[highlander]

Are you really in Metro Houston Aaron? you know, the place where all the Katrina evacuees landed, crime (especially violent crime) skyrocketed? What do you mean it wouldn't happen there?
Maybe not on your watch, but it's a big city! (like Chicago)

[NEOPO]

One of my first memories is of my mother being beaten and many memories after that are of the same thing as well as myself suffering physical abuse.
I will probably write a book one day.

Around the age of 8 or 9 I began pushing back - hard.
I have fought people in my own family that most could not imagine ever being able to raise a fist against.

For years it seemed to be my place to defend those incapable of defending themselves or at least if it was not my place then I made it mine.

A brick flies through the front room window - There is no hesitation, fear is non existent and you feel no pain - until it is over anyways.
It has nothing to do with honor or glory or many of the things people equate with "battle".

For me - It is one of the strongest instinctual urges and sadly it seems to have been bred out of most of us.
The worst part of these kind of scenarios is just prior to the real violence, as you watch the perp get angry and go for someones throat, in an instant you must become more aggressive then they and for someone sort of passive like myself it isnt that easy.
Usually when it was over I felt very bad as the person I had to correct was more then likely someone I deeply loved.

Its not just women who need help sometimes but also children and even other men.

This guy - no problemo - drunks are easy and drunks beating on women are the easiest kind of pussy for me to want to bring down.
Compared to my life's experiences checking this guy would have been a simple pleasure.

[WildRose]

I know I would intervene, so would my husband. Heck, even our kids would. I think it depends a lot on how you view bullying behavior.

Where I live, my guess is some people would react and stop the beating, but just as many would not, mainly because of fear of getting involved.

This past New Year's Eve I was out with the family celebrating at an outdoor event downtown. It happened that a fellow was running away from four or five guys who were rolling up their shirtsleeves and taking off their belts. They proceeded to get this guy on the ground, kicking him repeatedly in the head. I stood and yelled at the top of my voice, "STOP", getting security's attention and ending the skirmish. Maybe the guy deserved what he was getting, I don't know, but I can't stand by and watch someone die from repeated kicks to the head.

Last week at the grocery store, I overheard a guy talking to his two young kids and his wife/girlfriend in a really demeaning, threatening manner and the bristles just went up on the back of my neck. I could just imagine what life was like for them at home. This kind of stuff really bothers me.

[Aaron]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('highlander', 'A')re you really in Metro Houston Aaron? you know, the place where all the Katrina evacuees landed, crime (especially violent crime) skyrocketed? What do you mean it wouldn't happen there?
Maybe not on your watch, but it's a big city! (like Chicago)

[Jack]

And if you killed him - i.e., used deadly force against him - I suspect you would be charged with manslaughter at least. The tape might have been seen by the jury - or his attorney might have gotten a motion to suppress that evidence since it might "inflame the jury".

Juries are unpredictable. You might get exonerated. You might get convicted.

After that, expect a wrongful death suit. You would, almost certainly, be sued.

And that calculus is why no one wanted to get involved. The courts have sought for years to eliminate self-help. The society has sought to make its various inhabitants dependent and servile - thus, those who act will be perceived as being in the wrong.

Now, how does anyone suppose law enforcement will behave when they are overloaded, facing explosive increases in crime, constant demands for services, and countless numbers of victims? Does anyone really think they, or the courts, will be fastidious about protecting your civil rights or mine?

Unless and until complete societal breakdown, it would be advisable to think very carefully about one's choices. Or even posting what one's choices might be.

None of which applies to those seeking a one-way ticket to the farm.

[holmes]

yes I would have lead piped his skull. Definately Cracked his skull as he beat her down. The one dude came up behind him. That would have been me but with a lead pipe. Just standing there is abslutely ludicrous. But it is an urban enslavement area. Those cities humans are just rats and serfs. Not much life out in them. Lot of walking dead.

[holmes]

yes I can realate to Texans. My uncle gots land and lives down in Bayside on the gulf.

[smallpoxgirl]

Does anyone else find it in incredibly poor taste that the FOX station that's hosting that video is advertising a kick boxing tournament alongside it?

[I_Like_Plants]

That's pretty much standard stuff, this case just happened to be videotaped.

The difference in the US is, I was telling a bulgarian friend about my evil hillbilly neighbors, and the bulgarian told me back in bulgaria, you don't call the police, the neighborhood gets together and beats the holy shit out of them - bad enough so it never happens again.

Living where I am, with fairly decent police (translation: hungry to crack heads) the best option was to work with them, result: hillbillies appear to be gone.

In small-town, truly rural US, you carry a gun and you're ready to use it - the lady would have a gun behind the counter if not on her, and a few well-armed regulars would be around too - the guy who beat her up would be found dead by a drainage ditch somewhere and it would be blamed on illegal immigrants.

But, getting back to US culture in general - I grew up in Hawaii, where the "Beef" or fight to contend finer points of ..... well, anything .... is a way of life. New Samoan or Tahitian immigrants were enthusiastic participants in the "Beef" way of life, and I was talking at a bus stop with an older white guy who'd been around the Pacific quite a bit, hell, he'd probably fought in WWII in fact almost certainly had.

He had a very interesting viewpoint - all over the Pacific and especially in Hawaii where TV ownership was universal, you'd turn on the TV and see American movies. John Wayne! And all the imitators, and there were all these fight scenes. Fight, fight, fight. The old guy told me traditional culture isn't like that, but they see this new stuff and want to fit in, to be modern, and when they'd move to Hawaii, to be American. And all they'd see on TV from John Wayne to Popeye, was all this fighting and violence. Keep in mind this guy's talking about TV in the 1970s, with lots of re-runs and old movies and cartoons and stuff dating back into the 1930s.

