[gnm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', ' ')Your friendly US taxpayer is enlisted to save all the big, fat, bald guys.

[Byron100]

This is why I hate so-called "economists" with a passion, as this is the exactly the sort of thing they advocate to "protect the economy". Ugh! Socialism for the rich, indeed.

From now on, I'm going to openly advocate full socialism for everyone...if those rich old snots can get the goods, so can I. I want 100% free health care, I want subsidized housing, I want an uber-high min wage along with a 30-hour work week, and of course, full retirement at age 55 at 80% of average salary. And I want a brand-new high-speed rail system nationwide, with super-cheap subsidized fares. And while we're at it, I want a decent space program too...first person on Mars by 2015, a permanent base there of at least 1000 people by 2025, along with massive space stations in orbit around the Earth.

Oh, you say this can't be done? Not enough money in the US treasury to pay for all of those goodies? Oh pul-leese!!!

Well, somebody had very well come up with some real, hard evidence is to why this might be, considering all the hundreds of billions, trillions even, our friendly gov't has tossed down the rat hole in the past few years...all so a few rich people can get even richer. Until someone can do that for me, I wanna see some real gov't spending, and I wanna see it happen now.

[Wowzers]

"We need to throw every scumbag in congress out of office for this. "

Ron Paul can stay

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Wowzers', '
')Ron Paul can stay

[Jotapay]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Wowzers', '
')Ron Paul can stay

[gnm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Wowzers', '"')We need to throw every scumbag in congress out of office for this. " Ron Paul can stay

[cube]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'L')ibertarianism doesn't provide any support for the little guy either; it's all "paddle your own canoe."

[Uniquack]

The economic/personal financial effects of supporting a class of lower-income "freeloaders" is miniscule; the effects of supporting a small group of mega-rich freeloaders is disproportionately large and it's what's dragging down the rest of the economy. This is a difference most libertarians don't seem to recognize.

At the end of the day, after the conduits (subsidized corporations such as Freddie/Fannie, Enron, and hundreds of other companies, banks, etc. by which the super-rich expropriate wealth from the majority) go bankrupt, they've got all that wealth transferred into their privately held bank accounts and assets. In a way, focusing attention on these legal conduits misses the point of where the wealth really ends up and needs to be released back to the rest of society. We can analyze the corporate capitalist system and make changes, but let's not forget that actual individuals are responsible for using that system. We need to start naming them and demand action be taken against them individually.

We could start thinking and talking about how to redistribute the wealth they have over-accumulated. This could mean enacting a series of wealth taxes or criminal prosecution of the megarich white-collar corporate defrauders with asset seizures, or some other combinations. Then put this recaptured wealth into a national redistribution fund to pay off the national debt and jumpstart the economy with sustainable works projects.

Without much more equitably distributed wealth, a sustainable peak-aware economy that serves everyone is impossible. Until we solve that, the real economy will grind to a halt and we all suffer. The system and rules we've been playing by are what got us here; we need new rules to get out.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', 'I')sn't that better than what we have now?

[Jotapay]

True Libertarianism is great for anyone who will work and is intelligent. And for those who have competitive advantages over others.

[AlexdeLarge]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', 'I')sn't that better than what we have now?

[Jotapay]

She believes in an idyllic Shangri-La.

[vision-master]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AlexdeLarge', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', 'I')sn't that better than what we have now?

[hillguy57]

Some sort of wealth redistribution is required but all out socialism or communism would never be accepted by the majority
of the U.S.. What is needed is a new hybrid Government with the cruel efficiency of free market combined with a humanitarian outlook of socialism. Something just left of center on the political spectrum.
Perhaps a new political party?

[Heineken]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'L')ibertarianism doesn't provide any support for the little guy either; it's all "paddle your own canoe."

[jbrovont]

Pretty much. I think the idea we get sold in grade school about "The American Dream" is pretty solid: you can have anything you want as long as you work hard for it. The Constitution's "Of the people, by the people and for the people" speaks towards a socialized republic, but that doesn't mean "socialism." It does mean the government should exist to make sure the tools everyone needs to benefit from their own hard work are guaranteed - like that higher education exists, we have electricity, we don't get invaded, etc.

I don't think it means that a few thousand state and federal congress people should have free reign, get all their expenses paid for at our expense (forever), give all the sweet business deals to their buds, and when sh*t goes south, ship us the bill. I can't think of anything that smacks of "unamerican" more than this nice little arrangement they have worked out. Then when the pesky law gets in the way they buy and sell pardons with votes. I haven't come up with a good word to describe this yet, but it sure pisses me off to hear either party talk about "America" or "support the troops" or "Freedom" while they busily work to undermine democracy here at home.

Maybe democracy was our biggest export, but I think our reserrves have hit terminal decline with this batch of criminals calling the shots. Nitrogen injection anyone?
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AlexdeLarge', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', 'I')sn't that better than what we have now?

[killJOY]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'Y')es, paddle your own canoe. Everyone should paddle their own canoe. I can agree with that.

[AlexdeLarge]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jbrovont', 'I') don't think it means that a few thousand state and federal congress people should have free reign, get all their expenses paid for at our expense (forever), give all the sweet business deals to their buds, and when sh*t goes south, ship us the bill. I can't think of anything that smacks of "unamerican" more than this nice little arrangement they have worked out. Then when the pesky law gets in the way they buy and sell pardons with votes. I haven't come up with a good word to describe this yet, but it sure pisses me off to hear either party talk about "America" or "support the troops" or "Freedom" while they busily work to undermine democracy here at home.

[cube]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('killJOY', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'Y')es, paddle your own canoe. Everyone should paddle their own canoe. I can agree with that.

[nobodypanic]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'L')ibertarianism doesn't provide any support for the little guy either; it's all "paddle your own canoe."