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Economic Sabotage?

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Economic Sabotage?

Unread postby FoxV » Fri 27 May 2005, 23:34:19

In the article on Michael Ruppert on the homepage Ruppert says:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 's')how one intent and one intent only, which is bankrupting the United States

now this actually makes sense to me because it explains a lot of what is happeing in the US. If you take the position that Junior is trying to help the american people, nothing makes sense because he's doing everything backwards

Now is Mr Ruppert a bit of a wingnut and just scaring up book sales, or does he have a valid point. If Junior is actually trying to scuttle the US it means the fall will be much faster and harder than we could imagine (denial and media manipulation escalating things beyond belief).

I can't see this being his plan though because if it comes out that he manipulated the world into causing the Mother of All Depressions, then his head will end up mounted on a pyke on the Whitehouse lawn.
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Unread postby MicroHydro » Fri 27 May 2005, 23:47:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'i')s Mr Ruppert a bit of a wingnut ?


Yes. He is a sucker for far out SciFi ideas and believes in magic AI software that can take over any computer and spy satellites that can resolve a human hair.

But, the idea that Bush Co. wants to bankrupt most Americans (everyone now considered to be working class or middle class) is corect. His core constituency, the super rich, will then be the lords of a new feudalism as everyone else becomes serfs or worse. This will also slash consumption as >90% of Americans will be as poor as people in India and consume almost nothing. That will be the "ownership society". Everyone who now has debt is going to be owned.
"The world is changed... I feel it in the water... I feel it in the earth... I smell it in the air... Much that once was, is lost..." - Galadriel
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Unread postby ubercrap » Sat 28 May 2005, 00:21:39

Oh, I don't know, maybe in the long run, he views economic collapse as something that could actually "help" in a perverse way. If the U.S. economy implodes spectacularly, the world might start dumping dollars causing huge inflation. Faced with huge debt and no way to pay it back, the government might decide to "print" huge amounts of money to hyperinflate its way out of debt. Provided the country and world were not completely destroyed some way, it would once again make American manufacturing, etc.. competitive in the world scene again with legions of workers desperate for pennies. Just an idea.
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Unread postby pilferage » Sat 28 May 2005, 00:23:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MicroHydro', 'Y')es. He is a sucker for far out SciFi ideas and believes in magic AI software that can take over any computer and spy satellites that can resolve a human hair.


Publically, there's 1m resolution, it's not a far off stretch to assume that the DOD has much better resolution for military purposes...
and in terms of software, just about anything networked can be hacked, it's just a matter of how.
"Humankind cannot gain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost. "
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Unread postby RonMN » Sat 28 May 2005, 08:39:26

It appears to me that the USG is spending like a person who is about to file bankruptcy. They rack up all they can on the credit cards BEFORE they file. (if it's going to happen anyway, might as well grab all ya can).

But what do i know?
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Unread postby NEOPO » Sat 28 May 2005, 12:59:31

I suppose the use of subliminal messages was killed in the 60's and cannot be resurrected???

I use to play an online game - I had a hard time tearing myself away from this game.

It eases my worries - calms my fears - its totally consuming and if you play the game well you dont even realize time is passing.

Interesting to say the least.

Yeah there is no such thing as sublimality and mind control........ :o
Peak oil is a lie made up so that we accept the prices at the pump...... :o

Since many people are planning a return to nature and get off the grid and the pump - I would think that the grand conspiracy has backfired 8)

You can lead a horse to water................

If one part of his theory made you look away I suggest you just look away continually as there will be many things that you will not agree with that will be absolutely true.

You do not have to believe for something to be real.
If it doesnt make sense it doesnt make it lies........
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Unread postby threadbear » Sat 28 May 2005, 13:53:42

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ubercrap', 'O')h, I don't know, maybe in the long run, he views economic collapse as something that could actually "help" in a perverse way. If the U.S. economy implodes spectacularly, the world might start dumping dollars causing huge inflation. Faced with huge debt and no way to pay it back, the government might decide to "print" huge amounts of money to hyperinflate its way out of debt. Provided the country and world were not completely destroyed some way, it would once again make American manufacturing, etc.. competitive in the world scene again with legions of workers desperate for pennies. Just an idea.


Bingo--It's called Creative Destruction, and it's part of the Straussian, neo conservative system of beliefs. And as you say, it's a paradigm buster that may have some perverse logic to it. You could perhaps give them credit in this regard. Perhaps they see a collapse as imminent and they are prodding it to collapse quickly and in a way that maximizes their power, entrenches it and prevents it from EVER being taken away from them. They likely believe that in the event of a true economic collapse, democracy isn't possible.

If you really think this is true, Uber, you have to understand that the Straussians also believe that vitalizing the church is a vital part of this plan. This is what happened in Rome, where power was effectively transferred from the executive branch directly into the controlling theocracy, of the Roman Catholic church. The difference is, it took centuries for this to play out. The neocons want to rush the current changes, knowing that if they do things very quickly, people won't know what hit them. We are so used to the glacial changes that democracies impose, it's going to be astounding.

Anyone who thinks this might be true, is well advised to emigrate. If not, just hunker down and mentally prepare. Keep a low profile, stay positive and pray. Peak oil may turn out to be a concern but it might take a back seat to the background hum and irritation of living in a true theocratic police state.

Micro Hydro, I thought the same thing about some of Ruppert's ideas about an all ecompassing all knowing technology. He may be engaging in fantasy, but then again, we have no idea what is going on in the world of black budgets at the present time.

What we do know is the historical reality of mind control projects like MKultra, that achieved a remarkable degree of sophistication many decades ago. Extrapolating from there, it's fair to question what might be known and being worked on today.

