[Newfie]

The point to the infrastructure maintenence issue is one of risk analysis, mitigation and maintenance.

It is fun and interesting to watch these big recovery operations. It is boring to sit in inerdisiplinary meetings to identify and rate risk events and their consequences. Bur far more efficient.

The failure is in recognizing the value of prior identification and mitigation vs recover and repair.

A stich in time saves nine.

[Tanada]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'B')altimore Bridge Collapse: New Underwater 3D Images Show "Sheer Magnitude" Of Salvage Operation Ahead

Yeah we get it. You're not just going to try and drag the mess out of the channel and post buoys over it like you do with every other underwater obstruction. You want to drag the 'mission' out, Justify your existence and get some practice with all your cool underwater tech. If the private sector was in control of this...

They should have given the job to these crews

[theluckycountry]

Of course, the dragging was just my opinion, I'm no engineer. I'm sure there are many ways to lift that junk but now it's in the hands of the military and that's that.
It's not important in the scheme of things anyway, one bridge, one port, hardly even compares to the typical Hurricane. Just another good reason to leave the cities. They are super vulnerable to all manner of disaster.

[Newfie]

That the cities are vulnerable to disaster is one reason we left.

30 some years ago I watched how Philly reacted to a good snow storm. It showed me just how easilybthencity can be immobilized.

We actually had a folding rowboat on our back step so we could drag it to the river and float downstream to our big boat if needed.

[theluckycountry]

Here is an interesting opinion piece.

"West Point Mafia" Has "Systematically Destroyed The Nation's Maritime Strength"

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'C')aptain John Konrad, CEO of gCaptain, a website specializing in tracking the shipping industry, blames the "West Point Mafia" and decades of land wars in the Middle East for a hollowed-out US Navy that was entirely "unprepared" for the salvage operation of the collapsed 1.6-mile-long Francis Scott Key Bridge in Baltimore, Maryland.

Konrad explained, "Truth is bridges are an Army Corps of Engineers responsibility but they are so unprepared they gave the job to Navy Salvage to lead. Navy salvage is so broken they had to outsource it to the US subsidiary/partner of a European firm which is chartering equipment from private companies at great expense."

"And it's the Army's own fault. The West Point Mafia has systematically destroyed our nation's maritime strength," he said, adding that China would've had the Baltimore shipping channel "fully cleared in weeks," not months (read more about the reopening timeline here).

[theluckycountry]

Container Ship Reportedly "Lost Power" In NYC Harbor, Right Before Verrazzano-Narrows Bridge https://www.zerohedge.com/commodities/c ... ows-bridge

It's another Russian conspiracy, Dammit!

[Newfie]

The US Navy has been having a tough go of it for a long time. I believe we have discussed some of the issues before. The several destroyer collisions have rather pointedly exposed some of the training and leadership issues. Then there is the litorial combat ship fiasco. And also that silly stealth destroyer.

Yet they are still orders of magnitude more capable than anyone else. And they are getting some good experience and training exercises in the Red Sea.

Cold comfort may be derived from knowing that other navies are having similar issues.

Back to the commercial vessles loosing power....
The Key Bridge ship had FIVE on board diesel generators. These are ships rely heavily upon automation and shore side maintenance and diagnostics. That means they have live internet connections to the ships vital systems.

While I do not know what happened, I would not be surprised to find the ships systems were hacked and the automation messed with. It is not impossible. I know that in shoreside control systems internet security against hacking was a very serious concern.

Finally, the news cycle is very reactive to major events, something I have witnessed personally. Once you have a major story (air crash, panel failure, ship crash) then every little bit of news related will be reported. It is not that ships are all of a sudden loosing power, these fares happen. It is just they are being reported be abuse they cqth the publics eye. Really skews our understanding of the situation.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', 'I')t is not that ships are all of a sudden loosing power, these fares happen. It is just they are being reported be abuse they cqth the publics eye. Really skews our understanding of the situation.

[Newfie]

No, the British Navy helped the UK, more than helped it was responsible for its existence.

[AgentR11]

I tell you whose Navy was useless, Germany's at the latter half of the 19th century. THAT is the definition of a useless, very expensive, Navy. Weren't very good in WW I either if I recall, though at least they left port...

The UK though, definitely top of the line all through last century, not doing terribly well at the moment with a certain very large, (non)combatant; but certainly still not out of the picture.

