Could 2020 Be the Year of Hydrogen?

Hydrogen has long been touted as a green alternative to traditional forms of energy generation, such as burning natural gas. When produced via the electrolysis of water, hydrogen has a very low carbon footprint – and the only by-product created when it is combusted is that self-same water. As such, it’s far more beneficial in environmental terms, but as yet has not been used efficiently enough to make it viable on a national or international scale.

That could all be about to change in the coming 12 months. A trial being undertaken at Keele University in Stoke-on-Trent is seeking to blend natural gas with 20% hydrogen in order to meet its heating and cooking needs, thus resulting in lower carbon emissions as a result. If successful, the trial could be rolled out across the country and lead to dramatic reductions in the British carbon footprint.

A blueprint for the nation?

The Keele University trial, which has been dubbed HyDeploy – is the first of its kind to take place on UK soil. Keele was specifically chosen because it operates its own private gas network, allowing those in charge to amend the composition of the fuel used with little to no disruption to the university’s daily life. Indeed, staff on campus have claimed that nothing at all has changed since the trial began, except that now the university is responsible for fewer carbon emissions.

The gas company behind the scheme are Cadent, who ultimately wish to see it extended across the entirety of the British Isles. If every home and business in the country adopted a similar strategy, they say, the value of such a hydrogen-blended natural gas could be substantial. According to their estimates, introducing 20% hydrogen into fuel mixes would reduce carbon emissions to the tune of six million tonnes per annum, or the equivalent of removing 2.5 million cars from Britain’s roadways.

How the process works

There are two ways in which hydrogen can be produced. The first is via an electrolyser (which is the technique used at Keele), a device capable of separating water into its component parts (oxygen and hydrogen). This method results in only negligible amounts of CO2 emissions, but is as yet not very efficient. The second method is more economically viable and involves converting natural gas into hydrogen, but this technique creates significant carbon emissions and as such requires the use of carbon capture and storage (CCS) technology to be truly sustainable.

The 20% figure was chosen by Keele as it’s the optimum hydrogen contribution which doesn’t upset the status quo of how boilers function. It also makes sparing use of hydrogen, which is currently a resource that’s not in plentiful supply. However, leading manufacturers of boilers and heating equipment are pursuing 100% hydrogen solutions for the future, while the use of high technology gases in environmentally friendly road transportation is one other avenue where hydrogen can play a role in the national transition towards a greener tomorrow.

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57 Comments on "Could 2020 Be the Year of Hydrogen?"

Zeke Putnam on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 12:05 pm 



In the land of dreams and schemes, I say it therefore it will done.

Anonymouse on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 1:05 pm 



RoFL

“This method results in only negligible amounts of CO2 emissions, but is as yet not very efficient.”

No shit it is not efficient. It is more efficient to heat using NG directly, than adding the additional step, and energy losses, of adding hydrogen into the mix. You gain absolutely nothing by doing this. Well, you’ll make the guy that built the equipment and a gas-plant somewhere happy I suppose.

“It also makes sparing use of hydrogen, which is currently a resource that’s not in plentiful supply.”

Again, no shit. ‘Free’ hydrogen is almost non-existent on Earth. If we all lived on say, Saturn, or Jupiter, then it wouldn’t be an issue would it? But we live on Earth where free hydrogen gas basically does not exist, is not plentiful, and never will be.

“The second method is more economically viable and involves converting natural gas into hydrogen”

Note how the term ‘economically viable’ gets inserted here. IoW, the other methods are too expensive, IE no one will be willing to pay for it if cheaper alternatives exist. And they do, because pretty much everything is going to be cheaper. The groups that require hydrogen, dont mind paying a bit of a premium for it because they require it for specific processes, but for space heating?

If using hydrogen for vehicles is a stupid idea, and it is, then using it for heating mostly empty space or water or whatever?, is even dumber still.

Abraham van Helsing on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 3:52 pm 



Again, no shit. ‘Free’ hydrogen is almost non-existent on Earth. If we all lived on say, Saturn, or Jupiter, then it wouldn’t be an issue would it? But we live on Earth where free hydrogen gas basically does not exist, is not plentiful, and never will be.

It doesn’t? That’s quite a revelation, mousy! They have been lying to us over all those years. Where would we be without smart commoners like you!

Ok, that was appeasing the inhabitants of the local lunatic asylum.

