[ROCKMAN]

Newfie - "Do you have a link to ballot stuffing?" Just search "Michigan voter irregularities" and you'll get more links from a wide variety of sources then you'll want to read. I saw one report that in several precincts that voted heavily for Secretary Clinton there was a 100% turnout. Yes: every registered voter supposedly cast a vote. You buy that? Here's a piece from

http://www.wnd.com/2016/12/recount-unco ... n-detroit/

There’s something fishy going on in Michigan, where a full one-third of precincts in Wayne County – which includes Detroit – were unable to have ballots counted due to discrepancies with ballot counts. And one person reports single ballots being counted as many as six times.

On Wednesday, a federal judge halted Michigan’s recount after two days of ballot counting, saying there’s not a legitimate reason to continue. After all, Green Party candidate Jill Stein, who asked for the recount – suggesting the possibility of vote fraud and stating, “We must have a system we can be confident in” – never even had a chance of winning with just 1 percent of the vote.

But the judge’s decision came just after news reports began surfacing of possible vote fraud. The worst of the problems were in Wayne County, Michigan’s largest county, where 66 percent of voters cast their ballots for Hillary Clinton and just 29 percent for Donald Trump. There was such a problem, the Detroit News reported, “Officials couldn’t reconcile vote totals for 610 of 1,680 precincts during a countywide canvass of vote results late last month.” The Detroit paper continued, “Most of those are in heavily Democratic Detroit, where the number of ballots in precinct poll books did not match those of voting machine printout reports in 59 percent of precincts, 392 of 662.”

And understand the Detroit paper story comes from a outfit that has always strongly supported D politicians...always.

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2016/12/recount-unco ... aDDqtW1.99

[vtsnowedin]

The recount in Michigan has been stopped by court order. Any further action will come later by State or Federal justice departments.
Watch for ballots and other evidence to disappear between now and the time a Trump Department of justice could begin an investigation. Destroying that evidence will also be a crime and might be what they get them for.

[Subjectivist]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Outcast_Searcher', 'I')f it's accurate and verified that there are far more democrat votes in 3 Detroit precincts than registered voters, why isn't this big news? Why don't I find hits for this story in the MSM via Google searches?

When I do general searches for things like "more votes than voters", I find things like 2012 Snopes denials of the veracity.

When I add things like 'Detroit" or "Michigan" and "2016", I get no MSM hits.

When I search on clarityelections or clarityelections.com, I don't seem to get hits that let me establish the veracity (or impartiality) of this source.

So is this stuff for real, or are these early wild-eyed (completely unverified) partisan claims?

By the way, I'm NOT saying this isn't true. I'm trying to establish whether many credible, supposedly objective sources are willing to state it's true.

So far, unless I can find much better sources to verify this, it sounds more like urban legend than facts.

[ROCKMAN]

vt - Been thinking the same thing. But more about CA and noncitizen voters. Have read that it's very easy for non-citizens to LEGALLY get a CA drivers license. And often the applicant is asked if they want to take care of voter registration at the same time. Supposedly one audit of new driver's license registration showed 30% of the non-US citizens given a license were also registered to vote. The very unofficial estimate is that 2 to 3 million non-US citizens are actually on the CA voter registration list.

[Cog]

I'm thinking Michigan uses the same procedure as Illinois does. On election day, we have a card for every voter in that precinct who has not already voted in early voting or had requested an absentee ballot. When the voter shows up in line, that card is pulled and put right on top of their signed request for a ballot form. That is then put in a binder. At the end of the night, whatever is on the tally on the ballot machine should match how many requests for a ballot forms are in the binder.

There is always some screwups, spoiled ballots, maybe they mismarked their ballot, or the voter had to register on the spot because we didn't have a card for them in the file. But the numbers should be relatively close. In the precinct I worked, I think we had a mismatch of about ten between the ballots that were handed out and that the machine recorded. That was in about five thousand votes cast at that location with early voting and election day voting. We were able to account for eight of those as spoiled ballots. So we were only off two votes we couldn't account for.

Something is up in Detroit and the county surrounding it. Something more than just being sloppy.

[Outcast_Searcher]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Subjectivist', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Outcast_Searcher', '
')...

So is this stuff for real, or are these early wild-eyed (completely unverified) partisan claims?

By the way, I'm NOT saying this isn't true. I'm trying to establish whether many credible, supposedly objective sources are willing to state it's true.

So far, unless I can find much better sources to verify this, it sounds more like urban legend than facts.

[Outcast_Searcher]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ROCKMAN', 'v')t - Been thinking the same thing. But more about CA and noncitizen voters. Have read that it's very easy for non-citizens to LEGALLY get a CA drivers license. And often the applicant is asked if they want to take care of voter registration at the same time. Supposedly one audit of new driver's license registration showed 30% of the non-US citizens given a license were also registered to vote. The very unofficial estimate is that 2 to 3 million non-US citizens are actually on the CA voter registration list.

[Newfie]

This is one of those cases where you have to read Snopes carefully.

According to Snopes the claim California made it LEGAL for noncitizens to vote is false.

However they do note that it is POSSIBLE for noncitizens to obtain a drivers license and get registered to vote. They need to show identification which USUALLY indicates citizenship.

I just had to replace my PA drivers license. They asked if I was a US citizen and if I wanted to register to vote. They did not ask for proof of citizenship. I suppose they could verify through my SSN, but not likely in the 15 seconds or so the questionnaire took.

