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Page added on January 6, 2020
The World Turned Upside Down
The transition from fossil fuels to renewables and its geopolitical consequences
124 Comments on "The World Turned Upside Down"
John on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 11:05 am
Global oil consumption in 2000 was 80 million barrels, today it is 100 million barrels.
Coal consumption unfortunately has been increasing again.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/265507/global-coal-consumption-in-oil-equivalent/
and gas consumption is now 4,000 billion cubic meters
https://www.bp.com/content/dam/bp/business-sites/en/global/corporate/pdfs/energy-economics/statistical-review/bp-stats-review-2019-full-report.pdf
The only thing that is being turned upside Down is the climate
Duncan Idaho on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 11:29 am
‘Cats,’ a big-screen fiasco, is delighting and frightening stoned audiences
https://www.sfgate.com/entertainment/article/Cats-a-big-screen-fiasco-is-delighting-and-14952844.php
I haven’t viewed it—
(Maybe it wasn’t shallow enough for the proletariat?)
Outcast_Searcher on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 1:37 pm
John: Give it another 30 years.
The problem, of course, is whether mitigation will be feasible by then, unless we do more, more quickly.
But trying is better than throwing up our hands and bleating doom constantly.
Outcast_Searcher on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 1:38 pm
Duncan: Problems focusing on the topic?
Attn: Outcast on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 3:09 pm
@ Outcast
A family member, friend, or good samaritan should drop a hit of ‘cid in your drink or food. It would do wonders getting the stick stuck up your arse out. Personally, I prefer window pane acid.
makati1 on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 6:58 pm
Waste of time. The only “transition” will be to renewable muscle power, nothing techie beyond a shovel and rake.
It it ain’t profitable, it ain’t gonna happen.
ANAL REAPER on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 9:29 pm
You’re all a bunch of fucking nigger faggots
ANAL REAPER on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 9:33 pm
Daddy’s home and he’s feelin’ like a man. Why do you think my name is ANAL?
Dumbass.
Cloggie on Tue, 7th Jan 2020 10:45 am
Trump claims that wind turbines kill a lot of birds. Is he right?
https://deepresource.wordpress.com/2020/01/07/do-wind-turbines-kill-birds/
(Spoiler: no)
makati1 on Tue, 7th Jan 2020 5:37 pm
On this rainy Wednesday morning, I am hearing the faint sounds of Amerikan war drums in the distance. They get louder every day but are sounding a long distance from the Philippines. That is a GOOD thing! Keep them in the ME, EU and US and out of Asia.
Just more proof of Amerikan isolation and suicide. Only the deaf, blind and stupid could not see it. But then, denial is rampant in the Fascist Police State. The “distractions” are so numerous, it is impossible to list all of them, until the body bags start coming home.
The Amerikan brainwashing goes on as the USMSM preps the tax slaves for the new war. The Fed printing presses are warning up to print the faux trillions needed to fight it. The value of the USD slides into the negative. Hold gold and get out of debt!
Yes, 2020 is going to be exciting. Buckle up, and, if you are not directly involved, enjoy the show. Pass the popcorn.
JuanP on Tue, 7th Jan 2020 5:44 pm
I am with you Mak. It will be a great week of Americans getting their asses tagged!
onlooker on Tue, 7th Jan 2020 7:02 pm
Suddenly the US empire is becoming the hunted. Good
https://7news.com.au/news/conflict/iran-launches-multiple-missiles-at-us-base-in-iraq-c-637856?utm_campaign=share-icons&utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&tid=1578442924754
onlooker on Tue, 7th Jan 2020 7:25 pm
https://www.rt.com/news/477680-iran-more-retaliation-strikes/
Davy is stupid on Tue, 7th Jan 2020 7:44 pm
This is from stupid:
JuanP said I am with you Mak. It will be a great week of Americans getting their asses…
Davy Sock on Tue, 7th Jan 2020 10:42 pm
ANAL REAPER on Mon, 6th Jan 2020 9:33 pm
Cloggie on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 4:47 am
The world one giant robot:
https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/driverless-bullet-train-china/index.html
“World’s first 350km-per-hour driverless bullet train goes into service in China”
The train is a co-production from the Chinese ministry of railways and western companies Alsthom-France, Siemens-Germany, Bombardier-Canada, Kawasaki-Japan, the only countries who actually CAN build these kind of trains.