Seriously. Everybody who at least has a basic understanding of the energy situation knows that:

1. renewable energy generation is meanwhile cost-effective
2. renewable energy storage could use some additional maturing

2020 won’t be “the year of hydrogen”. The twenties will be the hydrogen decade. Now that a large country like Germany has meanwhile a renewable electricity penetration of over 40%, (seasonal) storage no longer can be ignored. And that kind of storage must either be thermal or chemical (hydrogen or some derivative).

https://www.carboncommentary.com/blog/2017/7/5/hydrogen-made-by-the-electrolysis-of-water-is-now-cost-competitive-and-gives-us-another-building-block-for-the-low-carbon-economy

“Very roughly, a new electrolysis plant today delivers energy efficiency of around 80%. That is, the energy value of the hydrogen produced is about 80% of the electricity used to split the water molecule.“

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolysis_of_water

“Conventional alkaline electrolysis has an efficiency of about 70%.[25] Accounting for the accepted use of the higher heat value (because inefficiency via heat can be redirected back into the system to create the steam required by the catalyst), average working efficiencies for PEM electrolysis are around 80%.[26][27] This is expected to increase to between 82–86%[28] before 2030. Theoretical efficiency for PEM electrolysers are predicted up to 94%“

In Europe a large number of hydrogen projects are underway, the largest in the Netherlands:

https://www.shell.nl/media/persberichten/2020-media-releases/grootste-groene-waterstofproject-van-europa-in-grongingen.html

(scroll down for English)

2030: 3-4 GW offshore wind for hydrogen production only
2040: 10 GW

Richard Guenette on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 3:57 pm 



To generate electricity, could rainwater be used as a clean energy source?

Abraham van Helsing on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 4:37 pm 



“To generate electricity, could rainwater be used as a clean energy source?“

Absolutely!

https://www.livescience.com/32738-whats-the-biggest-dam-in-the-world.html

makati1 on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 4:39 pm 



Guys, it is ALL about $$$$ for the already rich. Nothing more. Cloggie will jump on this as proof his techie wet dreams can come true.

Yes, it might, IF he can find Tinker Bell and use fairy dust. LMAO!

Anonymouse on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 4:59 pm 



Like I said mak, we live on Earth, unlike ‘Aberahymie’ there, who is still desperately hoping someone will build enough solar panels and windmills to power the dimensional portal to take him back to the universe he came from. You know, the one where pixie dust and dreams power the alternate Earth he is from.

Duncan Idaho on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 5:32 pm 



Futures are down– lets see if the Fat Boy and the Thugs can stop the fall– they have all the resources, except reality.

makati1 on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 5:45 pm 



Its fun watching the Stock Market Casino playing Limbo Stick …”How low can you go”? I have no “investments” there so I can sleep at night.

Yes, it affects a lot of things, but nothing that is truly a necessity. Necessities will still continue to be produced, but probably cost more.

Waiting for the S.M.Casino to open later. LOL

Davy on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 5:51 pm 



‘Like I said mak, we live on Earth”

LMFAO, like as in you are grounded and intelligent?? I don’t think so. The both of you have had steady failures with your delusional agendas. This is especially true of makato1. Annoy, you don’t have much to say. You mostly just stalk people and say stupid shit with a weirdo grammar and spelling. You try to acting superior and intelligent by stalking but you are too stupid to know acting intelligent requires a thought process which you don’t have.

makati1 on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 5:55 pm 



Looking in a mirror again Davy?

Davy on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 5:57 pm 



“Its fun watching the Stock Market Casino playing Limbo Stick …”How low can you go”? I have no “investments” there so I can sleep at night.”

Dumbfuck, is not intelligent enough to understand if Asia hits a bottom hard his ass is going to be squirming. He is one of those old senile guys who thinks he is above it all.

“Yes, it affects a lot of things, but nothing that is truly a necessity. Necessities will still continue to be produced, but probably cost more. Waiting for the S.M.Casino to open later. LOL”

LOL, more dumbass. makato, tell us more about the gold back Yuan you used to cheer lead endlessly. I thought the dollar was toast by now according to you.

Davy on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 5:59 pm 



“Guys, it is ALL about $$$$ for the already rich. Nothing more.”

explain yourself, stupid. One-liners’ don’t mean you have a clue.

makati1 on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 6:18 pm 



I am not worried about Asia “hitting the bottom”. It is Amerika that relies on Asia for EVERYTHING that should be scared shitless. Another few weeks and the drugs the tax slaves need will be disappearing. The US makes nothing anymore that is important. What it tries to make fails.

I an prepared. I need nothing. The dust will settle and it probably will be a much different world for Amerikans. Wait and see.

BTW: I was referring to the article with that “one liner”. Nothing else needed for someone with intelligence. Oops! LMAO!

