[BigTex]

When I was younger I read "Atlas Shrugged" and "The Fountainhead" and liked them. They portrayed capitalists as super heroes rescuing civilization from the tyranny of dumbasses who didn't understand their utopian vision of complete global industrialization.

When you look at her vision of a perfect world in which Mankind has utterly subdued nature and imposed his will firmly and permanently upon his environment to the betterment of humanity, it seems kind of silly. Like all such visions, it presupposes (perhaps uncounsciously) an endless stream of inputs to which capitalists can perform their value added voodoo in order to produce an endless stream of outputs.

Anybody else come full circle with Ayn Rand, or maybe hated her all along?

Anybody think that she was right?

As many of you probably know, she was very influential on Alan Greenspan's thinking, and I think that he still finds her vision of an ideal society appealing.

[uncarve_db_lock]

Her writings captured me too although I disagree with much of her philosophy, such as the absence of any type of altruistic actions or spiritual nature. The parts that I agree with in part have to do with the concept of Self (although I feel she has not fully developed a universal concept of self).
The whole idea of not being dependent upon anyone other than ones own self and vice versa in regards to others has interesting implications when mixed with a more metaphysical view of Self.
As far as capitalism goes, thats a crock of doo-doo if I ever saw it although I do have to trace my Libertarian views back to a certain element of her writings.

[BigTex]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('uncarve_db_lock', 'H')er writings captured me too although I disagree with much of her philosophy, such as the absence of any type of altruistic actions or spiritual nature. The parts that I agree with in part have to do with the concept of Self (although I feel she has not fully developed a universal concept of self).
The whole idea of not being dependent upon anyone other than ones own self and vice versa in regards to others has interesting implications when mixed with a more metaphysical view of Self.
As far as capitalism goes, thats a crock of doo-doo if I ever saw it although I do have to trace my Libertarian views back to a certain element of her writings.

[BigTex]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('uncarve_db_lock', 'H')er writings captured me too although I disagree with much of her philosophy, such as the absence of any type of altruistic actions or spiritual nature. The parts that I agree with in part have to do with the concept of Self (although I feel she has not fully developed a universal concept of self).
The whole idea of not being dependent upon anyone other than ones own self and vice versa in regards to others has interesting implications when mixed with a more metaphysical view of Self.
As far as capitalism goes, thats a crock of doo-doo if I ever saw it although I do have to trace my Libertarian views back to a certain element of her writings.

[I_Like_Plants]

Sure, I went through my Rand phase, I think most of us do.

She was a Jew.

She had no understanding of Folkishness, no understanding of Volk or of anything not oriented to money, and "I win, you lose".

She was a champion of the predatory capitalism the US suffered under now, under the yoke of her People.

The only good thing I got out of her books is, if you fuck over the working, creative, constructive, part of the populace (she didn't say the Aryans but I will!) then they might just take their ball and bat and go home.

And this is what Aryans need to do now. Drop out of the predatory machine running the US, starve it. Become self- and locally- sufficient. Look to your Folk, work cooperatively, within the Folk and eschew banks not run completely by the Folk, and all usurers. And work towards expelling the invader, and the parasite, from our fine Nation.

So yeah, on Rand, even a broken clock is right once in a while.

[I_Like_Plants]

You need to go read Kevin MacDonald, my friend.

I could not understand anti-semitism either, for the longest time, until I started studying the parasite, reading stuff by and for the parasite, getting into the parasite's mind and culture.

Kevin MacDonald has put this all on a scientific footing, of course.

It will take a while but you CAN overcome the brainwashing.

[drew]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BigTex', 'W')hen I was younger I read "Atlas Shrugged" and "The Fountainhead" and liked them. They portrayed capitalists as super heroes rescuing civilization from the tyranny of dumbasses who didn't understand their utopian vision of complete global industrialization.

Anybody else come full circle with Ayn Rand, or maybe hated her all along?

[BigTex]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('drew', 'I') guess libertarianism comes closest to mind, which certainly is a vile thing to believe in.

There is no place for compassion of self sacrifice in her view.

Drew

[Newfie]

I read her a loooooong time ago. What I find interesting is that people seem to different opinions of what she was about. I have a generally positive feeling yet a lot of my liberal minded friends see her in a very negative light.

Atlas Shrugged implies that most work is done by a few, otherwise know as the Pareto Principal. This was recently restated in the book The Four Hour Work Week by Timothy Ferris.

Basically what it says is that we are generally very inefficient and if we would just quit screwing around the water cooler we could get our stuff done and enjoy our life. However, for most of us, screwing around the water cooler IS our life.

How's that for Atlas Shrugged in brief?

Quoting Wiki here.
The Pareto principle (also known as the 80-20 rule, the law of the vital few and the principle of factor sparsity) states that, for many events, 80% of the effects comes from 20% of the causes. Business management thinker Joseph M. Juran suggested the principle and named it after Italian economist Vilfredo Pareto, who observed that 80% of income in Italy went to 20% of the population. It is a common rule of thumb in business; e.g., "80% of your sales comes from 20% of your clients."

It is worthy of note that some applications of the Pareto principle appeal to a pseudo-scientific "law of nature" to bolster non-quantifiable or non-verifiable assertions that are "painted with a broad brush". The fact that hedges such as the 90/10, 70/30, and 95/5 "rules" exist is sufficient evidence of the non-exactness of the Pareto principle. On the other hand, there is adequate evidence that "clumping" of factors does occur in most phenomena.

The Pareto principle is only tangentially related to Pareto efficiency, which was also introduced by the same economist, Vilfredo Pareto. Pareto developed both concepts in the context of the distribution of income and wealth among the population.

[BigTex]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', 'I') read her a loooooong time ago. What I find interesting is that people seem to different opinions of what she was about. I have a generally positive feeling yet a lot of my liberal minded friends see her in a very negative light.

[Newfie]

BigTex,

The 80/20 rule applies to all kinds of things, I think that at least of 80% of what I do at work is complete crap and could be done away with.

Just being at work is not productive. Mowing your lawn is not productive. Adding value to something and being creative IS productive.

We like to think we are very productive in the US because we spend a stupid amount of time at work. That makes us loyal and stupid, not productive.

If capitalism really worked to make for efficiency then we would have a decent mass transit system in the US.

One of the things that makes me worry less about PO is that we have so much slop, inefficiency, in the system that we can get by with much less than we use now by doing simple things. That will flatten the curve of the collapse but not stop the collapse.

[drew]

If you guys really want to read about injustice under the Soviets some Aleksander Solzhenytsen is in order.

It's funny though, his writing is completely full of optimism and compassion, unlike the less equally oppressed Rand.


Drew

[mattduke]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('drew', 'I') guess libertarianism comes closest to mind, which certainly is a vile thing to believe in.

[BigTex]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mattduke', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('drew', 'I') guess libertarianism comes closest to mind, which certainly is a vile thing to believe in.

[Kingcoal]

How do you make people enlightened? In my experience, you can lead a horse to water... I guess compulsory public education is one way, but we already have that. Pretty much any kid with good enough grades can get into college and that's the ticket because financial aid is available to just about anyone who has that.

Seems to me that we are at the practical limit of making people enlightened. So what's wrong with our society? Hint: too many stupid, unmotivated people? I think that's the real problem in any society.

[BigTex]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', 'H')ow do you make people enlightened? In my experience, you can lead a horse to water...