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Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

General discussions of the systemic, societal and civilisational effects of depletion.

Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby KevO » Sun 13 May 2007, 06:04:18

so whatya gonna do?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'J')UST in case anyone still believes it's an accident oil companies like ExxonMobil and Chevron and BP and Shell have achieved record profits quarter after quarter during the last few years, here's some information that will utterly debunk such naive thinking:

As of early spring, crude oil prices were several pennies lower per gallon this year than last year. But the pump price of gasoline was considerably higher. In February, the average California price of $2.81 was nearly 24 cents higher than a year earlier and 45 cents above the national average. In early April, the average California price of $3.29 was 62 cents over the national average.

Today's price of over $3.46 has already topped the previous average statewide high of $3.38 per gallon, with no signs of a ceiling in sight.

How can this be happening when oil companies continually tell us, their customers, that fluctuations in the price of crude and refinery problems are the major impetus for changes in their pump prices?

Easy. It's called gouging.

As long as no significant gasoline retailer breaks ranks and the price at the pump remains fairly constant from one street corner to the next within a region, there is no reason for
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oil companies not to raise prices. So they do.

That's how ExxonMobil made a record $9 billion profit during the third quarter of last year (with yearly profits of about half the entire budget of the state of California, to put it into perspective).

But Exxon's profits dropped a tad in the fourth quarter, you might note. So did those of the rest of Big Oil.

The reason for that was clear and fairly well documented: Oil companies last fall did all they could to keep Republicans in the majority in Congress because no matter how high prices went during its reign, the GOP never did a thing to rein them in. No hearings questioning oil company executives about their pricing practices. No anti-gouging bills. Nothing.

And historically, when gasoline prices drop during the fall political season, the party in power stays there. So - surprise - prices dropped from last summer's peak average of $3.38 for a gallon of unleaded regular to about $2.20 just before Election Day last November.

The prediction here then was that prices would rise gradually starting the week after the election. And they did, quickly.


http://www.dailynews.com/theiropinion/ci_5881835

.
Last edited by KevO on Sun 13 May 2007, 06:50:19, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's American citizens

Unread postby Tanada » Sun 13 May 2007, 06:28:55

Someone needs to educate this conspiracy theorist about oil refineries and what the actual supply/demand balance sheet for our current situation looks like. Claiming a physical shortage is gouging just inflames the emotions of the readers without giving them the information they need to understand what, why, where and how.
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To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's American citizens

Unread postby KevO » Sun 13 May 2007, 06:47:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Today's price of over $3.46 has already topped the previous average statewide high of $3.38 per gallon, with no signs of a ceiling in sight.


It's the same in the UK, but the moaning and talk of blockades is again a topic of conversation as our gas hits £1 a litre ($9 a gallon - that's $9 _a gallon_)
The UK goverment nearly fell after only 6 days, when fuel depots were blockaded last time see
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/922906.stm

but if the US citizens did the same, and maintained it for three weeks, the effects would be greater than 911 and bring the BIG oil/peak oil debate into everyones living rooms.
only takes one acorn
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Re: Big Oil screws it's American citizens

Unread postby Newsseeker » Sun 13 May 2007, 09:29:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tanada', 'S')omeone needs to educate this conspiracy theorist about oil refineries and what the actual supply/demand balance sheet for our current situation looks like. Claiming a physical shortage is gouging just inflames the emotions of the readers without giving them the information they need to understand what, why, where and how.


Right you are old chap!
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Re: Big Oil screws it's American citizens

Unread postby purdum » Sun 13 May 2007, 09:55:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KevO', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Today's price of over $3.46 has already topped the previous average statewide high of $3.38 per gallon, with no signs of a ceiling in sight.


It's the same in the UK, but the moaning and talk of blockades is again a topic of conversation as our gas hits £1 a litre ($9 a gallon - that's $9 _a gallon_)


You're talking about Imperial gallons, which are larger than U.S. gallons? In U.S. gallons that Americans can relate to, that's about $7.50. Still pretty significant.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby lordemp » Sun 13 May 2007, 10:19:21

Here is someone trying to help people and make money in a "free capitalistic society" and he is told he can't. If these companies would compete like retailers then it would be better. The cap should be on the profit big oil can make.

MERRILL, Wis. -- State regulators have ordered a Merrill service station to stop offering discounted gas to senior citizens and sports boosters.

The Center City BP has offered a $0.02-per-gallon price break to seniors and $0.03 a gallon to card-carrying youth sports boosters.

But the Department of Agriculture, Trade and Consumer Protection said that those deals violate the state law that requires stations to sell gas for about 9 percent more than the wholesale price.

The state could penalize the owner for each discounted gallon he sold, with the fine determined by a judge.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby shortonoil » Sun 13 May 2007, 11:06:13

lordemp said:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'H')ere is someone trying to help people and make money in a "free capitalistic society" and he is told he can't. If these companies would compete like retailers then it would be better. The cap should be on the profit big oil can make.


These laws were passed when “gas wars” were still prevalent. The larger gas companies would drop prices until they eliminated all the little single owner gas stations, and after that, jack up the prices, being how they had no competition, to outrageous levels.
Sometimes as high as $ .49 a gallon.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's American citizens

Unread postby KevO » Sun 13 May 2007, 11:16:58

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('purdum', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KevO', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Today's price of over $3.46 has already topped the previous average statewide high of $3.38 per gallon, with no signs of a ceiling in sight.


