Donate Bitcoin

Donate Paypal


PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Why I stopped being a doomer

What's on your mind?
General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby jedrider » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 00:10:12

I'm not a doomer because I get a lot of things wrong, particularly the timing, and timing is everything :-D

However, I give our civilization a snowball's chance in hell of making it into the 22nd century unscathed.

See, I'm not a doomer, but a catastrophist! Nothing one can do can prepare oneself for a true catastrophe.

[I try to talk myself out of being a doomer, but I rarely succeed BTW.]
User avatar
jedrider
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3107
Joined: Thu 28 May 2009, 10:10:44

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby Loki » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 01:02:14

The OP came to this site lying from day one, claimed he was a female for some reason, but was quickly outed as a male. Given the cut and paste nature of his posts, he's likely just been on an extended trolling expedition. This thread is probably (hopefully) his last grasp for attention.

Buh bye "Maiden." Don't let the door hit ya and and all that.
A garden will make your rations go further.
User avatar
Loki
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 3509
Joined: Sat 08 Apr 2006, 03:00:00
Location: Oregon

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby Sixstrings » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 04:30:50

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GregT', 'I')f you truly believe the above Six, then there is absolutely no point in attempting to communicate with you.


What part don't you agree with? Which part are you against, are you against solar power? Are you against batteries, and energy efficiency and fewer power plants needed? Or is it the space stuff you're against?

Is it not not a good idea to eat least hedge bets and do all the above?

Save the planet, but build a boat too?

If you were among the last on easter island, and only a few trees left and some were cutting those down to make some more statues, would you be against the guy that wanted to make a boat?

edit: maybe you could just expound on your point. I don't understand, are you against green energy tech.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby MD » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 05:52:05

I stopped being a doomer once I accepted the fact that we're just in a normal cycle of life. We've happened to enjoy riding along the top of a wave is all.

So there will be a decline. Maybe fast. Maybe slow. You can worry, fret, and speculate about it endlessly; but what fun is that? (Actually the speculative part can be kind of fun, taken in proper proportion.)

Sure it's healthy to prepare for little bumps in your personal road, but to prepare to hunker down in a bunker hoping to ride out years of post technological apocalypse? Nah. What's the point? If that reality comes to pass just go ahead and join a zombie hoard and prepare to eat or be eaten. Or just sit down and enjoy the show until you die. Too fatalistic? Maybe, but it beats getting all worked up over what you can't control.

In the mean time I try to be as "low impact" as possible. Life is all about the little things, but at the same time "don't sweat the small stuff". Fun little dichotomies every-which-way.

If this is your thing: "We are the human race we're gonna party out this place and then move on..." ,then enjoy your debauchery and decadence, who am I to judge? Party on!

Well aren't I just the relaxed zen man today... :mrgreen:
Stop filling dumpsters, as much as you possibly can, and everything will get better.

Just think it through.
It's not hard to do.
User avatar
MD
COB
COB
 
Posts: 4953
Joined: Mon 02 May 2005, 03:00:00
Location: On the ball

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby Ibon » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 07:09:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MD', ' ')
Well aren't I just the relaxed zen man today... :mrgreen:


A little zen goes a long way......

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'b')ut to prepare to hunker down in a bunker hoping to ride out years of post technological apocalypse?


This is what little mice do 24 hours a day in order to survive. The caricature of a doomer in a bunker loaded with ammunition is kind of a fearful mouse on steroids.
Patiently awaiting the pathogens. Our resiliency resembles an invasive weed. We are the Kudzu Ape
blog: http://blog.mounttotumas.com/
website: http://www.mounttotumas.com
User avatar
Ibon
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 9572
Joined: Fri 03 Dec 2004, 04:00:00
Location: Volcan, Panama

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby Revi » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 08:56:49

You are passing through the stages of being peak oil aware. You are almost at the stage where you realize that it's reality, but it is time to try some things out. Why not? What do we have to lose?
Deep in the mud and slime of things, even there, something sings.
User avatar
Revi
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 7417
Joined: Mon 25 Apr 2005, 03:00:00
Location: Maine

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby eugene » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 09:33:13

I did my first run in 1970 only we didn't have words like "doomer" then. As time went on and my demise did not occur, unlike you, I realized my sense of timing was wrong. As I changed my timing, I learned to watch it happening. Now I enjoy studying the thinking processes of those who deny. One that I see is "if it's not happening to me, it's not happening". Normal human self centered thinking. It is happening to millions right now but it's the poor and who gives a shit about them anyway.+ The one I really like is "we've always survived". Yep, so have I. I've never died. Doesn't mean I won't. Many yrs ago, a man with a Master's degree (took me a while to learn education doesn't mean much sometimes) told me "humans have always been here".