Davy on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 6:22 pm 



Here are some makto1 AsiaUp news:

“Europeans see China car market shrinking up to 7%”
https://tinyurl.com/quuodgj asia times

“Even before the coronavirus crisis, we expected a fall of 2% in the Chinese market, and we are now assuming a scenario with a drop of up to 7%,” Mueller added. “We shouldn’t expect a quick recovery.” China’s CPCA carmakers’ group judged the fall in deliveries could mount as high as 70% year-on-year in February, and 40% in January-February combined.”

Davy on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 6:24 pm 



“I an prepared. I need nothing”

you are just old, delusional, and senile. When times get hard a old white guy like you will be on the street begging.

Davy on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 6:28 pm 



makato1 AsiaUp news:

“China’s Non-Manufacturing & Manufacturing PMIs Show to What Unfathomable Extent the Economy Has Collapsed”
https://tinyurl.com/yx62p3wp wolf news

“ANZ banking group estimated, based on migration data of workers returning to the city from their villages, that about 50% of the workers had returned to their jobs as of this weekend, but that China’s economy was operating at only 20% capacity, hampered by issues ranging from lacking parts to other workers not having returned to work. But work resumptions are rising rapidly, ANZ said, and the March PMIs are expected to bounce off those catastrophic lows.”

makati1 on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 7:58 pm 



Davy. I am prepared. You are not. You can deny all you want, but you are only full of bullshit, as usual. You live in an already failing country. This virus is going to kill the US economy and, probably, the Stock Market Casino.

“News” about China from Western sources are all bullshit and lies. You hide behind tinyurls instead of posting your article headlines. You are a pure goat shit redneck, hiding in the Ozarks.

Your Italian escape location is closed down by the government to control the virus from expanding south into the rest of Italy. Aww!

I know my position and it is just fine. I can live at least a year without going to the store. Can you say the same thing? I don’t rely on commercial water or even electric. many of my neighbors are the same. Can you do that where you live? I don’t think so. LMAO!

BTW: How is the weather there? Rainy? 2020 Spring all over again? Not good for farmers.

REAL Green on Sun, 1st Mar 2020 9:15 pm 



“a old white guy”

Are education aint all its cracked up to be Davy. Obv.

LOL!

Abraham van Helsing on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 12:06 am 



Amazing how mak and mousy imagine they have better knowledge than an energy engineering giant like Royal Dutch Shell, that makes billions with real competence, where our comical duo have never seen an engineering book from the inside.

https://www.shell.nl/media/persberichten/2020-media-releases/grootste-groene-waterstofproject-van-europa-in-grongingen.html

makati1 on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 12:24 am 



Imagine that some crackhead in the dinky Netherlands has to have sock puppets to think. Davy needed to create sock puppets so someone seemed to be on his warped side in debates. All they do is amplify his arrogant delusions.

Some people are intelligent enough to think for themselves and are not tied to a dying career, like some here…Cloggie. Oil is dying. Future survival means having survival skills someone wants and that that someone has the means to pay you in necessitates, not luxuries. The days of luxuries for Western pirates are about over. The rest of the century will be about survival.

What does a degree mean when there is no use for it? You seem to believe that the world is going your way when it is going just the opposite. Same for oily careers and economics. I wonder what the buggy whip makers thought before they went extinct?

Abraham van Helsing on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 1:14 am 



“All they do is amplify his arrogant delusions.”

What is really arrogant is to simply ignore messages coming from power houses like Shell that they are engaging in giant hydrogen projects, now that they know that the fossil fuel era is almost over and something new needs to be built.

“What does a degree mean when there is no use for it?”

Huh? The entire world revolves around engineering. The very internet you are using to broadcast your messages around the planet are living proof of the work of engineers.

Ignore the ignoramus from the Philippines, just another American has-been, as he himself admits around the clock.

Here a dose of reality: hydrogen-powered train to operate for the first time in the Netherlands as well, after several already are operational in Germany:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igfLKYIWnew

Unthinkable in makati’s America, a very short-lived geopolitical aberration.

Makati and empire dave, they are fighting each other around the clock, but both are living proof that Americans are unable to sustain a first world civilization.

That’s OK. You will be a European colony again before you can say Hitler.

makati1 on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 1:43 am 



Shell? A dying corporation that has only lasted by plundering the oil of other countries. Soon to only be a note in the history of petroleum. similar to that of the other dying FF, coal.

A degree that does not provide a NECESSARY skill, like medicine, is useless when there is no one who needs it. Better to be a skilled carpenter, plumber or electrician. They will always be needed until there are no longer any humans. 2100?

Not so much degrees in temporary careers like petroleum engineers. I would not like to be just out of college with such a soon to be worthless degree and know it is already part of a dying industry. Certainly not to last until some future retirement age.

BTW: “Retirement”is never going to be possible for those under 60 today. Sorry! Dropping dead at their job will be the common place of death in the near future.

