the first formative event of the 21st century, the way WW1 was of the 20th.

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Re: Peak Oil and the 21st Century

Unread postby Twilight » Fri 23 Mar 2007, 00:23:17

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')eak oil is an opportunity as well as a crisis. It's an opportunity to make energy something that is produced by capital rather than a resource.

Huh?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he US still has Silicon Valley - still has the best high end university system in the world ... whether that knowledge can actually be applied in the US, however, is the question.

Eh?

Energy is a tangible thing, it isn't in money or the mind, it's something shovelled into a boiler. OK, we have progressed a little bit beyond that, but even so, it's a physical thing which doesn't manifest itself just because you possess intelligence or offer an incentive. At some stage it requires a lot of people banging metal, even if they're paving Arizona with PV. That requires planning. It becomes known a long time before it happens, it appears on the horizon. You don't get energy by wanting it.
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Re: Peak Oil and the 21st Century

Unread postby CrudeAwakening » Sun 25 Mar 2007, 17:28:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Twilight', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')eak oil is an opportunity as well as a crisis. It's an opportunity to make energy something that is produced by capital rather than a resource.

Huh?

Bizarre. Is he saying that energy could become something we create, rather than something we use? An end product, rather than an input? I think he's lost it.
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