Cloggie on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 4:52 am
And Bombardier is from Quebec (“French”, sort of). For atomized-individualized Anglos, trains are too “collectivist”, “socialist” even. And on top of that run on electrickery. No lovely smell of coal or oil, can’t have that. Un-American.
REAL Green on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 5:23 am
“US Greenhouse Gas Emissions Likely Fell Last Year After Rising in 2018”
https://tinyurl.com/ygskqjp7 green tech media
“U.S. emissions likely fell in 2019, putting the country back on a downward emissions trend, according to newly released analysis from research firm Rhodium Group. The results, which estimate a decline in greenhouse gas emissions of around 2 percent in 2019, contrast with 2018, when emissions rose for the first time in three years. Rhodium attributes much of the 2019 turnaround to the electricity sector, where technologies such as wind and solar, in addition to super-cheap gas prices, continued to erode the dominance of coal-fired power. But emissions increases in other sectors tempered the 10 percent reductions in the power sector. “[It] shows how much coal matters, because in reducing generation from coal we get pretty sizable reductions in the power sector. But at the same time, it shows the limit of coal-led reductions in power, and of the power sector overall, in bringing down economywide emissions,” said Hannah Pitt, a senior research analyst with Rhodium’s climate and energy group. “There is only so much you can squeeze out of the power sector before you really need to start seeing reductions in other sectors.” While electricity emissions declined and transportation emissions remained fairly flat in 2019, Rhodium estimates that emissions from buildings, industry and other sectors increased.”
REAL Green on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 6:35 am
“The Limits of Clean Energy”
https://tinyurl.com/yyghojxo foreign policy
“And all of this is just to power the existing global economy. Things become even more extreme when we start accounting for growth. As energy demand continues to rise, material extraction for renewables will become all the more aggressive—and the higher the growth rate, the worse it will get. It’s important to keep in mind that most of the key materials for the energy transition are located in the global south. Parts of Latin America, Africa, and Asia will likely become the target of a new scramble for resources, and some countries may become victims of new forms of colonization…If we don’t take precautions, clean energy firms could become as destructive as fossil fuel companies—buying off politicians, trashing ecosystems, lobbying against environmental regulations, even assassinating community leaders who stand in their way…None of this is to say that we shouldn’t pursue a rapid transition to renewable energy. We absolutely must and urgently. But if we’re after a greener, more sustainable economy, we need to disabuse ourselves of the fantasy that we can carry on growing energy demand at existing rates. Of course, we know that poorer countries still need to increase their energy use in order to meet basic needs. But richer countries, fortunately, do not. In high-income nations, the transition to green energy needs to be accompanied by a planned reduction of aggregate energy use. How might this be accomplished? Given that the majority of our energy is used to power the extraction and production of material goods, the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change suggests that high-income nations reduce their material throughput—legislating longer product life spans and rights to repair, banning planned obsolescence and throwaway fashion, shifting from private cars to public transportation, while scaling down socially unnecessary industries and wasteful luxury consumption like the arms trade, SUVs, and McMansions. Reducing energy demand not only enables a faster transition to renewables, but also ensures that the transition doesn’t trigger new waves of destruction. Any Green New Deal that hopes to be socially just and ecologically coherent needs to have these principles at its heart.”
REAL Green on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 6:36 am
The heart of REAL Green is we aren’t going to transition to a 100% renewably world both for physical reasons and behavioral reasons. The physical reasons are obvious and that rests with the amount of resources and capital it will require all the while normal growth in the rest of the global economy is being maintained. That physical reality should be enough but it is being drown out by techno optimism that got us to this existential danger zone. Systematic reasons involving both the physical and behavioral of allowing an effective renewable integration both for emission reductions, resilience to shocks, and sustainability found in energy diversity will necessarily lower economic activity killing the global economy. This is commonly called degrowth among green advocates which have it partially right. For renewables to really be effective economic activity must be lowered to allow intermittency and lower net energy to be economic. What FAKE Green degrowth advocates do not dwell on much is the economics of this. They think you can have destructive change with degrowth and still maintain a global system of value chains. These systematic value chains are essentially a growth bubble. Bubbles must remain inflated or the whole endeavor can crash in on itself. Globalism is a bubble and it makes possible techno optimistic solutions…period. Systematically it is not possible to have what we have today which is a robust global value chain economic growth engine and systematic degrowth. It is this robust global economy that is needed to power the renewable revolution so degrowth is a double edge sword of being needed and needing to be eliminated.