You keep proving your immature ignorance, Abe/Cloggie. Just like that other arrogant asshole, Davy. Take the blinders off, get help to undo the brainwashing and then come back with a mature rebuttal.

BTW: It is not MY Amerika. I do not, and have not, lived there for over 12 years now. I would prefer being a Filipino to being an Amerikan slave these days. I am ashamed of what the US has become and hope it is put down, along with all of its ass kissing poodles, soon.

You are delusional. Get help.

Abraham van Helsing on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 2:01 am 



“Shell? A dying corporation that has only lasted by plundering the oil of other countries. Soon to only be a note in the history of petroleum. similar to that of the other dying FF, coal.”

What’s your proof that Shell is “dying”?

https://www.statista.com/statistics/268734/revenue-of-royal-dutch-shell/

There isn’t any, you just make it up as you go. Shell is smart enough to understand the signs of the times and that it needs to change course, slowly, away from fossil, towards renewable energy. They are involved in building offshore wind farms in the North Sea and now they are moving into hydrogen. Shell will be fine.

“A degree that does not provide a NECESSARY skill, like medicine, is useless when there is no one who needs it.”

Actually it does. No car, no plane, no high-rise building, no company can be run without people with degrees. Engineers are in very HIGH demand around the world.

Cloggie on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 2:37 am 



The Netherlands kicks off the NortH2 project and gets serious with the hydrogen economy:

https://deepresource.wordpress.com/2020/03/02/north2-the-netherlands-starting-the-hydrogen-economy/

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 4:31 am 



“What does a degree mean when there is no use for it?” “Huh? The entire world revolves around engineering. The very internet you are using to broadcast your messages around the planet are living proof of the work of engineers.”

cloggo, the makato couldn’t take the rigors of college life so he dropped out 1st semester so he naturally acts like an education is not important. He pounded nails all his life but thinks he is a professor. Get the drift? LOL.

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 4:56 am 



“The Good, Bad, & Ugly Of Virus Response: El-Erian Admits Govts & Central Banks Can Only Do So Much”
https://tinyurl.com/uoffx9y zero hedge

“Look for this week to be full of news about governments and central banks signaling their “whatever it takes” willingness to take additional policy measures to fight the contractionary impact of the coronavirus on virtually every economy around the world…As more announcements materialize during the week, it will be crystal clear that the question will not be about the willingness to act but about the effectiveness of those actions…An increasing number of sectors and countries are experiencing sudden-stop dynamics as the economic effects of the coronavirus spread more widely around the world…It’s a dynamic that builds on itself in the short term, fueled by a “fear virus” and other behavioral traits that engender paralysis and insecurity. It also promotes self-reinforcing vicious economic cycles with adverse social, political and institutional spillover effects, amplified by the considerable risk of pockets of financial market malfunctioning…But the considerable willingness of governments and central banks to act should not be confused with effectiveness. For the reasons I have detailed before, countering an economic sudden stop, such as the one connected with the coronavirus, is a lot harder in the immediate term than resolving a financial sudden stop…Support sectors critical to a holistic recovery, medical services in particular. Target the most vulnerable, responsive and highly consequential contracting sectors. Provide focused relief to corporate and household balance sheets. Bolster emergency assistance to countries overwhelmed by this exogenous and external shock. Counter pockets of market malfunctioning through timely direct liquidity injections. Provide increasing clarity as to what lies ahead for the global economy, national responses and global policy coordination. These efforts, however, will not be able to engineer in the short term a generalized global and sustained recovery of the three main drivers of economic activity: consumption, investment and trade…To decisively turn the corner, the global economy needs evidence of two health accomplishments: success in containing the spread of the virus, particularly when it comes to community transmission; and sustained success in illness recovery and avoidance, with the latter best done through the availability of a new vaccine.”

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 5:00 am 



“Outbreak Fears Emerge In Nigeria As Gov’t Finds 100 People Exposed To First Virus Case”
https://tinyurl.com/wgysxls zero hedge

“Reuters says the man arrived in Lagos, Nigeria, on February 24 from Milan, Italy, a country that has been hit hard by the virus. Nigerian authorities have traced the man’s footsteps from the airport to his hotel to the country’s business district and asked everyone who came in contact with him to stay in isolation for 14 days while undergoing regular health inspections from officials. Lagos State Health Commissioner Akin Abayomi told Reuters, “It is around 100 people, but that number is increasing every minute.” Abayomi said none of the people in isolation in Lagos had exhibited any symptoms yet…The situation in Africa is rapidly evolving, and events in the last several days could suggest that a further increase in cases will be seen in Nigeria in the days or weeks ahead. This certainly doesn’t bode well for an entire continent that is ill-prepared to handle a major virus outbreak. Africa could be the next region, sort of like what’s happening in Europe at the moment, to get walloped by the virus.”