It's the same in the UK, but the moaning and talk of blockades is again a topic of conversation as our gas hits £1 a litre ($9 a gallon - that's $9 _a gallon_)


You're talking about Imperial gallons, which are larger than U.S. gallons? In U.S. gallons that Americans can relate to, that's about $7.50. Still pretty significant.


how many litres are there in a US gallon?
It's 4 and a half litres to a UK one
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby killJOY » Sun 13 May 2007, 11:31:54

As I posted elsewhere:

DEMAGOGUERY

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Mencken', 'D')emagogue: "one who preaches doctrines he knows to be untrue to men he knows to be idiots."
Peak oil = comet Kohoutek.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's American citizens

Unread postby Tanada » Sun 13 May 2007, 11:52:13

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KevO', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('purdum', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KevO', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')Today's price of over $3.46 has already topped the previous average statewide high of $3.38 per gallon, with no signs of a ceiling in sight.


It's the same in the UK, but the moaning and talk of blockades is again a topic of conversation as our gas hits £1 a litre ($9 a gallon - that's $9 _a gallon_)


You're talking about Imperial gallons, which are larger than U.S. gallons? In U.S. gallons that Americans can relate to, that's about $7.50. Still pretty significant.


how many litres are there in a US gallon?
It's 4 and a half litres to a UK one


One US gallon is 3.785 liters, LINK compared to 4.545 liters per Imperial gallon.
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To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby DantesPeak » Sun 13 May 2007, 12:10:05

In a Post Peak world, oil companies and particularly refiners will initially be in a very desirable position due to market conditions. As little as six years ago, the situation was exactly reversed, but no one complained about how little they were making – or that low margins then may result in a lack of refinery expansion five to ten years later.

Even if the US government took over the refining industry and built more refiners, it would still have to compete in the world markets and bid up the price of oil. In other words, post peak oil, we can only have more transportation fuel by taking it away for some other country by outbidding them. This is what Far Eastern countries are trying to do to us right now.
It's already over, now it's just a matter of adjusting.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby DantesPeak » Sun 13 May 2007, 12:35:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', 'T')anada, Gideon why don't you use this opportunity to show us exactly why this is not collusion. Where are those busted refineries?


If this were a collusion, it would have to be worldwide.

US wholesale gasoline prices are set at the margin at the highest cost of imported gasoline to balance supply and demand (at least under the current situation where imports are needed and there is still some supply left to import). Therefore if there was collusion, it would be among the foreign producers, or the foreign producers and the very many US refiners.

Can anyone provide the slighest, slimmest proof such a conspiracy exists?
It's already over, now it's just a matter of adjusting.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's American citizens

Unread postby KevO » Sun 13 May 2007, 15:17:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tanada', '
')One US gallon is 3.785 liters, LINK compared to 4.545 liters per Imperial gallon.


thanks Tanada
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby TommyJefferson » Mon 14 May 2007, 12:59:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KevO', 's')o whatya gonna do?


Exxon's yearly profits on sales are about 10.5% Compare that to the profits of these companies:

Yahoo 36.1%
Microsoft 31.6%
Ebay 23.8%
Coca-Cola 21.1%
Louisiana-Pacific 18.3%
TXU 17.0%
Harley-Davidson 16.9%
St. Jude Medical 13.5%
McDonald's 12.7%

Yet, retards wet their pants over Exxon because of a big profit number taken completely out of context.

Tell the people you see promoting this tripe to grow up.
Conform . Consume . Obey .
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby dinopello » Mon 14 May 2007, 14:03:00

I was going to start a thread on this, but lets just stick it here

Shell Exec: Oil Prices May Continue to Rise

But, he feel real bad about it.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '')If we don’t bring more oil and gas into the system we’re going to have to pay more and more and more,” Shell President John Hofmeister told TODAY host Meredith Vieira. “I’d hate to see prices double and triple what they are today because we failed to explore for more gas and oil.”


There's plenty of cheap oil, but the enviro policy makes us import that really expensive middle eastern stuff

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '')Part of the crunch we’re feeling right now is public policy that allows us to only access oil and gas in 15 percent of the outer continental shelf; 85 percent, we’re banned from exploring for oil and gas. Meanwhile we bring in expensive imports from around the world,” he said.


Have no fear, cause energy independence is on the way

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')echnology, he said, will ultimately free the country of its dependence on oil. But, he warned, it will happen “not overnight, but over decades.”


Is the oil industry all over the map on what they are saying or what? Some people say the industry is making up peak oil as an excuse for high prices, some in the industry say there is no problem. Is it all a part of an obfuscation plan, or are they really as clueless about all this as anybody ?

Well, he gets one good mark in my book anyway

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'H')ofmeister said Shell is opposed to corn ethanol because it “competes with food.”
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby basil_hayden » Mon 14 May 2007, 19:34:13

Maybe the oil companies were "hired" by the US government to soak up all that excess liquidity in America? To increase the rich to poor gap? Dunno, but as long as a gallon of gas does as much work as 150 slaves in a day, people are going to pay the price.
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Re: Big Oil screws it's Americans. Whatya gonna do?

Unread postby KevO » Tue 15 May 2007, 07:01:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('basil_hayden', 'M')aybe the oil companies were "hired" by the US government to soak up all that excess liquidity in America? To increase the rich to poor gap? Dunno, but as long as a gallon of gas does as much work as 150 slaves in a day, people are going to pay the price.


totally agree.
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