So I wonder, how many states REQUIRE proof of citizenship (CA does not) in order to vote?

[ROCKMAN]

Outcast - Here's some links for you:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/11 ... -home.html

Voter fraud'? California man finds dozens of ballots stacked outside home

Jerry Mosna was gardening outside his San Pedro, Calif., home Saturday when he noticed something odd: Two stacks of 2016 ballots on his mailbox. The 83 ballots, each unused, were addressed to different people, all supposedly living in his elderly neighbor’s two-bedroom apartment. “I think this is spooky,” Mosna said. “All the different names, none we recognize, all at one address.” His wife, Madalena Mosna, noted their 89-year-old neighbor lives by herself, and, “Eighty people can’t fit in that apartment.”

They took the ballots to the Los Angeles Police Department, but were directed to the post office. They felt little comfort there would be an investigation, and called another neighbor, John Cracchiolo – who contacted the Los Angeles County Registrar's office.

And: http://www.latimes.com/politics/essenti ... story.html

Leaders of the California Republican Party are alleging that the state's online voter registration system is susceptible to voter fraud, and say they are considering possible legal action in the days or weeks to come. "The [California] secretary of state's website does not track the IP addresses of the people who register to vote," Dhillon said in a phone interview. "You could literally register hundreds or thousands of people from the same computer."

When asked Tuesday how a single computer used to register multiple voters might be an indicator of fraud, Dhillon said she believes such a situation makes investigating fraudulent activity more difficult. But she said she does not support any ban on public computers for registering voters, such as the ones used in libraries.

The voter registration website, which asks for personal information, including a driver's license number and the last four digits of a Social Security number, was launched in 2012. State elections officials boasted last month of a record number of voter registration visits — more than half a million — on the website over two days in late October.

Not sure if it's fraud but truly odd: 84,000 folks in Michigan voted that day but DID NOT VOTE for a POTUS? From:

http://realtimepolitics.com/2016/11/28/ ... s-is-huge/

[vox_mundi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ROCKMAN', 'v')t - Been thinking the same thing. But more about CA and noncitizen voters. Have read that it's very easy for non-citizens to LEGALLY get a CA drivers license. And often the applicant is asked if they want to take care of voter registration at the same time. Supposedly one audit of new driver's license registration showed 30% of the non-US citizens given a license were also registered to vote. The very unofficial estimate is that 2 to 3 million non-US citizens are actually on the CA voter registration list.

[Cog]

I know in Illinois we did early voting and election day registration to vote. The only thing that was required was a picture id(of any kind) and something showing your address such as a utility bill or check with your address on it. So yes you could register to vote without showing citizenship if you had an employee id card. In theory, a company should not be hiring you without verifying your immigration status but it does happen in certain industries.

[vtsnowedin]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Outcast_Searcher', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Subjectivist', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Outcast_Searcher', '
')...

So is this stuff for real, or are these early wild-eyed (completely unverified) partisan claims?

By the way, I'm NOT saying this isn't true. I'm trying to establish whether many credible, supposedly objective sources are willing to state it's true.

So far, unless I can find much better sources to verify this, it sounds more like urban legend than facts.

[Newfie]

Trying to answer my own question (over a VERY slow connection) about motor/voter rules I've come to this.

Many states do NOT require prof of citizenship in order to get either a DL or to register to vote. These include PA, VA, and CA among others. They ASK if you are a citizen but either have lax proof standards or none at all.

Federal motor voter legislation requires states to improve registration rates but does NOT require them to prove you are a citizen.

Real ID legislation, enacted in 2005 DOES require states to prove legal status. To date o my about half of states comply. States NOT in compliance include WA, OR, CA, MI, VA, PA, NY.

[vtsnowedin]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', 'T')rying to answer my own question (over a VERY slow connection) about motor/voter rules I've come to this.

Many states do NOT require prof of citizenship in order to get either a DL or to register to vote. These include PA, VA, and CA among others. They ASK if you are a citizen but either have lax proof standards or none at all.

Federal motor voter legislation requires states to improve registration rates but does NOT require them to prove you are a citizen.

Real ID legislation, enacted in 2005 DOES require states to prove legal status. To date o my about half of states comply. States NOT in compliance include WA, OR, CA, MI, VA, PA, NY.

[Newfie]

Vox,
To your post above re CA. I think you are misunderstanding. What you say is true, what it MEANS is CA is NOT real ID compliant. That is they don't check for citizenship. That the card is not certifying voter eligibility is moot. The question is did they certify eligibility to vote at the time of getting a license? They answer is NO. CA and does NOT check for voter eligibility, it is self reporting, NOT reauired.

[Newfie]

Just got this gem in my inbox. From Change.com. 70,000 signatures so far.

Letter to
Minority Leader, US House of Representatives Nancy Pelosi
Senator Charles Schumer
Senator Bernie Sanders
Senator Elizabeth Warren
Postpone Electoral College Vote and Inauguration, Pending Investigation

Given the news that Russia meddled in our American election with the express purpose of electing Trump, that affects the validity of the election! I am hoping we can nullify the election results, and postpone the Electoral College vote and inauguration until Congress can act upon determining a valid President-elect.
OK

[Cog]

Donald Trump will be inaugurated on January 20th.

a) Peacefully
b) Over the dead bodies of thousands of leftists

Choose one

[Newfie]

The petition is not fake. Stupid, but not fake.