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 5:12 am 



“Were Coronavirus Samples Destroyed By China To Coverup The Outbreak?”
https://tinyurl.com/vkzpmvb zero hedge

“Caixin, a Beijing-based media group published a shocking report that the Hubei Provincial Health and Medical Commission ordered the destruction of Coronavirus samples. Soon after the story was gagged with the article subsequently taken down…Gene sequence detected and reported at the end of December. On February 26, Caixin published a shocking article titled “Tracking the Source of New Coronavirus Gene Sequencing“. Caixin sources told GreatGameIndia on condition of anonymity that the article was taken down due to mounting pressure from the Chinese authorities…The Caixin report said that it was not until January 9th that the Chinese Communist Party officially declared the pathogen a “new Coronavirus.” The report also quoted a person from a gene sequencing company who disclosed that on January 1, 2020, he “received a phone call from an official of the Health and Medical Commission of Hubei Province, informing him that samples of cases of new Coronavirus in Wuhan could not be re-examined. Existing case samples must be destroyed and sample information cannot be disclosed…The claims of the Caixin report that gene sequencing studies carried out by the Chinese administration found that COVID-19 Coronavirus is almost 80% similar to SARS gives further credence to GreatGameIndia‘s report on how Chinese Biowarfare agents smuggled SARS Coronaviruses from Canada and weaponized it – Coronavirus Bioweapon. Further, the Canadian Scientist Frank Plummer who received these SARS Coronavirus samples of the first patient from Saudi Arabia was found dead in mysterious conditions in Nairobi, Kenya within 11 days of the publication of our report.”

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 5:23 am 



“This Crisis Will Spill Over Into Disaster” – Dr.Doom Sees 40% Collapse In “Delusional” Stock Market”
https://tinyurl.com/yxyaq8d3 zero hedge

“In an interview with Germany’s Der Speigel, Dr.Doom – who correctly predicted the bursting of the U.S. housing bubble in addition to the 2008 financial crisis along with the ramifications of austerity measures for debt-laden Greece – believes that coronavirus will lead to a global economic disaster and that U.S. President Donald Trump will not be re-elected as a result…Roubini: Everyone believes it’s going to be a V-shaped recession, but people don’t know what they are talking about. They prefer to believe in miracles. It’s simple math: If the Chinese economy were to shrink by 2 percent in the first quarter, it would require growth of 8 percent in the final three quarters to reach the 6 percent annual growth rate that everyone had expected before the virus broke out. If growth is only 6 percent from the second quarter onwards, which is a more realistic scenario, we would see the Chinese economy only growing by 2.5 to 4 percent for the entire year. This rate would essentially mean a recession for China and a shock to the world…The truth is: Europe would have needed fiscal stimulus even without the corona crisis. Italy was already on the verge of a recession, as was Germany. But German politicians aren’t even thinking about stimulus, despite the country being so exposed to China. The political response is a joke – politicians are often behind the curve. This crisis will spill over and result in a disaster…This crisis is a supply shock that you can’t fight with monetary or fiscal policy…Roubini: The solution needs to be a medical one. Monetary and fiscal measures do not help when you have no food and water safety…Roubini: Businesspeople tell me that things in China are much worse than the government is officially reporting. A friend of mine in Shanghai has been locked in his home for weeks now…Roubini: I expect global equities to tank by 30 to 40 percent this year. My advice is: Put your money into cash and safe government bonds, like German bunds.”

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 6:06 am 



“This is a new essay from Alexander Aston.”
https://tinyurl.com/usghpnj the automatic earth

