[Rich7]

I had a discussion about alternate energy sources with a person who didn't know much about peak oil. There defense about the lack of energy technology is that it would benefit the USA to keep their technology secret or classified so in an oil shortage or peak they could sell technology or resources to other countries and become even more of a superpower and control the price of energy. My question is do you think this could be a possibility?

[skeptik]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Rich7', ' ')My question is do you think this could be a possibility?

[dub_scratch]

If you were in possession of some knowledge of secrete energy technology, why would you hold it back? Someone else or some other group could develop the same technology on a later date, release it to industry, revolutionize the world and become the richest person on Earth. All the while you only get to tell your grand kids how you were one of the first to know of this new energy, but you were part of a conspiracy to keep it secrete. Your grandkids would look at you with disgust knowing they would have been born into the wealthiest family in history if their boneheaded grandpa would have not been so foolish to follow along with a stupid conspiracy.

[gego]

No. Just wishful thinking on the part of those who do not wish to be one of the dead in the big dieoff.

[Rich7]

"Someone else or some other group could develop the same technology on a later date, release it to industry, revolutionize the world and become the richest person on Earth."

You just proved my point.

What if the government won't release it until they have too, and when they do they expect to make tons of money off it. And they believe their intelligence agencies can determine if other countries have come close to what they have discovered. You have to understand that the defense department has contingency plans for almost every situation. They have plans for invading and taking over almost every country. They must have some plan for peak oil. They don't seem to scared.

If the USA had the technology, couldn't it be possible for them to hold on to it and not explain its plan to convert to it or the technology behind it?

Trust me I am more of a doomer than most, and I don't believe Uncle Sam has a miracle energy source. I know what I am saying is very improbable and I don't believe it will happen. Thinking that the government can't keep things secret though is a mistake. All I am asking is why would it be impossible?????

[Madpaddy]

So today, I unveil my revolutionary new technology which breaks down crap at a molecular level giving instant, convenient usable energy.

The problem is there are no crap tankers, crap refineries or crap stations. All power stations and vehicles have to be retrofitted to run on my crap converter. All this will have to be done while power from fossil fuels declines due to depletion not to mention depletion of copper, lead, iron ore yada yada yada.

Unfortunately, my crap converter whilst a very useful piece of technology istoo little, too late.

CRAP

[Omnitir]

Well actually, electric cars are an example of this. The technology to mass-produce efficient and high performance plug in electric cars certainly exists, and there is certainly a growing demand for more fuel-efficient cars and likely EV’s. Several major car companies have produced EV’s on limited-lease test-runs, which were all well received. And yet mysteriously these vehicles disappeared with no plans announced to go into production.

So what gives?

It seems to me that some entity, possibly big oil, has bought out all of these for fear of wide scale adoption of EV’s by the public, which would result in less revenue for the oil multinationals. There is certainly someone standing in the way of EV production, but why all the red tape? This site , EV World is interesting.

So if EV’s can be bought up by TPTB in the name of $$$, then who can really say what other technologies may have been bought out by big oil or whomever? There’s nothing stopping it - it’s at least in the realm of possibilities.

Large corporations buying out competitive technologies/products is by no means unprecedented.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')If you were in possession of some knowledge of secrete energy technology, why would you hold it back?

[Z]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Omnitir', 'S')o what gives?

[Z]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Omnitir', 'B')ut what if your corporation that developed the technology was offered an insane amount of money by the richest people in the world to sell them the technology and sign an NDA? Would we put it beyond big oil and their powerful friends to buy up any competitive technologies that come along? Who can say for certain?

[sch_peakoiler]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Z', '
')The world is a big place and lotsa people are researching lots of things.

[Optimist]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hat if the government won't release it until they have too, and when they do they expect to make tons of money off it. And they believe their intelligence agencies can determine if other countries have come close to what they have discovered. You have to understand that the defense department has contingency plans for almost every situation. They have plans for invading and taking over almost every country. They must have some plan for peak oil. They don't seem to scared.

