[Plantagenet]

What exactly has the EPA done that is supposed to be saving us from "mass extinction"?

1. The EPA raised the level of corn ethanol in gasoline to 15%.

2. The EPA doesn't require permits for CO2 emissions from corn ethanol plants.

The EPA claims this is good, because corn ethanol is "carbon neutral." But studies by scientists show that corn ethanol production is NOT carbon neutral---it actually uses more gas and releases MORE CO2 then the amount of gasoline it replaces. AND, distilling corn into ethanol diverts corn from food into fuel production, resulting in higher food prices.

While the EPA's support for corn ethanol is good for Archer Daniels Midland and other Agribusiness giants, most scientists believe it does nothing to reduce CO2 in the atmosphere-----in fact, it results in MORE CO2 in the atmosphere then you'd get just from buring oil. This means the EPAs policies are making Greenhouse Warming WORSE.

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', '
')On that I disagree. I do feel strongly that there is no hope of turning us from our apparent course.

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '[')b]the EPAs policies are making Greenhouse Warming WORSE.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'i')f we have a functional EPA ...

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', ' ')Palin...

[Newfie]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', '
')On that I disagree. I do feel strongly that there is no hope of turning us from our apparent course.

[Newfie]

I'm sorry for this but............

I've got this image of 10,000 grannies ripping their bras off and using them to fire to the EPA headquarters!

Good God, what an vision. If that doesn't put fear into the hearts of the administration I don't know what would.

[mos6507]

Just wait until social security bottoms out. Then we'll see the seniors take to the streets. We live in interesting times. Maybe if the GIs coming back from WWII had kept it in their pants we'd have been better off. Whatever happened to the poster who kept blaming everything on "baby boomers"?

[Newfie]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'J')ust wait until social security bottoms out. Then we'll see the seniors take to the streets. We live in interesting times. Maybe if the GIs coming back from WWII had kept it in their pants we'd have been better off. Whatever happened to the poster who kept blaming everything on "baby boomers"?

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'W')hat exactly has the EPA done that is supposed to be saving us from "mass extinction"?

1. The EPA raised the level of corn ethanol in gasoline to 15%.

2. The EPA doesn't require permits for CO2 emissions from corn ethanol plants.

The EPA claims this is good, because corn ethanol is "carbon neutral." But studies by scientists show that corn ethanol production is NOT carbon neutral---it actually uses more gas and releases MORE CO2 then the amount of gasoline it replaces. AND, distilling corn into ethanol diverts corn from food into fuel production, resulting in higher food prices.

While the EPA's support for corn ethanol is good for Archer Daniels Midland and other Agribusiness giants, most scientists believe it does nothing to reduce CO2 in the atmosphere-----in fact, it results in MORE CO2 in the atmosphere then you'd get just from buring oil. This means the EPAs policies are making Greenhouse Warming WORSE.

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'S')he's isn't in office and isn't making policy.

[Plantagenet]

The EPA's support for corn ethanol is INCREASING the amount of CO2 being released in the USA.

Cars using ethanol release about 30% less CO2....but they are 30% less powerful, so they have to use more fuel. AND the production of ethanol uses more oil for fertilizers, agricultural planting and harvesting. And still more oil during refining, transport, and mixing.

The net result is that the EPA is causing Greenhouse warming...not stopping it.

Here is a post from The Oil Drum explaining this... .The EPA is making Greenhouse Warming worse by mandating corn ethanol

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'T')he EPA's support for corn ethanol is INCREASING the amount of CO2 being released in the USA.

Cars using ethanol release about 30% less CO2....but they are 30% less powerful, so they have to use more fuel. AND the production of ethanol uses more oil for fertilizers, agricultural planting and harvesting. And still more oil during refining, transport, and mixing.

The net result is that the EPA is causing Greenhouse warming...not stopping it.

Here is a post from The Oil Drum explaining this... .The EPA is making Greenhouse Warming worse by mandating corn ethanol

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'A')nd guess what, everybody on this forum gets your modus operandi already. When I was just lurking here, I sometimes noticed others reply to you the way I am now, so don't make it seem like it's just me reacting this way. Shorty's been kicked off the forums again, finally, for not participating here in good faith and if there is any sanity left, you'll get bumped next, since you rarely if ever engage in these issues. It's all ulterior motive for you. All Obama all the time.

[rangerone314]

Neither Dems nor Republicans will do anything about climate change, and its probably too late to prevent it.

Stupid kudzu apes might as well be stumbling around the magazine room on a ship striking matches.

The best you can hope for to stop climate change would be Yellowstone caldera erupting and putting and end to the industrial age and most farming.

[rangerone314]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', '
')On that I disagree. I do feel strongly that there is no hope of turning us from our apparent course.

[Mesuge]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rangerone314', ' ')I hope we can get some isolationist Republicans in power, then maybe BAU can continue long enough for my preps to be finished.

[AirlinePilot]

Mos,

I agree with your original post. I also tend to agree with others here who point to the fact that at this point it probably doesn't matter who or what party you back. They are all criminally inept. Except for a very few members of each party the dissonance, the arrogance, the ignorance on climate and energy issues is so thick you could cut it with a knife. Without knowledge and understanding of our current predicament no enlightenment will occur. BAU will be FOUGHT FOR until it can't be.

I'm a believer that the path has been set, we lost any real shot at solving any of this about 20-25 years ago. The real place to look for any sort of "help' is your local community and neighborhood. Grass roots is going to be the only way to start something that can take hold. Unfortunately in our dumbed down soundbite, clown car internet world, there is ALWAYS a way to find what one thinks is credible information to support one's world view. By that I mean that the majority of folks are in denial about all this and spurring action is difficult at best and nearly insurmountable at worst.

I believe that nothing substantial will change and the only real catalyst will be near catastrophic social unrest and economic dislocation on a grand scale. We are not the humans we were 30-40 or 100 years ago. We have become lazy, fat, and stupid. We all know what it means here. We more than most understand the implications. Peddling that to someone who has completely embraced the happy motoring consumptive lifestyle will be nearly impossible until it smacks them upside the head.

Good luck changing that paradigm...thats why I have and always will be a slow crash doomer.

[Nefarious]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')y that I mean that the majority of folks are in denial about all this and spurring action is difficult at best and nearly insurmountable at worst.

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Nefarious', '
')5.Food delivery service
6.McRib
7.Obesity and sleep