“Some will read this and misunderstand me and believe that I am being apocalyptic about the physical illness brought about by the coronavirus. The virus is serious, and will have dramatic consequences, but it is no black death. The virus is a catalyst, something beyond our agency to control which is triggering cascading changes in a system that has been rotting for some time…That is, I would expect a very different kind of society and culture, albeit causally linked, from that which preceded it. Another way to frame this is that periods of systemic collapse and reorganisation generate new forms of social psychology, new narratives, beliefs and practices. A new epoch is here, and we will all quickly learn that we are very different kinds of people than we thought we were. Soon, things will start looking radically different from what we have known to be the order of things. States, institutions, practices and beliefs that once seemed permanent fixtures of our world will be swept away…This may seem extreme, the momentum of history has not fully tipped us over the edge yet, which allows psychological space for defaulting to normalcy bias. The problem is that causality is not linear, and it does operate at singular scales. What we are experiencing has been building for decades, but the synergy of these causal processes, their true emergent effects are about to become fully apparent. The virus is a spark, not the cause, and it is breaking down the last reinforcing bonds holding the global system together…Our narratives have been fundamentally shaken and fractured, but soon they will start collapsing and it is going to be very difficult to rebuild trust once they finally give. Our collective faith in the system will break down completely with the loss of the shared forms of value through which we incorporate ourselves into our social relationships and ensure our well-being; those things that glue our collective narratives together. This is when we will be most vulnerable to social violence, because we won’t know whom to trust, and we will be desperate to survive the upheaval. This is also when radically new forms of organisation will begin to emerge, as people build coalitions and communities to meet new challenges. These relationships will become the bedrock for new cultural relationships…We live in a moment of radical historical change, but do not despair. Things will be difficult, but these are the moments at which humans are the most creative and most inspiring. We will see hard, sometimes brutal things, but we are also going to see new kinds of beauty brought into this world. We must hold on to that, we must hold on to a sense of vision and endeavour, that something better is still possible. More than anything, take care of each other. The future belongs to those who know how to cooperate best, how to share effectively, how to generate new forms of value, new narratives, new communities. We are at the end of the beginning and much will depend on our choices, our courage and our compassion in the coming years. I wish all of you luck and solidarity as we become Twenty-First Century people.”

anon on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 6:27 am 



the people who tout the hydrogen thing must have pretty much zero clue about actual engineering. hydrogen in pure form is one of the most inconvenient materials to try to store, transport, conduct through pipes or restrict with valves and plugs etc etc in those containers or pipes. It soaks right through most metals (also causing structural damage to the metals in the process) , hydrogen-safe plumbing is horrendously expenmsive precision equipment, leaks are much more dangerous than, say, natgas, not to mention liquid fuels, in that H has a very wide range of air mixtures that are very flammable… storing as a liquid is asking for trouble as it means constantly boiling some off to keep the rest cool, dealing with leaks and pressure, storing as a high pressure gas only further worsens all the other problems, and the only sources of pure H on earth and from chemically isolating it from other things, for example electrolysing water. The power in vs power out there makes it a poor competitor for a battery as it is, and with the capital cost and risk involved its pretty much always going to be a pointless boutique item for someone to show off and say look its hydrogen powered. at best a costly, hazardous novelty item.

now, hanging that hydrogen off of a long parraffin chain, as in gas or diesel, is an excellent method of storing it in cheap, safe containers, in quantities that allow long range operation of things powered by it, that allow long term storage of large amounts of those fuels , making actual trade and distribution of them much more realistic…

Abraham van Helsing on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 7:08 am 



“the people who tout the hydrogen thing must have pretty much zero clue about actual engineering. hydrogen in pure form is one of the most inconvenient materials to try to store, transport, conduct through pipes or restrict with valves and plugs etc etc in those containers or pipes.”

According to this, the Dutch natural gas grid can be simply upgraded for 100% hydrogen:

https://www.fluxenergie.nl/huidige-gasnet-eenvoudig-geschikt-te-maken-voor-waterstof/?gdpr=accept

“De belangrijkste conclusie uit dit onderzoek is, dat het bestaande gasnetwerk met de juiste maatregelen prima ingezet kan worden om duurzame gassen zoals (100%) waterstof en biomethaan te distribueren. Daar waar distributie van duurzame gassen gewenst is, kan het gasnet van de toekomst in grote mate gelijk blijven aan het huidige aardgasnetwerk. De belangrijkste aanpassing voor de netbeheerders betreft het meten en de verrekening van de geleverde hoeveelheid energie. Een voorwaarde is verder, dat bij de eindgebruiker de toestellen geschikt gemaakt worden voor 100% waterstof en biomethaan.”

“The most important conclusion of this study is that with the right measures the existing gas network can become excellent suitable for distributing sustainable gases such as (100%) hydrogen and biomethane. Where distribution of sustainable gases is desired, the gas network of the future can largely remain the same as the current natural gas network. The most important adjustment for the network operators concerns the measurement and settlement of the stored amount of energy. A further condition is that the devices are made suitable for 100% hydrogen and biomethane for the end user.”