[aahala]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Omnitir', 'W')ell actually, electric cars are an example of this. The technology to mass-produce efficient and high performance plug in electric cars certainly exists, and there is certainly a growing demand for more fuel-efficient cars and likely EV’s. Several major car companies have produced EV’s on limited-lease test-runs, which were all well received. And yet mysteriously these vehicles disappeared with no plans announced to go into production.

So what gives?

[oilfreeandhappy]

I think Technologies get shelved. It's all about money! The first NiMH was manufactured by Ovonics battery, which at the time was 49% owned by Energy Conversion Devices, and 51% owned by GM. I think the 51% guarantees that GM could control the market of the battery. Interestingly, GM sold it's 51% stake to Texaco, which 2 months later was bought out by Chevron.

Now there's some interesting lawsuits that have Chevron in total control of the product, and according to this link (short article worth the reading), with their record oil profits, they're in no hurry to change anything.

http://www.soultek.com/blog/2004/12/cou ... -hold.html

Jim Gagnepain
http://home.comcast.net/~oil_free_and_happy/index.html

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'C')annot compete with ICE on numerous points. No conspiracy theories needed.

[Z]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', '-')range in normal driving (around town and highway ~200-300 miles)

[cube]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Rich7', 'A')nd they believe their intelligence agencies can determine if other countries have come close to what they have discovered.

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'L')ast numbers I heards where more 200-300 kilometers. And rather on the 200 side ( or lower side ). Quite a difference. People will need far more than that for a vehicle without a major overhaul of their life style ( i.e. peak oil ), even if they use bigger ranges only a few times each year.

Please provide actually sold vehicles ( with their prices ) that have this kind of range.

[pilferage]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Z', 'I')'m sorry but for now the market has decided that ICE vehicles were better than electric ones.

[Omnitir]

Okay, so it should be obvious now that EV’s are completely possible.
So again I ask, why isn’t this technology being mass produced? Is it really as simple as auto manufacturers wanting more profit thanks to less reliable ICE’s which have more parts? This just seems far to simplistic an explanation, and if it were in fact the case, couldn’t the auto manufacturers simply raise to cost of ICE’s to factor in this apparent lost revenue? Is the issue lack of consumer interest? There certainly doesn’t appear to be a lack of consumers wanting to escape high gasoline prices.

It does appear that for some reason, auto companies are in a sense keeping EV technology secret. Most people are simply not aware that EV’s are real and in many cases better then ICE’s. Earlier responses in this thread demonstrated that – even many peak oilers aren’t aware of EV’s, so how can the public at large be aware? It just seems like there is some barrier to certain technologies that present possible threats to income to the big players, and because of this they end up taking far too long to see the light of day.

It’s not inconceivable that other potentially beneficial technologies have been developed but will not see the light of day for quite a while because they threaten certain interests.

[mistel]

In the early part of the 1900's many sewing machine manufacurers went out of business or almost went out of business because they were producing sewing machines that were bullet-proof. Many of you can probably remember your grandmothers sewing machine that she still used that was 50,60, 70 plus years old. I think this would be comparable to an electric car that the only maintenance it would need would be the brushes changed after 500,000 miles (no tranny, no motor oil)

There was H Phylori (sp?) It was know for a decade that this viruis causes ulcers and could easily be treated with a one-time dose of anti-biotics. But the drug companies were making millions off of Malox and Tums so they kept it secret. My wife suffered from it and had the treatment

I know that here in Ontario, Canada the 4 gasoline refiners got together about 15 years ago and decieded that they were going to wipe out all the small independants. What they did is they eliminated the wholesale market for gas. If they were selling for .50 cents a liter at thier stations, that was also the wholesale price if you were an independant buying gas to resell.

I have also heard a story about a guy who developed a fuel cell that used plastic instead of platinum and got bought out, but that was " a guy who knew a guy" so I won't even attempt to present that as true. The first 3 examples are true.

There are many examples of companies keeping things secret for financial gain. These are not about energy technology, I think those secrets are better hidden.