And, of course, climate change is racing on but millions continue to say "not happening". I've read books about early Arctic explorers being trapped in the ice for 2-3 yrs and now they're sailing the Northwest passage in couple of months. But "nope nothing is happening". Canadian Coast Guard is training crews for Arctic shipping rescues. Course it's stupid as some of us absolutely know "nothing is happening". Or the Russians beginning to ship oil through the Arctic. Russian propaganda I say.

The comments on this blog are an excellent study of psychology. Might try it sometime. As for me, it's done deal. Doomer or realist, time will tell.
eugene
Peat
Peat
 
Posts: 76
Joined: Sat 23 Aug 2014, 10:08:45

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby C8 » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 12:09:31

props to Desu Maiden for coming to sanity so fast from so far down- anyone who is a "doomer" or "corny" is saying: "I have a closed mind". Nobody can predict the future. Many possible disasters possibly await as do many miraculous scientific discoveries or social trends. The most intellectually dishonest thing to do is to become an optimist or pessimist.
User avatar
C8
Heavy Crude
Heavy Crude
 
Posts: 1074
Joined: Sun 14 Apr 2013, 09:02:48

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby copious.abundance » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 15:07:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DesuMaiden', 'E')ither way, I stopped being a doomer.

It's official: Hell has frozen over.

Unless, of course, he/she/it is just trying to pull a fast one on us.
Stuff for doomers to contemplate:
http://peakoil.com/forums/post1190117.html#p1190117
http://peakoil.com/forums/post1193930.html#p1193930
http://peakoil.com/forums/post1206767.html#p1206767
User avatar
copious.abundance
Fission
Fission
 
Posts: 9589
Joined: Wed 26 Mar 2008, 03:00:00
Location: Cornucopia

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby careinke » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 16:28:43

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('copious.abundance', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DesuMaiden', 'E')ither way, I stopped being a doomer.

It's official: Hell has frozen over.

Unless, of course, he/she/it is just trying to pull a fast one on us.


Or schizophrenia?
Cliff (Start a rEVOLution, grow a garden)
User avatar
careinke
Volunteer
Volunteer
 
Posts: 5047
Joined: Mon 01 Jan 2007, 04:00:00
Location: Pacific Northwest
Top

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby GregT » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 20:44:29

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', 'e')dit: maybe you could just expound on your point. I don't understand, are you against green energy tech.


The closest known POSSIBLY habitable planet is 13 light years away. With current best technologies, it would take 800 million years to reach.
GregT
Coal
Coal
 
Posts: 409
Joined: Thu 24 Jan 2013, 21:18:20
Location: Pacific Northwest
Top

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 20:50:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('careinke', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('copious.abundance', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DesuMaiden', 'E')ither way, I stopped being a doomer.

It's official: Hell has frozen over.

Unless, of course, he/she/it is just trying to pull a fast one on us.


Or schizophrenia?


Schizophrenics tend to be more engaged with conversation, I suspect ASD probably high functioning Asperger's. Communication all one way traffic, always right even when diametrically opposed to himself. Into 'lining things up'.
SeaGypsy
Master Prognosticator
Master Prognosticator
 
Posts: 9285
Joined: Wed 04 Feb 2009, 04:00:00
Top

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 21:03:29

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GregT', 'I')f you truly believe the above Six, then there is absolutely no point in attempting to communicate with you.


What part don't you agree with? Which part are you against, are you against solar power? Are you against batteries, and energy efficiency and fewer power plants needed? Or is it the space stuff you're against?

Is it not not a good idea to eat least hedge bets and do all the above?

Save the planet, but build a boat too?