Another area of behavioral falsehood is the global south should be allowed to grow as the north degrowths. This is false on two fronts with one being it won’t work because of the nature of the global value chain system. The global system is integrated in such a way as you can’t grow the south and degrowth the north. What you get is an end of globalism with a popped bubble. This also points to the fallacy of results of growing the south. At this point draconian reductions are needed to meet climate targets. Growing the south especially since this is in reality coal-based means there is no chance of emission reductions if the global south does not degrowth too. Academia, scientist, and policy people get around this by saying sustainable green growth will make this happen. This is more FAKE Green dellusionalism of cherry picking and embellishing science with unrealistic theoretical results.
The other side of the behavioral issue is it won’t sell. Fake Greens are rich liberal types generally. They are radical about this transition and delusional. They want their cake of an affluent life and eat it by embracing green tech and thinking they are green. Real reductions in emissions but also resilience and sustainability must include these people becoming much poorer. That is not going to fly with a rich FAKE Green. Keep in mind REAL Green has written off emission reductions because it is not a reality until the collapse process gathers speed but REAL Green still believes renewables are vital because of the resilience to this decline process they offer. They also offer sustainability strategies for decline. They can push out the decline envelope by augmenting fossil fuels that are also in net energy decline. Economics will kill fossil fuels too since increasingly they are unconventionals which are an economic commodity. There may be enough fossil fuels to cook us but not enough economic ones. Techno optimism is wrong with fossil fuels too. So, the behavioral side of real and profound sacrifice is not going to sell with FAKE Greens when they are face to face with poverty. This world getting poorer is definitely not going to sell with Brown Dellusionalist like many of the so-called Trump Deplorables. Many of them don’t believe in green anything anyway. Much of the uneducated world is this way also.
Finally this points to reality and that is we are in planetary and human succession to less complexity meaning a less complicated world. This is a gradient of change that will mean destructive degrowth with abandonment, dysfunction, and the irrational so it is Ludacris that our brightest minds are pushing investing in more complicated systems that will likely become stranded assets in the decline process at some point. What is needed is a wisdom of decline to be a gate keeper to techno investment and lifestyle behavior to prudently invest in technology with a future for a coming collapse. Forget about climate change it is backed into the equation. Let’s think about a less severe collapse to much lower populations and economic activity. This time frame is unknown so it is likely we can still transform ourselves. The current delusional FAKE green efforts will still do some of this necessary transformation even with the dysfunction of intent but just imagine how much more could be done if it was REAL Green. REAL Green preaches awakened localism as a parachute to a decline of globalism. Localistic efforts would be employed while current globalism of growth is maintained albeit in its dangerous trajectory down. What this means is we are building life boats and hospices for the coming crash that is inevitable. The life boats are locals that have resilience and sustainability and the hospices are the education and the changed lifestyles of behavior to this collapse. Of course, REAL Green understands this will not happen top down so REAL green says go local with individual and small group efforts. It still works with REAL green. FAKE Green efforts are a failure because they advertise a false success but REAL Green is real and effective at least for your isolated local. Realgreenadaptation.blog
REAL Green on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 7:12 am
“Dominion’s planned US offshore wind project could be world’s largest at 2.64 GW”
https://tinyurl.com/yfwaysda renewable energy world
“Today, Siemens Gamesa Renewable Energy (SGRE) said that Dominion Energy named it the preferred supplier for what could be the largest offshore wind farm in the world. The project will be an expansion of the 12-MW Coastal Virginia Offshore Wind (CVOW) pilot project, which is also not yet begun. The 12-MW CVOW project will be the first offshore wind project to be built in U.S. federal waters and will use Siemens Gamesa’s 6-MW SWT-6.0-154 wind turbines. CVOW could be online in 2020 within a research lease area adjacent to site of the proposed 2.64-GW project, said Siemens. A long-term service and maintenance agreement is included for the site located off the coast of Virginia. The agreement furthermore foresees utilizing turbines from Siemens Gamesa’s Direct Drive offshore wind turbine platform. For the 2.64-GW project, Siemens said the final number of units and turbine model remain to be determined, probably because there are many variables that must be worked out in order for it to actually begin construction. However, Siemens said it expects the project to be complete by 2026, subject to certain conditions including Dominion Energy’s final investment decision, governmental permitting, and other required approvals.”