Tinfoil hats, though absurd in appearance, can sometimes be valuable antennae, once the signal to noise is sorted out. There's a book called Blank Check, by Tim Weiner, a very good mainstream writer, who explains just how byzantine, underreported and strange is the world of off the records research and development in the US, and how much money dissapears into this black hole every year.

Catherine Austin Fitts, a past assistant director of HUD, is also a reliable source of info regarding the enormity of the off the record money transfers out of govt coffers directly into corporate hands.

Taking a hop skip and jump from there, you get the distinct impression that much of the funding and the real leading edge science has been happening behind closed doors, some of it an extension of earlier secretive projects, that we now know about. If these projects became transparent, they would likely seem entirely sci-fi to us.

For that matter, If someone had told you 30 years ago what the world would be like to day--ozone hole, global warming, peak oil, aids, fascist dictatorship in the US, would that not have qualified as speculative fiction, if not outright Sci-fi?

The strange can become real, almost overnight.
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Unread postby SidneyTawl » Sat 28 May 2005, 19:46:12

Oh MY :shock:

Threadbear,

do you ,... realize, ummmm, gulp,

this post, was ummm your

SIX SIX SIX

post

syncronicity, or, or ,or.
:P :P :P :P

sorry had to do it. :P
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Unread postby ubercrap » Sun 29 May 2005, 20:04:03

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ubercrap', 'O')h, I don't know, maybe in the long run, he views economic collapse as something that could actually "help" in a perverse way. If the U.S. economy implodes spectacularly, the world might start dumping dollars causing huge inflation. Faced with huge debt and no way to pay it back, the government might decide to "print" huge amounts of money to hyperinflate its way out of debt. Provided the country and world were not completely destroyed some way, it would once again make American manufacturing, etc.. competitive in the world scene again with legions of workers desperate for pennies. Just an idea.


Bingo--It's called Creative Destruction, and it's part of the Straussian, neo conservative system of beliefs. And as you say, it's a paradigm buster that may have some perverse logic to it. You could perhaps give them credit in this regard. Perhaps they see a collapse as imminent and they are prodding it to collapse quickly and in a way that maximizes their power, entrenches it and prevents it from EVER being taken away from them. They likely believe that in the event of a true economic collapse, democracy isn't possible.

If you really think this is true, Uber, you have to understand that the Straussians also believe that vitalizing the church is a vital part of this plan. This is what happened in Rome, where power was effectively transferred from the executive branch directly into the controlling theocracy, of the Roman Catholic church. The difference is, it took centuries for this to play out. The neocons want to rush the current changes, knowing that if they do things very quickly, people won't know what hit them. We are so used to the glacial changes that democracies impose, it's going to be astounding.

Anyone who thinks this might be true, is well advised to emigrate. If not, just hunker down and mentally prepare. Keep a low profile, stay positive and pray. Peak oil may turn out to be a concern but it might take a back seat to the background hum and irritation of living in a true theocratic police state.

Micro Hydro, I thought the same thing about some of Ruppert's ideas about an all ecompassing all knowing technology. He may be engaging in fantasy, but then again, we have no idea what is going on in the world of black budgets at the present time.

What we do know is the historical reality of mind control projects like MKultra, that achieved a remarkable degree of sophistication many decades ago. Extrapolating from there, it's fair to question what might be known and being worked on today.

Tinfoil hats, though absurd in appearance, can sometimes be valuable antennae, once the signal to noise is sorted out. There's a book called Blank Check, by Tim Weiner, a very good mainstream writer, who explains just how byzantine, underreported and strange is the world of off the records research and development in the US, and how much money dissapears into this black hole every year.

Catherine Austin Fitts, a past assistant director of HUD, is also a reliable source of info regarding the enormity of the off the record money transfers out of govt coffers directly into corporate hands.

Taking a hop skip and jump from there, you get the distinct impression that much of the funding and the real leading edge science has been happening behind closed doors, some of it an extension of earlier secretive projects, that we now know about. If these projects became transparent, they would likely seem entirely sci-fi to us.

For that matter, If someone had told you 30 years ago what the world would be like to day--ozone hole, global warming, peak oil, aids, fascist dictatorship in the US, would that not have qualified as speculative fiction, if not outright Sci-fi?

The strange can become real, almost overnight.


Interesting, I know virtually nothing about Straussian philosophy. I don't know where this idea came from actually, I probably read it somewhere, maybe on this site. What really made the connection in my brain was a conversation with my boss about how much money the airlines are losing. He was absolutely flabbergasted by the fact that they wouldn't raise prices to cover their losses, but instead, were actually competing to provide increasingly lower fairs. At that very moment, it was clear to me even though people have probably been screaming it at me the whole time- they must be in a "race to the bottom" to see who can go bleed the most money and still survive or go bankrupt and shed their "liabilities" like pensions, high worker pay, union contracts, etc... through restructuring. It's much like some cancer treatments. Doctors purposely put a big hurt on the body and hope the cancerous cells will die before the person does. If it works, the long term benefits made the risk worth it.

Are leaders trying to do this with the whole country now? I don't know. It seems like quite a risky strategy, and stinks of conspiracy theory. Every time I come back to it in my mind, though, I have the scary realization that it certainly sounds like it could work.

As for emigrating where would I go and what would I do when I got there?

I agree about things changing quickly. When people talk about modern industrial society developing technology at an incredibly increasing rate, they don't think about the other side, that because of the scale and speed the technology provides we can do things that cause that big problems to come about before we can identify what we precisely what are doing, and reversal of fortunes can happen ever more quickly also.
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