If you were among the last on easter island, and only a few trees left and some were cutting those down to make some more statues, would you be against the guy that wanted to make a boat?

edit: maybe you could just expound on your point. I don't understand, are you against green energy tech.


Nothing makes less sense to anyone not mathematically retarded than yabbering on about space travel, new planets to destroy etc. Don't forget that each communication delivery between here & 'planet x minimum' is 26 years return. Imagining for a moment it had already happened, in a lifetime there might be 3 or 4 installments to the conversation we are having with our hundreds of millions of years separated cousins. As for space doughnuts aka KJ do the math per kilo, come up with the $ & it will surely fail, a similie can't even be built on earth. All dumb shit to be focused on.
SeaGypsy
Master Prognosticator
Master Prognosticator
 
Posts: 9285
Joined: Wed 04 Feb 2009, 04:00:00
Top

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby Loki » Tue 09 Jun 2015, 22:29:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GregT', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', 'e')dit: maybe you could just expound on your point. I don't understand, are you against green energy tech.


The closest known POSSIBLY habitable planet is 13 light years away. With current best technologies, it would take 800 million years to reach.

Considering endless exponential technological advance, we could cut that down to 100 million years by century's end. Hell, by the end of the millenium it might only take a million years.

See, problem solved by technology! :razz:
A garden will make your rations go further.
User avatar
Loki
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 3509
Joined: Sat 08 Apr 2006, 03:00:00
Location: Oregon
Top

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Wed 10 Jun 2015, 01:38:09

Also the doughnut idea is not going to be anywhere near as fast & likely stationary orbit. All fast ships will not have gravity, so in a million years with 80,000% improvements in performance would arrive in whatever state a million years of zero gravity would produce. Something like a jellyfish with eyes. Probably better to breed a human jellyfish hybrid & fill the ship with seawater. At least jellyfish get along OK. Dexterity & activities such as empire building will require death rays to intimidate & enslave local populations.
SeaGypsy
Master Prognosticator
Master Prognosticator
 
Posts: 9285
Joined: Wed 04 Feb 2009, 04:00:00

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby americandream » Wed 10 Jun 2015, 04:32:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GregT', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '[')b]Musk is really right on these big issues and they all tie together:

EV's + batteries + solar + space development to branch us off the planet.



If you truly believe the above Six, then there is absolutely no point in attempting to communicate with you.


Six excels in magical thinking.
americandream
Permanently Banned
 
Posts: 8650
Joined: Mon 18 Oct 2004, 03:00:00
Top

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby GHung » Wed 10 Jun 2015, 09:26:42

I found Six's comment interesting (even considered he was being sarcastic), but didn't have time to respond. Regarding Musk, Greer mentioned his 'success' last week:

http://www.thearchdruidreport.blogspot. ... kdown.html

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')A California newspaper, for example, recently mentioned that Elon Musk’s large and much-ballyhooed fortune is almost entirely a product of government subsidies. Musk is a smart guy; he obviously realized a good long time ago that federal and state subsidies for technology was where the money was at, and he’s constructed an industrial empire funded by US taxpayers to the tune of many billions of dollars. None of his publicly traded firms has ever made a profit, and as long as the subsidies keep flowing, none of them ever has to; between an overflowing feed trough of government largesse and the longstanding eagerness of fools to be parted from their money by way of the stock market, he’s pretty much set for life.


.... and there are plenty of other externalities Six ignores, but it seems that's his strategy for navigating the highly complex decline humanity finds itself in; plenty of 'robbing Peter to pay Paul' going on to mask the trend of extend and pretend. Matters little when the irreplaceable finite resources our species has become dependent upon, especially environmental resources, are being depleted at an obscene rate. We'll let future generations deal with that, eh? I, for one, am resisting (when possible) defaulting into a sociopathic funk simply because it's convenient. It seems tantamount to ignoring that your neighbor beats the shit out of his kids every night because getting involved would be 'problematic'.