REAL Green on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 7:39 am
“Largest US Solar Power Plant Will Be Built On Public Land. Is That A Problem?”
https://tinyurl.com/yztzxv76 clean technica
“The Los Angeles Times reports that the Bureau of Land Management, which is in charge of all federal lands, has signed off on a plan to build the largest solar power plant in the US — 690 megawatts covering 7,100 acres along Interstate 15, about 30 miles northeast of Las Vegas, Nevada. There are two other large solar farms already operating in the area. All that remains before the project moves ahead is a final 90-day public comment period. It is expected that the Gemini solar farm will be fully operational in December of 2023. The $1 billion Gemini project is being developed by Quinbrook Infrastructure Partners and Arevia Power, and will include large scale storage batteries, although few specs about the storage component of the project have been released at this point. It will supply power to NV Energy, Nevada’s largest public utility. NV Energy has signed a 25-year power purchase agreement with the developers and has agreed to pay $38.44 per megawatt-hour for electricity during that period. David Scaysbrook, co-founder and managing partner of Quinbrook, says, “Gemini plans to showcase at scale what we believe to be one of the most promising technological advances in renewable power. The project will demonstrate the ability to couple solar PV technology with battery storage to capture and use Nevada’s abundant renewable solar resource to deliver low cost power to NV Energy’s customers and keep the lights on long after the sun has set.”
Sissyfuss on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 9:29 am
It seems that the only emissions that count are the unstoppable and increasing CO2 and CH4 emissions from the Arctic regions. What humans do with their civilizations matters not.
Duncan Idaho on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 10:14 am
What humans do with their civilizations matters not.
At this point, probably not.
Cloggie on Wed, 8th Jan 2020 11:10 am
“For the 2.64-GW project, Siemens said the final number of units and turbine model remain to be determined, probably because there are many variables that must be worked out in order for it to actually begin construction. However, Siemens said it expects the project to be complete by 2026.”
As always German technology is available to give US society a facelift. VW, Mercedes, BMW, Audi, the list goes on.
https://images.app.goo.gl/LEFG1DuhgqJbB5M58
All paid for with printed dollars… as long as that parasite party lasts (not very long anymore).
Cloggie on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 7:20 am
Golden decade latest. Apartment prices in my native Eindhoven increased with 33% over 2019 alone. This is unprecedented:
https://www.ed.nl/eindhoven/prijsexplosie-op-woningmarkt-eindhoven-in-2019-starters-de-klos-in-regio-zuidoost-brabant~abce6c1a/
I just got 100k richer in one year from farting alone, work not included.
Eindhoven is now the technological and economic center of the Netherlands. Main reason: ASML, High tech Campus and university:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jL3TYXr52BY
Eindhoven is well-underway to displace Silicon Valley and is the undisputed global center of microprocessor technology, where Apple, Intel, Samsung and Huawei are mere water carriers.
As a result 200k city Eindhoven can now be found on the global top-20 of prominent cities:
https://www.ed.nl/economie/eindhoven-in-wereldwijde-top-20-als-het-gaat-over-inclusieve-welvaart~aafd9587/161216985/
(Picsa ranking). Note that 15 out of 20 are European, leaving not a shred of a doubt who is going to be the new global #1, after empire. It’s the old pre-1939 #1, Europe. North-America can be proud to be the #2, everything falling in line here.
Cloggie on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 12:31 pm
Brexit is a fact!!
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7868213/Historic-moment-Brexit-Bill-FINALLY-set-signed-MPs.html
“History is made as MPs FINALLY formally approve Brexit deal by 330 to 231 after three years of bitter wrangling and deadlock”
The first essential hurdle for Europe to escape from post-1945 empire has been taken. Expect the UK to move over to the US sphere of influence and Russia and Ukraine become tenants of the “Common European Home”, that will turn to the right:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_European_Home
Interesting will be to see if at least Scotland and Northern-Ireland will manage to remain in the EU, after independence, c.q. Irish unification.
Expect the US to lose 35-40% GDP as a result of loss of reserve currency after the break with Europe has become final and land at the level of a prosperous Balkan state, think Slovenia. They already have the corresponding FLOTUS.
The only way to repair the West in the future would be a white American revolt; no potential for that exist in the UK.
If such a revolt won’t take place, expect complete mongrelization of Anglosphere and whites completely losing power, in line with the wishes of (((those))) who organized this globalization scam:
https://documents1940.wordpress.com/2017/09/27/paul-krugman-white-americans-are-losing-their-country/
Written on the tomb stone of America will be written:
“We were no match for the jews”
Written on the tomb stone of (white) Britain will be written:
“We failed to be Europeans”
Davy on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 12:51 pm
Thank you for all the Brexzit Daily Mail updates cloggo. I love clicking on your links. It is the next best thing to being there with you there in person. Do you any news or updates on the Euro-army? I really miss hearing about that too.