The “Stadt-aan-het-Haringvliet” will be the first community where natural gas will be replaced with hydrogen for space heating:

https://www.kiwa.com/globalassets/netherlands/kiwa-technology/downloads/publicatie-ombouw-waterstof-stad-aan-t-haringvliet.pdf

The KIWA is the Dutch certification institute, they really know what they are doing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stad_aan_%27t_Haringvliet

Abraham van Helsing on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 7:13 am 



From the same link, “myths about waterstuff” (=hydrogen)

https://www.kiwa.com/globalassets/netherlands/kiwa-technology/downloads/publicatie-ombouw-waterstof-stad-aan-t-haringvliet.pdf

“Een waterstofmolecuul is zo klein dat waterstof overal doorheen dringt

Niet waar: waterstof is inderdaad een ‘beweeglijker’ gas dan aardgas, maar het verschil is in de praktijk van beperkte
betekenis. De viscositeit is ongeveer 40% lager, dit betekent dat bij eenzelfde klein laminair lek er 40% meer volume
weglekt dan bij aardgas. Gassen kunnen ook door kunststoffen diffunderen (zich door de wand verplaatsen). Metingen door Kiwa hebben uitgewezen dat deze zogenoemde permeatie bij waterstof een factor 2 à 3 hoger is dan bij aardgas. In totaal gaat er minder dan 0.0001% van het gedistribueerde gas verloren door permeatie. In de praktijk is voor beide gassen de permeatie niet merkbaar en nooit gevaarlijk”

Translation:

“A hydrogen molecule is so small that hydrogen penetrates everywhere

Not true: hydrogen is indeed a “more mobile” gas than natural gas, but the difference is limited in practice meaning. The viscosity is about 40% lower, this means that with the same small laminar leak 40% more volume then leaks away from natural gas. Gases can also diffuse through plastics (moving through the wall). Measurements by Kiwa have shown that this so-called permeation with hydrogen a factor of 2 to 3 higher
then with natural gas. In total there is less than 0.0001% of the distributed gas lost through permeation. In practice, the permeation for both gases is not noticeable and never dangerous”

So anon, go back to Start, you won’t receive $200.

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 7:49 am 



Oops, sorry y’all. I forgot. Were supposed to be discussing hydrogen.

Call me a dumbass

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:01 am 



The following two post are for this forum three frauds and failures. First is juanPee a trolling lunatic who talks about conspiracies until they clash with his cherished positions. He is of course anything-anti-American. Doesn’t matter what or if it is a lie, juanPee embraces it. JuanPee said this is nothing and we are all overreacting. He said Miami won’t get it because it is in a warm climate and the virus won’t spread there. The virus is already in Tampa region, stupid. juanPee now continues to do his trolling and lying despite this being a critical time when valuable discussions could be taking place. The second fraud and failure is makato1 who like juanPee said this virus is nothing. The flu is so much worse according to makato1. He also has let on this is a CIA bio attack. He still claims Asia will be fine and this virus will crush the US. Get the drift of the two frauds and liars! Then there is Anonymouse who only stalks and troll and supports the other two frauds. I mention him because the 3 are a pair and act like they own the forum but instead they are broadcasting failure and stupidity.

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:01 am 



“What Are The Odds?” – A Timeline Of Facts Linking Covid-19, HIV, & Wuhan’s Secret Bio-Lab”
https://tinyurl.com/sj68kuf zero hedge

“Having been permanently banned from Twitter for sharing the publicly-available details of the man who ran the show as far a bat-soup virology in Wuhan’s super-secret bio-lab – which is now a common talking point and rapidly shifting from conspiracy theory to conspiracy fact – we thought a reminder of how we got here was in order… Scott Burke, CEO of crypto-related firm Groundhog, unleashed what we feel may be the most complete timelines of facts to help understand the controversial links between COVID-19 and HIV, and COVID-19 and Wuhan Institute of Virology…A disclaimer: I am not a virologist. This is me synthesizing what we have learned since the outbreak began and reviewing public scientific papers. I believe each of the following statements is a solid fact, backed up by a citation. I also want to say that I understand some people are worried about blame being cast for this outbreak. Obviously we are all in this together, and my intention here is not to cast blame. These links overwhelmingly compel further scrutiny, but are not conclusive.”

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:02 am 



“What Are The Odds?” – A Timeline Of Facts Linking Covid-19, HIV, & Wuhan’s Secret Bio-Lab”
https://tinyurl.com/sj68kuf zero hedge