Now, if you're making this new thing called the motion picture, or this new thing called an animated cartoon, you want to show the public something interesting. Firemen running around putting out fires were good scenes, the notorious train heading right at the audience, funny stuff with those newfangled auto-mo-biles, leading to the establishment of the standard chase scene. But, just like on the real Main Street, nothing attracts attention like a fight. So, movies and cartoons relied on tension and people fighting to get and hold attention from the start. Ours was always an expansionist, Indian-killin', young culture, where your family was moving from the Big Woods to Cherry Creek to the Prairie, so kids grew up establishing "turf" and our culture's been a pretty violent one anyway, but I am not exaggerating or being an old biddy when I say it's the TV and the movies. Then you had comic books - again, tons of fighting, heck all the superheroes do is fight.

It took me a while to digest what this old guy told me, but I ended up feeling sorry for these "Beefers", traditional Samoan and Tahitian etc culture is kind of physical, but not at all as tense, violent, and alienated as our own.

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('I_Like_Plants', 'I')n small-town, truly rural US, you carry a gun and you're ready to use it - the lady would have a gun behind the counter if not on her, and a few well-armed regulars would be around too - the guy who beat her up would be found dead by a drainage ditch somewhere and it would be blamed on illegal immigrants.

[Eli]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jack', '<')/div>

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hus conscience does make cowards of us all;
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o'er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action.

Hamlet

[Jack]

Ahh, Eli - Shakespeare's insights, from Hamlet, no less.

Well done!

[holmes]

if that occurred in my chill out home town he would be gone immediately. word would have gotten out and the thug would be buried. Local cops never would even have a scumbag on the force like that. They still are servants to the citizens down thar. Isolated still thank god from the parasitic humanoids. I say cut off the arterials out of all the cities and napalm the shit out of them. Fk the cities. cluster bombs work wonders on those sardine cans. Ive always wondered how and what citiots think? They are completely different species than my kind thats for sure. I connot understand their thought processes. I ahve to say its very enslavement oriented. They like to be bound up and gagged with a rubber ball. Gimps basically it seems. a feeble whelp waif.

[holmes]

yes that is good. hamlet!

[Jack]

On a lighter, and utterly impractical note...

Wouldn't it be amusing to fire a taser into the erstwhile officer's ample rump, then apply a charge?

But that would be wrong. I would never advocate such an act.

[max_power29]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jack', 'A')nd if you killed him - i.e., used deadly force against him - I suspect you would be charged with manslaughter at least. The tape might have been seen by the jury - or his attorney might have gotten a motion to suppress that evidence since it might "inflame the jury".

Juries are unpredictable. You might get exonerated. You might get convicted.

After that, expect a wrongful death suit. You would, almost certainly, be sued.

And that calculus is why no one wanted to get involved. The courts have sought for years to eliminate self-help. The society has sought to make its various inhabitants dependent and servile - thus, those who act will be perceived as being in the wrong.

Now, how does anyone suppose law enforcement will behave when they are overloaded, facing explosive increases in crime, constant demands for services, and countless numbers of victims? Does anyone really think they, or the courts, will be fastidious about protecting your civil rights or mine?

Unless and until complete societal breakdown, it would be advisable to think very carefully about one's choices. Or even posting what one's choices might be.

None of which applies to those seeking a one-way ticket to the farm.

[max_power29]

I love the irony when law enFORCEment gets busted by the very big brother type technology that they love so much.

[Roy]

Regarding the bystanders:

The perp had already beaten the guy standing on the left. The first run in with the bartender was her protecting the guy who'd been beaten already.

Watch here

The link is an interview of the bartender and an explanation of what happened.

And yes, I think most men would intervene in that situation. I know I would.

Also, I've seen other videos where people were beaten down in public and no one did a thing. Everyone's scared to death to get involved for fear of their own safety.. ie lawsuits, prosecution, or getting beaten/killed by the perp.

Sad.

[Kingcoal]

Lethal force used in this particular case would most definitely be answered by an indictment simply because an example would have to be set that killing cops will not be condoned. During your trial, the video would be showed over and over, in order to desensitize (Rodney King) the jury. Then the prosecution would focus on the fact that the bartender got up and walked away. They would focus on the fact that she was not mortally wounded and thus her life was not in danger. You would be portrayed as a vigilante in the press and the courtroom. You would eventually find yourself prosecuted for homicide and sentenced to jail. There would be outrage over your fate, but not much more than that.

Because of the above, bullies like this one feel assured that they can hand out an ass whopping at any time without much consequence. As for me, I believe that an armed society is a polite one. It shouldn't matter how an incident like this turns out, meaning, it shouldn't matter that this guy didn't seriously wound the bartender. The only thing that should matter is that he was violently attacking her and AT THAT INSTANT IN TIME; lethal force was justified in her defense, period, end of discussion. In other words, be polite, or you might get shot!

[Aaron]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', 'L')ethal force used in this particular case would most definitely be answered by an indictment simply because an example would have to be set that killing cops will not be condoned. During your trial, the video would be showed over and over, in order to desensitize (Rodney King) the jury. Then the prosecution would focus on the fact that the bartender got up and walked away. They would focus on the fact that she was not mortally wounded and thus her life was not in danger. You would be portrayed as a vigilante in the press and the courtroom. You would eventually find yourself prosecuted for homicide and sentenced to jail. There would be outrage over your fate, but not much more than that.

Because of the above, bullies like this one feel assured that they can hand out an ass whopping at any time without much consequence. As for me, I believe that an armed society is a polite one. It shouldn't matter how an incident like this turns out, meaning, it shouldn't matter that this guy didn't seriously wound the bartender. The only thing that should matter is that he was violently attacking her and AT THAT INSTANT IN TIME; lethal force was justified in her defense, period, end of discussion. In other words, be polite, or you might get shot!