Duncan Idaho on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 12:56 pm
Donald Trump’s rant against Iran is the howl of a dying empire
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jan/09/donald-trump-rant-iran-dying-empire-nato
Even the Fat Boys Repug allies were horrified by this performance.
Cloggie on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 2:53 pm
Britain is now out, no more reason to pretend we are friends:
https://www.politico.eu/article/britain-illegal-use-eu-migration-data/
“Britain faces heat over ‘illegal’ use of EU migration data”
“”In the kindness of our hearts we have given them access to the Schengen Information System, and they are behaving like cowboys,” Liberal MEP Sophie in ‘t Veld said about British authorities’ handling of the migration information.”
From their default “Splendid Isolation” attitude they will always see us as their enemy and will do anything to undermine European unity. We should return the favour. First we should dump all laws that protect the self-serving Alllied lies concerning WW2/Nuremberg.
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:30 pm
blah blah blah
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:30 pm
OH forgot #yawn#
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:34 pm
Sunni Muslims Applaud Soleimani Killing
Sunni Muslims throughout the Middle East have been celebrating the killing of Iran’s second-most powerful man, Major General Qassem Soleimani, who was taken out by a US airstrike on January 3rd in Baghdad which also took out his deputy, Abu Mahdi al-Muhandis, according to VOA. “There has long been a hostile feeling by the Arabs and [Sunni] Muslims toward Qassem Soleimani,” said Jordanian analyst Nabil Al-Otoom, an Iran expert. “The American move drew a strong positive reaction from public opinion in the region, and a strengthened U.S. presence in Iraq is becoming more important to stop Iranian plans to build a regional empire by 2030,” he added. “His elimination has slowed Iran’s plan to manage a military coup with politicians completely loyal to Tehran controlling the government … I can say that this American move was in the right direction.” Iraqis — Iraqis — dancing in the street for freedom; thankful that General Soleimani is no more. pic.twitter.com/huFcae3ap4
Davy on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:38 pm
Don’t listen to JuanP y’all. He’s a moron.
Cloggie on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:42 pm
“Sunni Muslims Applaud Soleimani Killing”
Source: Pompeo.lol
https://twitter.com/SecPompeo/status/1212955403077767168/video/1
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:45 pm
Yea, cloggie, he made lots of enemies with the other half of the Muslim world. They want to see the US stay.
REAL Green on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:46 pm
Davys write. Thanks for yer political commentary cloggo. Me n Davy find it stimulatin.
Sunni Muslims are a small minority JuanP. You might think dictatorships are grate, but me n Davy strongly believe in democracy. And so do the people in the M E.
stupid
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:50 pm
Video Captures Moment Missile Strikes Boeing 737 Over Tehran
Update: The New York Times has verified the video which shows an Iranian missile hitting a plane above Parand, near Tehran’s airport, the area where a Ukrainian airliner stopped transmitting its signal before it crashed on Wednesday. With the narrative surrounding the crashed Ukrainian Boeing 737 changing by the minute, shifting away from a initially proposed theory of a technical error and shifting toward speculation the plane was accidentally or not taken down by someone (Iranians? Israelis? CIA?) on the ground, “evidence” is suddenly starting to emerge to validate this latest theory. And so moments ago, an unverified, unconfirmed video has appeared on the Telegram network, purporting to show the moment a missile strikes the Ukrainian flight PS752.
Anonymouse on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:54 pm
Juan I am going REAL Green too. realgreenadaptation.blog
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:55 pm
Anon, it changed my life
makati1 on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:59 pm
Once again, I am going to the circus. It is called “current events”. It could also be called the last days of humanity.
In the center ring, the ME, a US caused,fiasco takes my attention. In the ring off to the left is the EU/UK never ending bust-up. The one to the right is the China tariff thingy, going nowhere. The US election clown car is still full of psychos and careens in and out of the center ring as everyone wants to give their opinion on the “war”.
Outside the big top, the sideshow of regime change continues in many countries under the lie of democracy, but is really Amerikan corporate greed. The picture of terrorist Amerika is now so obvious to the rest of the world that pressure is growing to put it down.
