PeakOil is You
THE US / Mexico Border Thread (merged)
Re: Tired of the open border? Help the government build a wa
by smallpoxgirl » Fri 14 Apr 2006, 20:29:16
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Daculling', 'H')as the invasion (that's what it is) affected the area yet?
Absolutely. The invasion hit here about 1870. Massive numbers of locals were murdered by the imigrants. Those that remained were forced into concentration camps known colloquially as "reservations". While few people here know Spanish, pretty much all of them have been forced to learn English.
It's time to face reality Daculling, you can't crap all over everyone on the planet and then hide behind fences. If you don't like immigration, fine. Pester your senator to repeal NAFTA and stop buying sweatshop made goods. As long as being a Mexican means getting screwed for the profit of Americans, then people in Mexico are going to move North. No fence is going to stop that.
"We were standing on the edges
Of a thousand burning bridges
Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
The way things were before
I lost my way" - OCMS
Of a thousand burning bridges
Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
The way things were before
I lost my way" - OCMS
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Re: Tired of the open border? Help the government build a wa
by Daculling » Fri 14 Apr 2006, 22:04:07
I love you SPG
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Re: Tired of the open border? Help the government build a wa
by Willy » Sat 15 Apr 2006, 02:14:46
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Willy', 'w')here are your anscestors from that they have committed no crimes against thier fellow man?
Wow. That was a pretty sad straw man.
Never said anyone was without blemish. What I said was that people who today pitch a fit about illegal immigration, do so because they don't want to share the benefits they get because of their ancestor's illegal immigration. Rather like bitching when your accomplice steals your half of the robbery loot. Like Specop said, "We stole it fair and square, so everyone else bug off."
hey you were the one to bring up our ancestors, personally i think historical immigration of our ancestors has nothing to do with current immigration policy. I was trying to point out that it's foolish to make our current policys based on the misdeeds of our forefathers when everyone's forefathers commited similar misdeeds. but as is often the case print is a poor media for me to make my sarcastic comments. the point is noone has real claim to the land they are on. regardless of the circumstances of how current americans got here and gained control of the land it's now ours and as such we should act in our best intrests. to me it seems pretty clear that those best intrests involve only allowing in only a certain number of good, hardworking, skilled, intelligent, LAW ABIDING citizens.
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Re: Tired of the open border? Help the government build a wa
by Willy » Sat 15 Apr 2006, 02:58:49
NEOPO-
so let me see if i get this straight, you are basicly saying america is so F'd up that we should allow in excess problems because they are not as big as our home grown ones?
yes we have our own big problems with murder rape theft and all the rest. why add to it?
yes we have our own big problems with our poor and our social programs are not solvent enough to fix them, and even if they had the money they would most likely not get the desired results, but more burden does not help matters.
the franklin quote- it sounds great but humanity has alway given up liberty for safety, it's what civilization is, i give up my liberty to kill you and steal your stuff and in return i get the safety of you giving up your liberty to kill me and steal my stuff. this of course can swing too far and it seems in many different ways right now it is in this country, but i don't find restricting others ability to enter my country is infringing on my liberties at all.
finally i want to adress your rant about me using anti american. i used anti american as a way to say such an action(armed invasion spliting off a portion of the southwest in to a different country) would not be in the best intrests of the people currently living there. i used it as a term to describe the people living in a geographical area, not their culture. you seem to have a bone to pick with american culture, which somewhat ironicly is rather american of you.
so let me see if i get this straight, you are basicly saying america is so F'd up that we should allow in excess problems because they are not as big as our home grown ones?
yes we have our own big problems with murder rape theft and all the rest. why add to it?
yes we have our own big problems with our poor and our social programs are not solvent enough to fix them, and even if they had the money they would most likely not get the desired results, but more burden does not help matters.
the franklin quote- it sounds great but humanity has alway given up liberty for safety, it's what civilization is, i give up my liberty to kill you and steal your stuff and in return i get the safety of you giving up your liberty to kill me and steal my stuff. this of course can swing too far and it seems in many different ways right now it is in this country, but i don't find restricting others ability to enter my country is infringing on my liberties at all.
finally i want to adress your rant about me using anti american. i used anti american as a way to say such an action(armed invasion spliting off a portion of the southwest in to a different country) would not be in the best intrests of the people currently living there. i used it as a term to describe the people living in a geographical area, not their culture. you seem to have a bone to pick with american culture, which somewhat ironicly is rather american of you.