[Newfie]

Key Bridge collapse will keep main channel closed until end of May.

Here is 3 billion or so which could have been used for other purposes. Appropriate protections costs about $100 million going by work on the Delaware Twin Bridges. So we could have protected 30 bridges for that. They will likely spend that much now to protect exposed bridges.

[ralfy]

It's like that meme about declaring Ukraine as a dependent during tax time.

[Newfie]

It is also a cultural thing. My Wife and I are MAINTAINERS. Our ethic is to keep things going. Not very in vogue these days. During Covid we did a substantial rehab on our rental property, 1 unit was above average and 2 were pretty special. The 4th unit had been occupied for 19 years by a tenant and it had many, many issues. We spent a lot of money, many hundreds of hours, put in all new upgraded AC and made that last unit extremely nice. Some serious work there to return it to a period with a modern kitchen and superior layout.

We sold the place, got near asking (well over what realestate had suggested as asking) from a devoted. He has gutted the entire building back to the brick and joist. 1887 black walnut staircase? Gone. All he is gonna get out of it us 1 more apartment. We were already getting good rates, what the neighborhood could handle.

I have no clue what he is making decisions on. Center City rental market is awash with empty skyscrapers. Yes this is a desirable neighborhood, but that is changing fast. He will be near a million out of pocket on the rehab, plus cost of purchase, and 2 years lost revenue.

I suspect it is the lure of everything being "new"? He thinks he "new" will get more money? But "new" only lasts until the style, the mood, then it becomes "dated". And dated does not age well.

I tell this story because I think it reects something in the society vernacular. We are smitten with "new". We think new means "better".

I see this argument in CC discussions. People, rightly, claim we can build new much more efficient houses. Which is true, intelligent design, site planning, and money can create a zero energy house. But we can NOT create those houses for all of the condo and apartment dwelers in the cities. We do not have the resources to replace our housing entirely. And even the new houses are not designed for energy efficiency. Sure some nods like thicker insulation, but no site planning, and huge 2 story entrances.

As a society, culture, we have embraced " Ditch it, don't stitch it." And that is a problem. A big problem as our economy slows.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', 'I') tell this story because I think it reects something in the society vernacular. We are smitten with "new". We think new means "better".

I see this argument in CC discussions. People, rightly, claim we can build new much more efficient houses. Which is true, intelligent design, site planning, and money can create a zero energy house. ...

As a society, culture, we have embraced " Ditch it, don't stitch it." And that is a problem. A big problem as our economy slows.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', '.')..But they will drag it out for sure and cripple the economy up there. Nothing gets done in a hurry these days.

[theluckycountry]

meanwhile on the other side of the planet the US government is quickly building the massive Gaza Pier. Gaza has no deepwater ports to facilitate shipping so Uncle Sam will build them one. It's a massive $350 million endeavor (so by the time it's completed you could double that figure) https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ ... hallenging

The Americans are so kind hearted, they will forego their own infrastructure needs in place of the needs of the poor defenseless Hamas peoples.

[theluckycountry]

The Saga continues

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5s5Nq29_v0

[theluckycountry]

First Images Of American Taxpayers' $350 Million Completed Gaza Pier https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ ... -gaza-pier

Erected in lightning time too. Well done US Central Command, well done.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')The Ron Paul Institute's Daniel McAdams has pointed out: "Reminder to American taxpayers: This floating pier cost you $350 million (and counting), while using existing roads for aid delivery remain the most practical solution."

"The question is...why?" he wrote.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', '
')I believe the air industry is quite a different story, much better. So it is not beyond human ability to do better.

[Newfie]

50 years ago, 1970'w, there were a number of big airliner crashes that killed a lot of people. The industry got their act together and improved safety greatly. For the last 20 years the greatest cause of death in the industry has been pilot suicide.

That you are hearing of these relatively minor failures and that they are drawing so much attention really points to how much i.proved the industry has become.

Any industry can have failures, and the failures will be spotlighted by the press.

OTOH the Washington Metro has had a 30-40 year long run of accidents killing workers and passengers. It has been lambasted by the NTSB for its continued lack of safety awareness.

But it has a great PR program and prestige. So nothing gets fixed.

It would not shock me to see some incident there killing hundreds. And if that happens the press will be full of stories about how there has been continued warnings and failures. But not until then.