PeakOil is You
Fear
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Re: Fear
by fleance » Thu 26 Nov 2015, 22:48:41
Fear is hard to deal. I believe anxiety attack start in our mind. If we keep thinking of things such as problems and things that we fear. Or see our status or society as hopeless due to bad fate/evil things that is happening in our society. Then, all these things cannot handle anymore. This is where anxiety comes.
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Re: Fear
by onlooker » Sat 28 Nov 2015, 17:32:48
Fear is a natural emotion and feeling in a human being. I would say that their are clear and present dangers in this world that hover over in different degrees every human and thus the sense of anxiety that exists. We are talking about physical well being, pain and death. To me it is instructive how Ibon relates that fear seems to be more controlled in other countries than in the US. In answer to the general inquiry posed by the original post, I would say that I am a firm believer in their is nothing to fear but fear itself. Fear paralyzes and also sets humans against humans. In the future we must renounce as much as possible fear and proceed along paths whereby we try to care and have empathy for each other recognizing that we all are humans with a natural fear of pain and death. So that going forward we recognize that uniting we can better deal with the challenges ahead then being divided and in conflict. For the future will conspire to divide us via fear ,long standing biases and grudges and ultimately key resource shortages. But by uniting as much as possible we can gain the needed sense of support that is lacking now in our micro individualistic culture that begets the defensive and ultimately fearful mindset of the porcupine or mouse which is the same mindset of "me against the world"
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Re: Fear
by Ibon » Sat 28 Nov 2015, 18:03:35
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('onlooker', 'F')ear is a natural emotion and feeling in a human being. I would say that their are clear and present dangers in this world that hover over in different degrees every human and thus the sense of anxiety that exists. We are talking about physical well being, pain and death. To me it is instructive how Ibon relates that fear seems to be more controlled in other countries than in the US. In answer to the general inquiry posed by the original post, I would say that I am a firm believer in their is nothing to fear but fear itself. Fear paralyzes and also sets humans against humans. In the future we must renounce as much as possible fear and proceed along paths whereby we try to care and have empathy for each other recognizing that we all are humans with a natural fear of pain and death. So that going forward we recognize that uniting we can better deal with the challenges ahead then being divided and in conflict. For the future will conspire to divide us via fear ,long standing biases and grudges and ultimately key resource shortages. But by uniting as much as possible we can gain the needed sense of support that is lacking now in our micro individualistic culture that begets the defensive and ultimately fearful mindset of the porcupine or mouse which is the same mindset of "me against the world"
Onlooker, what you wrote is an enlightened ideal of what we should do. The issue here in times of human overshoot is to let the consequences guide our ideology. The other way around is not possible any more. We cannot evolve culturally any longer in my opinion starting with an ideal that we should all follow. There are too many conflicts and negative feedbacks to any longer expect a large humanistic movement to take root and flourish. There is just too much fear, too much division, to much desire for conflict.
This is all my opinion at the moment and I welcome rebuttals on this and or agreement because we are in new territory here and we are trying to figure out where the juggernaut of over populated and over consuming humans are heading.
I think the mass of humanity will react and be driven by fear and anger and this will eventually lead us toward some bad decisions; resource wars, increase ethnic and racial conflicts, anti immigrant, closing the doors in the future to climate refugees. I don't want to isolate anyone in particular as representative but if we take Cog as an example I think he demonstrates many of these traits.
I think a more enlightened humanistic response will not come from the mainstream, it will represent a counter culture movement.
Think about ISIS, think about how this death cult has the power to create a strong bonded brotherhood among the members. A we vs they is a very powerful force especially when harnessed by a religion that has ancient tenants that support this warrior position.
My point is that eventually a humanistic movement based on compassion and love can have the same powerful unity and brotherhood especially if it is a counter movement to a mainstream driven by fear and hate and anger. In other words, forget about cultural change coming from the mainstream and forget about trying to enlighten the masses. Change will come from the fringe movements standing in stark contrast to the masses going down the toilet of fear and war, That is when we see the possibility of a birth of a new ideology. This is how new religions form. New human ethics. New ideologies. Not from the place of saying what we should be doing but forming out of the chaos resulting from the masses going down the toilet.