“So there’s original SARS, which is a type of coronavirus. SARS infects cells through the ACE2 receptor in hosts…They decided to create a pseudovirus where they essentially put a SARS-like CoV in a HIV envelope. It worked. Using an HIV envelope, they replaced the RBD (receptor binding domain) of SL-CoV with that of SARS-CoV, and used it to successfully infect bats through ACE2 mediation. 12 years goes by…A SARS-like CoV begins sweeping the globe that is far more infectious than previous outbreaks. Ground Zero for this outbreak (not first human patient, but first spreading event) is considered to be Wuhan Seafood Market. Wuhan Seafood Market is 20 miles from the National Biosafety Laboratory at Wuhan Institute of Virology…COVID-19 has a unique sequence about 1,378 nucleotide base pairs long that is not found in related coronaviruses. They claimed to identify genetic similarities in this unique material between COVID-19 and HIV-1. Specifically, they isolated 4 short genetic sequences in key protein structures (the receptor binding domain, or RBD)… One key debunking attempt claims this: The same sequences are found in a variant called BetaCoV/bat/Yunnan/RaTG13/2013, which had been found “in the wild” in bats. This is an attempt to prove that it was not engineered, but mutated naturally in the wild. But there’s a problem…This strain was only known by and studied at the Wuhan Virology Institute, and although they claim it was discovered in 2013, it wasn’t published or shared with the scientific community until immediately after the Indian paper, on January 27, 2020…What are the odds that a SARS-like coronavirus with overlapping genetics from HIV mutated and crossed over into humans, next door to a laboratory which had been enhancing coronavirus with HIV for over a decade? And conversely, what are the odds it leaked out of the laboratory? Finally, there is a great thread here by Trevor Bedford (@trvrb) examining the evidence for and against, with key replies challenging the conclusions made as well.”

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:07 am 



Oops, sorry for the stalking. Trolling. And off topic spam again y’all. This beer virus thingys got me REAL wurked up.

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:11 am 



And we all no zero hedge has been spreadin mis-information write from the start of this thang

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:21 am 



That got juanPee upset. Poor widdle guy has very sensitive feelings. Just wait until he gets the virus then he will really feel bad for living his lie.

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:25 am 



Fair and balanced…

“Does The Coronavirus Make The Case For World Government?”
https://tinyurl.com/yx3wc3ud zero hedge

“Sometimes terrible things happen without any human malfeasance, and the novel Wuhan coronavirus may in fact be one of those things. It is entirely plausible the virus emerged from “wet markets” in the Hubei Province of China rather than as a fumbled (or worse, intentionally released) bioweapon cooked up by the Xi Jinping government. We may never know, of course. But easy or readily apparent answers to the question of how this could have been avoided should be viewed with the skepticism appropriate to any state propaganda. Crises of all kinds, whether economic, political, military, or health, send ideologues scrambling to explain how such events fit neatly into their worldview. In fact, political partisans often attempt to paint any crisis as having occurred in the first place precisely because their policies and preferences have not been adopted. The Wuhan coronavirus seems tailor-made for this. Alarmists who argue for (i) much more robust and comprehensive “public health” measures by national governments and (ii) greater supranational coordination inevitably point to infectious diseases as justification for increased state power over personal medical decisions. Scary and fast-spreading viruses are perfect fodder for their busybody argument that people cannot simply be left to their own devices.”

Davy on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:31 am 



there you go juanPee do some research and feel smart.

REAL Green on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:33 am 



The topic up fer discussin is hydrogen Davy

Duncan Idaho on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:38 am 



1982 — Philip K. Dick dies, Santa Ana, California, American science fiction writer par excellence. Author of Flow My Tears the Policeman Said, Crack in Space, Man in the High Castle, Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?, Time Out of Joint, etc.

“The basic tool for the manipulation of reality is the manipulation of words.

If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words.”

— Philip K. Dick

Duncan Idaho on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 9:40 am 



1997 — US: Earth First! activist Judi Bari (b.1949) dies.

“Ten jurors got a good, hard look at the FBI & they didn’t like what they saw.”

Judi’s estate received a $4.4 million in a false-arrest lawsuit, against Oakland police & the FBI for trying to frame them (they were arrested for bombing their own car while they were in it…), after a federal jury unanimously finds FBI & OPD defendants framed her & Darryl Cherney in an effort to crush Earth First!

full woke supremacist muzzies jerk on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 11:43 am 



Supertards
Please change your underwear
Mine has been on 5 days
Time to change

full woke supremacist muzzies jerk on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 12:16 pm 



Imma increase my underwear to 100 so 8 only wash once every 3 months.
I’m still unable to secure even a single lib run. They can be good for storing used underwear before washing

Duncan Idaho on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 12:20 pm 



It Took Joe Biden 32 Years and 3 Presidential Campaigns to Win One Primary
https://truthout.org/articles/it-took-joe-biden-32-years-and-3-presidential-campaigns-to-win-one-primary/

Duncan Idaho on Mon, 2nd Mar 2020 12:29 pm 



Texas Repugs:
“The analysis finds that the 50 counties that gained the most Black and Latinx residents between 2012 and 2018 closed 542 polling sites, compared to just 34 closures in the 50 counties that have gained the fewest black and Latinx residents. This is despite the fact that the population in the former group of counties has risen by 2.5 million people, whereas in the latter category the total population has fallen by over 13,000”.