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Willy - Wood
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Re: Tired of the open border? Help the government build a wa
by syncline » Sat 15 Apr 2006, 05:37:33
Hi Willy, check out this film if you have DivX and bittorrent for download.
http://thepiratebay.org/details.php?id=3463229
http://thepiratebay.org/details.php?id=3463229
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syncline - Wood
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Re: Tired of the open border? Help the government build a wa
by NEOPO » Sat 15 Apr 2006, 12:18:24
Willy,
I posted a reply but it did not take for some reason.
What I am saying is that america seems to want and dare I say need CHEAP LABOR and that is what the majority of these people mean to our system.
It will be more of a burden to capitolism if you take away cheap labor and that is what you are trying to preserve - not the american way of life but capitolism.
I say we are addicted to cheap everything - labor no exception.
____________________________________________________
99% of us are immigrants or decendents of immigrants.
You probably do not like it when a pregnant mexican woman illegally enters and then gives birth and walla that child is a US citizen yet the same thing applies to most of us.
We murdered the people, stole the land and then proceeded to rape it.
Is this AMERICAN???
Is this what it means to be an american?
That is what this house and so many others were founded on.
The bones and blood of indigenous peoples.
The foundation of a house is the most important and I believe this castle was built on sand and as jimmy puts it "will slip into the sea...eventually......"
It is us who wants the cheap labor = slaves.
We even enslave ourselves = minimum wage.
Our corporations and farms want cheap labor and when all of our extra income is gone because we no longer have cheap transient labor then I bet you will also regret that we no longer have cheap labor.
Our system feeds upon this - upon itself.
Exploitation and control.
It feeds on you and me.
We fall, someone capitolizes - we need, someone capitolizes.
The discrepancy between rich and poor has never been greater.
Our system works to provide wealth for the top 10% basically while the middle falls slowly and the poorest fall even faster.
Is this the GRAND SYSTEM that you wish to prop up at all costs?
With a brick wall no less.
I say if the system was so grand that you would not need a wall.
Our prosperity should have spilled over into mexico by now making it more desireable but no ...........U.S. corporations side with mexican authorities to kill more indigenous people, steal their land and build factories.
I say you are looking at the bleeding but not what caused the wound.
Good luck with your wall.
I posted a reply but it did not take for some reason.
What I am saying is that america seems to want and dare I say need CHEAP LABOR and that is what the majority of these people mean to our system.
It will be more of a burden to capitolism if you take away cheap labor and that is what you are trying to preserve - not the american way of life but capitolism.
I say we are addicted to cheap everything - labor no exception.
____________________________________________________
99% of us are immigrants or decendents of immigrants.
You probably do not like it when a pregnant mexican woman illegally enters and then gives birth and walla that child is a US citizen yet the same thing applies to most of us.
We murdered the people, stole the land and then proceeded to rape it.
Is this AMERICAN???
Is this what it means to be an american?
That is what this house and so many others were founded on.
The bones and blood of indigenous peoples.
The foundation of a house is the most important and I believe this castle was built on sand and as jimmy puts it "will slip into the sea...eventually......"
It is us who wants the cheap labor = slaves.
We even enslave ourselves = minimum wage.
Our corporations and farms want cheap labor and when all of our extra income is gone because we no longer have cheap transient labor then I bet you will also regret that we no longer have cheap labor.
Our system feeds upon this - upon itself.
Exploitation and control.
It feeds on you and me.
We fall, someone capitolizes - we need, someone capitolizes.
The discrepancy between rich and poor has never been greater.
Our system works to provide wealth for the top 10% basically while the middle falls slowly and the poorest fall even faster.
Is this the GRAND SYSTEM that you wish to prop up at all costs?
With a brick wall no less.
I say if the system was so grand that you would not need a wall.
Our prosperity should have spilled over into mexico by now making it more desireable but no ...........U.S. corporations side with mexican authorities to kill more indigenous people, steal their land and build factories.
I say you are looking at the bleeding but not what caused the wound.
Good luck with your wall.
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NEOPO - Permanently Banned
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Re: Tired of the open border? Help the government build a wa
by Willy » Sat 15 Apr 2006, 15:58:16
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NEOPO', 'W')illy,
I posted a reply but it did not take for some reason.
What I am saying is that america seems to want and dare I say need CHEAP LABOR and that is what the majority of these people mean to our system.
It will be more of a burden to capitolism if you take away cheap labor and that is what you are trying to preserve - not the american way of life but capitolism.
I say we are addicted to cheap everything - labor no exception.
____________________________________________________
99% of us are immigrants or decendents of immigrants.