It's all about how one lives with one's self. None of us are perfect, but that doesn't mean we have to like it. If you're stealing from your children, at least leave them with a plan of some sort; skills to face, and deal with, a thoroughly exploited planet because a thoroughly exploited planet is what we're leaving behind. It escapes me,, how one gets right with that. Pretence I suppose....
Blessed are the Meek, for they shall inherit nothing but their Souls. - Anonymous Ghung Person
User avatar
GHung
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 3093
Joined: Tue 08 Sep 2009, 16:06:11
Location: Moksha, Nearvana
Top

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby Pops » Wed 10 Jun 2015, 11:59:04

6 doesn't think there is such a thing as PO, not sure how he got here
The legitimate object of government, is to do for a community of people, whatever they need to have done, but can not do, at all, or can not, so well do, for themselves -- in their separate, and individual capacities.
-- Abraham Lincoln, Fragment on Government (July 1, 1854)
User avatar
Pops
Elite
Elite
 
Posts: 19746
Joined: Sat 03 Apr 2004, 04:00:00
Location: QuikSac for a 6-Pac

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby rdberg1957 » Wed 10 Jun 2015, 13:51:36

Do I believe that humans will be probably become extinct relatively soon given the crises that confront us? Yes. What relatively soon means I don't know. I don't believe that is predictable because there are too many moving parts. Extinction is built in to the equation because the sun will nova, the Earth will burn to a crisp. If we look at the history of species other than ourselves we can get some idea of lifespans which are possible. Bacteria have greater lifespans than reptiles which have greater longevity overall than mammals. My impression is that climatologists and biologists are not sanguine about our future.

As a species, we have survived a great deal and in some ways we are improving. Governments, despite problems and propaganda, have improved our lot by decreasing violence amongst us. However, I believe governments are likely to be overwhelmed by the enormity of changes on the horizon. The changes are happening now, but we have trouble perceiving them and evaluating the threats. The threats include peak oil, climate change, fresh water depletion, ocean PH, resource depletion of all kinds, economic inequality, overshoot, and financial distress. Sometimes, some of us overstate the threats based on skewed data. Hence, doomerism. Sometimes, some of us deny threats because of our ability to overcome past difficulties or because it is inconvenient to perceive threats accurately. Just because we survived the development of the atomic bomb doesn't mean that lots of people at Hiroshima and Nagasaki did. It is really hard to be right about scenarios which involve catastrophes because we haven't been very good at predicting them. We are certainly getting better at predicting earthquakes, hurricanes, and tornadoes.

Our efforts at predicting when oil will peak have been frustrated by multiple changes in oil production and consumption based on price, leveraging of technology, and other factors. It may not be possible to predict the occurrence of peaking within an error band of ten or twenty years, much less give a year. Will it happen? I would be very surprised if it didn't given the history of oil wells and regions.

If doomerism means living life in panic mode, then I am not a doomer. I believe it is quite possible that I could live to see financial collapse and other sequelae of peak oil. I watch, I listen, I try to support what I think are better ways to live. I am not likely to survive a meltdown so I don't fret or try to prepare in a material way. I think it is possible for humans to escape demise, but the changes required of us by our environment are enormous. In short, my hair is not on fire even if the house may be soon. I'm sure I will panic if I see major disruptions which are peak oil related. I already see signs of frayed infrastructure, international conflict, and such. I would say I am an existentialist and start with the premise that existence is absurd, that any good that comes in life is wonderful, that living in the present while being aware of the future is the best I can do.
User avatar
rdberg1957
Peat
Peat
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri 28 Jul 2006, 03:00:00

Re: Why I stopped being a doomer

Unread postby ennui2 » Wed 10 Jun 2015, 16:31:13

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', '6') doesn't think there is such a thing as PO, not sure how he got here


What I see a lot here is a desperate attempt for people to cling to a narrative that makes them feel better. That's why people can turn on a dime to "we're screwed" to "we're saved". It's not that they really have worked things out intellectually, but it's that need to clutch at a simple narrative and to delude oneself into thinking that it's infallible--only to wind up abandoning it for some new narrative later, like putting on a new pair of clothes.
"If the oil price crosses above the Etp maximum oil price curve within the next month, I will leave the forum." --SumYunGai (9/21/2016)
User avatar
ennui2
Permanently Banned
 
Posts: 3920
Joined: Tue 20 Sep 2011, 10:37:02
Location: Not on Homeworld
Top

PreviousNext

Return to Open Topic Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron