[VMarcHart]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deMolay', 'A')s much as many here may despise the USA, in the former Communist Russia or China today you would not be having this discussion. You would be on your knees in Communist China having your organs harvested. To compare the USA to any of these brutal states and to ignore the butchery of hundreds of millions of innocent people who died horrible deaths is very dishonest to say the least.

[VMarcHart]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deMolay', 'D')on't be so lazy. Are you really so blind and uneducated and brainwashed like some other useful idiots here?Well, boys, I hate to tell you but when you shine a turd, crap sticks to your hands. And you apologists for brutality have crap on your hands right now.

[xerces]

USSR => 40-50 million dead
China => 30-40 million dead
Eastern Europe + South East Asia + NK + Cuba...etc => 10-20 million


So you're looking at a range of 80 to 110 million dead for the duration of communist rule, discounting casualties from war of course.

[deMolay]

And discounting another maybe 100m deaths in the Gulags, were people accused of political crimes against the state were starved and forced to work in labour camps for 18 hours a day, until most of them died.

[VMarcHart]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('xerces', 'U')SSR => 40-50 million dead
China => 30-40 million dead
Eastern Europe + South East Asia + NK + Cuba...etc => 10-20 million

So you're looking at a range of 80 to 110 million dead for the duration of communist rule, discounting casualties from war of course.

[Gorm]

VMarcHart... what number do you think is the correct one? and does it matter if it is 10 or 100 million murderd?

[VMarcHart]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gorm', 'V')MarcHart... what number do you think is the correct one? and does it matter if it is 10 or 100 million murderd?

[Gorm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('VMarcHart', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gorm', 'V')MarcHart... what number do you think is the correct one? and does it matter if it is 10 or 100 million murderd?

[Quinny]

Have you looked at the strides the Soviet Union made in abolishing poverty and improving health following the overthrow of the Tsars.

I wasn't saying they weren't poor, but there was less absolute poverty than their neighbours in the indian sub-continent.

In Azerbaijan there were, by 1941, 2,500 doctors, whereas before the revolution there had been 291.

What do you mean - geez get real? Is this a Swedish saying?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gorm', 'q')uinny. you are wrong. The diffrence was huge and they were VERY poor in the outer areas of USSR, and for the rest of your text.. geez.. get real.

[Snowrunner]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', 'I') think one of the biggest life changes a person goes through is when they become financially independent. It totally changes a person.

IMHO the overwhelming majority of the Liberals out there fall into the, "Lets tax the rich and give to the poor" variety.
Liberals do not want to pay out of their own pocket for their pet projects ---> they want other people to pay for it.

[Revi]

The USSR and it's satellites were doing ok, until they hit the peak of oil production and then it all fell apart. Now they just hit a secondary peak, with a smaller empire, and they are going to have to readjust their lifestyle again.

So are we.

We visited Scandinavia and it seems to be the ideal compromise between Communism and Capitalism. Everyone has a place in the city and one in the country. They pay a lot of taxes, but they get health care and education. They don't have to worry like we do about losing everything and living in a van down by the river. They have some great capitalist enterprises that sell things people want to buy.

Maybe you can do things like provide health care if you have a smaller population and they think differently.

[Snowrunner]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MOCKBA', 'N')ever happened in America though... just a food for thought, why exactly it happened that way - rather then establishing lasting communes (like in Christiania for example) americans choose to throw tea parties in Boston and events as such...

[Snowrunner]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deMolay', 'S')talin starved to death millions of Ukerainians with his fabricated famine. here is some of the history of his Gulag system...... History of the Soviet Russian Gulag
The history of the Soviet Russian Gulags, forced labor camps that killed millions of people.

[Snowrunner]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deMolay', 'A')s much as many here may despise the USA, in the former Communist Russia or China today you would not be having this discussion. You would be on your knees in Communist China having your organs harvested. To compare the USA to any of these brutal states and to ignore the butchery of hundreds of millions of innocent people who died horrible deaths is very dishonest to say the least.

[deMolay]

I don't think even your addled brain could say that as bad as the USA may have been or is today, that they butchered, and starved and worked to death hundreds of millions of their own citizens liked happened with National Socialisism in Germany, Communist Russia and Communist China.

[Snowrunner]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deMolay', 'I') don't think even your addled brain could say that as bad as the USA may have been or is today, that they butchered, and starved and worked to death hundreds of millions of their own citizens liked happened with National Socialisism in Germany, Communist Russia and Communist China.

[Quinny]

National Socialism had nothing to do with Socialism it is stupid and insulting to Socialists and Trade Unionists who were among the first to be murdered!

It was your republican president Bush's family who supported the Nazi's throughout the war.

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deMolay', 'I') don't think even your addled brain could say that as bad as the USA may have been or is today, that they butchered, and starved and worked to death hundreds of millions of their own citizens liked happened with National Socialisism in Germany, Communist Russia and Communist China.

[VMarcHart]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Snowrunner', '.')..rich people (read, 150K+/year single income)...

[Snowrunner]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('VMarcHart', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Snowrunner', '.')..rich people (read, 150K+/year single income)...