You probably do not like it when a pregnant mexican woman illegally enters and then gives birth and walla that child is a US citizen yet the same thing applies to most of us.
We murdered the people, stole the land and then proceeded to rape it.
Is this AMERICAN???
Is this what it means to be an american?
That is what this house and so many others were founded on.
The bones and blood of indigenous peoples.
The foundation of a house is the most important and I believe this castle was built on sand and as jimmy puts it "will slip into the sea...eventually......"
It is us who wants the cheap labor = slaves.
We even enslave ourselves = minimum wage.
Our corporations and farms want cheap labor and when all of our extra income is gone because we no longer have cheap transient labor then I bet you will also regret that we no longer have cheap labor.
Our system feeds upon this - upon itself.
Exploitation and control.
It feeds on you and me.
We fall, someone capitolizes - we need, someone capitolizes.
The discrepancy between rich and poor has never been greater.
Our system works to provide wealth for the top 10% basically while the middle falls slowly and the poorest fall even faster.
Is this the GRAND SYSTEM that you wish to prop up at all costs?
With a brick wall no less.
I say if the system was so grand that you would not need a wall.
Our prosperity should have spilled over into mexico by now making it more desireable but no ...........U.S. corporations side with mexican authorities to kill more indigenous people, steal their land and build factories.
I say you are looking at the bleeding but not what caused the wound.
Good luck with your wall.
I posted a reply but it did not take for some reason.
What I am saying is that america seems to want and dare I say need CHEAP LABOR and that is what the majority of these people mean to our system.
It will be more of a burden to capitolism if you take away cheap labor and that is what you are trying to preserve - not the american way of life but capitolism.
I say we are addicted to cheap everything - labor no exception.
____________________________________________________
99% of us are immigrants or decendents of immigrants.
You probably do not like it when a pregnant mexican woman illegally enters and then gives birth and walla that child is a US citizen yet the same thing applies to most of us.
We murdered the people, stole the land and then proceeded to rape it.
Is this AMERICAN???
Is this what it means to be an american?
That is what this house and so many others were founded on.
The bones and blood of indigenous peoples.
The foundation of a house is the most important and I believe this castle was built on sand and as jimmy puts it "will slip into the sea...eventually......"
It is us who wants the cheap labor = slaves.
We even enslave ourselves = minimum wage.
Our corporations and farms want cheap labor and when all of our extra income is gone because we no longer have cheap transient labor then I bet you will also regret that we no longer have cheap labor.
Our system feeds upon this - upon itself.
Exploitation and control.
It feeds on you and me.
We fall, someone capitolizes - we need, someone capitolizes.
The discrepancy between rich and poor has never been greater.
Our system works to provide wealth for the top 10% basically while the middle falls slowly and the poorest fall even faster.
Is this the GRAND SYSTEM that you wish to prop up at all costs?
With a brick wall no less.
I say if the system was so grand that you would not need a wall.
Our prosperity should have spilled over into mexico by now making it more desireable but no ...........U.S. corporations side with mexican authorities to kill more indigenous people, steal their land and build factories.
I say you are looking at the bleeding but not what caused the wound.
Good luck with your wall.
okay one more reply then i am done because i am quite convinced that your hatred for capitolism and american society has driven you insane.
on one hand you say that we need the cheap labor to survive and on the other you say that the income gap is getting too large. cheap illegal labor is putting a down pressure on the lowest paid jobs! the higher paid americans would spend more in the american economy helping it grow, instead of hemoraging money to the mexican economy. the growing economy would need more jobs filled putting upword pressure on wages, the income gap would shrink.
second, what our ancestors did DOESN'T MATTER, sure it sucks that people were forced from their lands and systamaticly killed etc.. it's a dark page in american history that we should never repeat, but we have to stop judging history by our perceptions, what they did fit the mores of the times, we have since socialy evolved and it is no longer accepted. but how we got the land has nothing to do with the current debate of how to best run it.
third,i have no problem with the child of an illegal getting citizenship, it means that the person will be a citizen and will pay legal taxes, be able to vote and be an american, i do have a problem with the mother being allowed to stay in the country to take care of the child without going through proper channels. the kid can either live under the guardianship of an american citizen and the mother can go through the channels or they both get deported and the kid can come back when it reaches age of majority.
fourth the wall is a goddamn metaphor for better border control, and in regards to your metaphor, accepted first aid IS to stop the bleeding first, then figure out what exactly caused it.
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Willy - Wood
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. Ummm ok, can we might need a substitute the mule with a low milage used Ford Taurus instead?