Just another day of The Great Leveling as the US disintegrates. It will be another ‘interesting’ weekend. Pass the popcorn.
REAL Green on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 4:59 pm
Thanks fer that link cloggo. Looks like JuanP is even stupider then we all thought. Both the Sunnis and the Shia hate us now.
Why do you need to lie all the time JuanP?
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 5:01 pm
“Sunni Muslims are a small minority JuanP.”
Shia–Sunni relations – Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Shia–Sunni_relations
Sunnis are a majority in most Muslim communities: in Southeast Asia, China, South Asia, Africa, and a part of the Arab world. Shia make up the majority of the citizen population in Iraq, Bahrain, Iran, and Azerbaijan, as well as being a politically significant minority in Pakistan, Lebanon, Syria, Yemen and Kuwait.
Numbers · Historical beliefs and … · History · Modernity
I should know I am the muzzie expert who is fully woke
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 5:03 pm
Mak, I am going REAL Green. Will you join me? realgreenadaptation.blog
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 5:08 pm
Gen. Keane: Iran’s ‘feeble response’ was a result of Trump’s ‘full-throttle’ approach
Gen. Keane: Soleimani strike result has exceeded what the Trump administration had in mind
The Iranians have exercised restraint for only the second time in 40 years and their credibility has diminished, Fox News senior strategic analyst Gen. Jack Keane says. Iran’s credibility in the Middle East has diminished as a result of its “feeble response” to President Trump’s “full-throttle” approach, Fox News senior strategic analyst Gen. Jack Keane said Thursday on “America’s Newsroom.” Keane said that Iran’s “feeble” response on Tuesday night – striking an Iraqi airbase which hosted U.S. troops – was “more for propaganda reasons” within the country. The strikes caused no casualties and U.S. officials said they had advance warning. Keane said he believes Iran’s leaders realized that Trump would authorize a “full-throttle” response if they had undertaken a more significant retaliation. “We would have taken down all eight of their refineries, most of the power plants in the country that drive the electricity grid, and we would have taken down their cruise missiles and all of their strategic short-range and ballistic missiles,” he said. “They would have been done at that point.”
Davy on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 5:10 pm
“ video which shows an Iranian missile hitting a plane above Parand”
They tried that bullshit already JuanP. It didn’t wurk out to well.
“Ukranian Whistleblower Reveals MH-17 Tragedy Was Orchestrated By Poroshenko And British Secret Service”
https://tinyurl.com/yzj3a5rr zero hedge
“I would argue this was also done to legitimize a Western intervention in Ukraine. Just as Bellingcat’s disinformation campaign against Syria has failed, Higgins and other peoples campaign to blame the Donbass volunteers for MH-17 tragedy is also crumbling apart.”
A full independent investigation is scheduled for 2020.
Cloggie on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 5:13 pm
“Video Captures Moment Missile Strikes Boeing 737 Over Tehran
Update: The New York Times has verified the video which shows an Iranian missile hitting a plane above Parand, near Tehran’s airport, the area where a Ukrainian airliner stopped transmitting its signal before it crashed on Wednesday. With the narrative surrounding the crashed Ukrainian Boeing 737 changing by the minute, shifting away from a initially proposed theory of a technical error and shifting toward speculation the plane was accidentally or not taken down by someone (Iranians? Israelis? CIA?) on the ground, “evidence” is suddenly starting to emerge to validate this latest theory. And so moments ago, an unverified, unconfirmed video has appeared on the Telegram network, purporting to show the moment a missile strikes the Ukrainian flight PS752.”
Just like with Lockerbie, MH17, do not expect to hear the truth any time soon, if ever. Certainly not from the NYT. Too hot politically.
Cloggie on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 5:17 pm
“I would argue this was also done to legitimize a Western intervention in Ukraine. Just as Bellingcat’s disinformation campaign against Syria has failed, Higgins and other peoples campaign to blame the Donbass volunteers for MH-17 tragedy is also crumbling apart.”
The BBC was pushing Bellingcat tonight.
Bellingcat=NATO
/rolleyes
Davy on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 5:30 pm
“Iran’s ‘feeble response’ was a result of Trump’s ‘full-throttle’ approach”
If you hate America so bad you want us all dead JuanP. Why don’t you move back to your failed South America.
Cuntface
JuanP on Thu, 9th Jan 2020 5:40 pm
Well Davy I am too busy fucking guys here and fucking old people out of their savings. It is a great life here in Miami Beech if you are a scammer.