This is all hypothetical. I am only describing this as a way of explaining how one day, out of chaos, we might give birth to a new ideology. Consequences lead to a new ideology. Not ideology first trying to change the heads of fearful humans.
I don't think we can escape the upcoming chaos.
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Re: Fear
by Newfie » Sat 28 Nov 2015, 22:28:25
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ibon', 'T')his is mouse and porcupine strategy and your orientation is because you are reacting to the collective fear.
Ds & Rs are just different. Ask most any R about the protests in Chicago last night and they will likely show signs of fear at a mob of mad blacks and defend the cop who shot the wired up and knife wielding black kid.
Ask a (white) D and they may show fear of black mobs too but they will be more prone to ask why it took a year for the charges and video to come out.
The Rs are the party of the majority. As such they can affect an independent cowboy attitude while waxing about small government. But at the same time they vote consistently for a strong authoritarian, religiously intolerant, even militaristic government: "law and order" dontcha know.
D are the party of minorities, you name the group, they have a plank. And yeah, Ds are afraid of other minorities too, and guns, but they are also afraid of authoritarian government.
Not the "oh, yuck, not more building permits" government, the "on your knees: bang, bang (x16)" government.
FWIW. My Wife recently came across some research that purports to show some difference in brain function between R's and D's that suggested R's are more driven by fear.
In short those who inherit a relatively fearful mindset become R's, the less fearful become D's.
Don't know for sure, just putting it out there, sharing some info.
Last edited by Newfie on Sat 28 Nov 2015, 22:44:03, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fear
by Newfie » Sat 28 Nov 2015, 22:39:20
Ibon,
I've spent a lot of time in a Humanist grouping. I became pretty dissatisfied.
For one the emphasis on "human". IMHO humanity needs to find a way to fit into the Natural world. The Humanist pay lip service to this concept but don't really get it. They are far too concerned with the human to and fro and essentially discard the natural. Of course they would protest loudly I'm wrong, but listen to their conversation, I'm not.
Secondly they, like so many others, seem to have no leadership, no focus. They get behind and belong to so many other "good" causes they have no cause of their own, no identity, no cohesion. They want to be everyone's friend and no ones enemy. That's fine, but it also means you stand for nothing substantial.
A few in the movement share some of my concerns, it we are a minority.
Of course I'm speaking in generalities and of a specific group of self proclaimed Humanist. It is what I observed.
I've spent a lot of time in a Humanist grouping. I became pretty dissatisfied.
For one the emphasis on "human". IMHO humanity needs to find a way to fit into the Natural world. The Humanist pay lip service to this concept but don't really get it. They are far too concerned with the human to and fro and essentially discard the natural. Of course they would protest loudly I'm wrong, but listen to their conversation, I'm not.
Secondly they, like so many others, seem to have no leadership, no focus. They get behind and belong to so many other "good" causes they have no cause of their own, no identity, no cohesion. They want to be everyone's friend and no ones enemy. That's fine, but it also means you stand for nothing substantial.
A few in the movement share some of my concerns, it we are a minority.
Of course I'm speaking in generalities and of a specific group of self proclaimed Humanist. It is what I observed.
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Re: Fear
by Plantagenet » Sat 28 Nov 2015, 22:58:01
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', '
')Ask a (white) D and they may show fear of black mobs too but they will be more prone to ask why it took a year for the charges and video to come out.
')Ask a (white) D and they may show fear of black mobs too but they will be more prone to ask why it took a year for the charges and video to come out.
Isn't it obvious what was going on? Why would white Ds not immediately see that the racist Ds who control Chicago---from the Mayor on down---- were trying to cover up the murder of a young black man by the Chicago Police.
Thats why it took a year for the charges and the video to come out.
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As far as humanists go ---Years ago when I lived in Boston I went to a few meetings of the "ethical humanists, but they did seem pretty feckless. Have you tried the Unitarians ---or even the Society of Friends (Quakers)?
Never underestimate the ability of Joe Biden to f#@% things up---Barack Obama
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