THE Private transportation after PO Thread (merged)

by **deadmaker7** » Fri 06 May 2005, 20:43:16

We've all got a private transportation system built-in, and I think we're all gonna be using it alot in the not-too-distant future.

by **Tanada** » Fri 06 May 2005, 23:08:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('deadmaker7', 'W')e've all got a private transportation system built-in, and I think we're all gonna be using it alot in the not-too-distant future.

by **Tanada** » Sat 07 May 2005, 12:22:53

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hawkcreek', 'I')'ve already got the chassis, working on getting the running gear to build an electric car. Expect it to have a 20 mile range and plan to have a small onboard engine (SVO)and one 100 watt PV panel to charge the batteries if I exceed that. Already have a home solar PV system to keep the batts charged most of the time. Will do fine for going to the grocery store.
This kind of stuff is old hat technology. No reason why anyone couldn't build one. You can buy one with much better range than I want.
The doomers can walk. I intend to work at doing something about it, not whining about all the stuff I can't do.

by **Ayoob_Reloaded** » Sat 07 May 2005, 16:18:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hawkcreek', 'I')'ve already got the chassis, working on getting the running gear to build an electric car. Expect it to have a 20 mile range and plan to have a small onboard engine (SVO)and one 100 watt PV panel to charge the batteries if I exceed that. Already have a home solar PV system to keep the batts charged most of the time. Will do fine for going to the grocery store.
This kind of stuff is old hat technology. No reason why anyone couldn't build one. You can buy one with much better range than I want.
The doomers can walk. I intend to work at doing something about it, not whining about all the stuff I can't do.

by **ArimoDave** » Sat 07 May 2005, 16:55:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Leanan', 'I') don't think the resource requirements for bikes are as small as you think. They aren't made from renewable resources. Could you make a bike frame? A bicycle tire? A bike chain?

by **Leanan** » Sat 07 May 2005, 17:31:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hy and when did we start loosing basic manufacturing skills?

by **blackaddr** » Sat 07 May 2005, 18:15:41

i've been reading up on velomobiles, very interesting stuff. Fastest man on earth goes 130km/h in one of these things, all under his own power.

they dont look half bad either :-

http://www.go-one.biz/ukindex.shtml

http://funnyfarmart.com/transportion.htm

I say do the easy stuff first. Later on you can always add the hi tech 50% efficent solar pannels and whatever to give you an extra 600watt boost to your own 150watt peddle power.

heres one vid, sorry cant find the page to the rest of the videos, sorry.

http://www.marsvin.de/velomobile/80mph-01.wmv

by **blackaddr** » Sat 07 May 2005, 18:24:26

Leanan: alot can be transported by bike -> http://www.moz.net.nz/act/loadbikes/

but i do admit that going up hill would be hard :S

by **ArimoDave** » Sat 07 May 2005, 20:05:28

How about this for additional power. A small Briggs & Stratton Engine mounted to one of you velomobiels. SAE has a yearly Supermilage competition for engineering colleges. Last year's winner got 1747 mpg (after a 120 mpg penalty for taking 12 seconds too long for 9.6 miles -- 14.9 mph rather than 15 mph).

They're not allowed to add pedals.

Let me know if you can't access the page. The result require a spreadsheet that can use MicroSoft's :evil:

Excell.

Cool photos too.

ArimoDave

by **Ludi** » Sat 07 May 2005, 20:27:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hawkcreek', ' ')Give me or ArimoDave (or a million others) a junkyard, and we could produce plenty of bicycles without burning any oil.

by **blackaddr** » Sat 07 May 2005, 21:10:57

ArimoDave: I dont really like the idea of any type of engine. It would just make the price of one of these things sky rocket and just cause aload of problems. (you would have to pay mot+taxes+insurance+fuel+driving licence)

Even just pedaling at a low output of 150watts - 1/4 hp (olympic athleates produce 2000watts) you can get a good constant speed of 50km/h. I dont see any imedete need for say an average comuter to go faster than that...... who lives more than 50km from thier work place anyway???

from this -> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4513929.stm

i take it that people do like bikes. I just recon the getting wet part stops people from using them more than just weekend toys of fun. Velomobiles solve this, plus they are faster than a normal bike.

and oh yeah Ludi what kind of doom and gloom person are you??

"As long as the junkyard lasts, we're all set, but once the junk metal rusts away, that's it for metal technology, because we have mined all the easily accessible ores and no more will be available without the energy to get at them. So, in a few hundred years, it's back to the Stone Age for us."

few hundred years gees, by the time we can no longer build bikes due to lack of metal i would hope we would have found some kind of alternative energy source, or have cranked up renewables to cope.

by **gary_malcolm** » Sat 07 May 2005, 21:14:50

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hawkcreek', 'O')r are we going to have peak charcoal?

by **Ludi** » Sat 07 May 2005, 21:15:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('blackaddr', '
')and oh yeah Ludi what kind of doom and gloom person are you??

few hundred years gees, by the time we can no longer build bikes due to lack of metal i would hope we would have found some kind of alternative energy source, or have cranked up renewables to cope.

by **Leanan** » Sat 07 May 2005, 22:02:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')Metal was worked long before we had cheap hydrocarbons.

by **blackaddr** » Sat 07 May 2005, 22:11:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hat kind of goofy pie-in-the-sky optimist are you? Guess you haven't studied much about this whole Peak Oil issue, have you?

by **ArimoDave** » Sat 07 May 2005, 22:52:50

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hawkcreek', ' ')Give me or ArimoDave (or a million others) a junkyard, and we could produce plenty of bicycles without burning any oil.

by **savethehumans** » Sun 08 May 2005, 00:09:36

If you are rich, or driving an ambulance, fire engine, or police car, you will have "private" transportation.

The rest of us may have trains or buses (if we're really, really lucky), bicycles, and those things called "legs" and "feet."

Or maybe even a HORSE!! :razz:

Otherwise, forget about it. . . .

by **MonteQuest** » Sun 08 May 2005, 00:19:04

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hawkcreek', ' ') What do you think powered the first forges? Or are we going to have peak charcoal?

The knowlege required to do all of those things will not disappear. The thing in shortest supply seems to be the correct attitude. Would you work hard for a month to produce a bike to trade to a farmer for a months worth of food. I would. If the farmers don't want one, I will build them in my spare time after weeding the garden.
Peak Oil will produce changes in scale, I agree. But maybe it will release some of the cubical slaves to do some more rewarding work.

by **Leanan** » Sun 08 May 2005, 08:34:12

I was watching the Travel Channel yesterday, and one show featured Loretta Lynn's "Haunted Plantation." She's a country singer who supposedly lives on an old plantation that has lots of Civil War ghosts.

But most interesting to me was the old mill. Apparently, the original owner built the house by a stream, and used the power of running water to create electricity. He had the first house with electric lights in the county.

Of course, it was down south, so he probably didn't have to worry about the stream freezing. Unlike solar and wind, you'd have constant power that way. Day and night, rain or shine. Unless there was drought so bad the stream dried up. Not exactly unheard of these days.

That might be a good solution in the short term, but long-term? I kind of doubt it. Electric lights came when we were well on our way toward industrialization. Making wire, insulation, filaments, and bulbs won't be easy or cheap in the post-peak world.

I don't doubt we'll be able to melt metal. But how useful will it be? You won't melt rust and turn it into a chrome-moly bike frame. Steel is not like most metals. Changes in temperature or speed of temperature change can make a big difference. This article explains it a bit:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steel

It notes, among other things:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')ron did not, however, replace bronze as the chief metal used for weapons and tools for several centuries. Working iron required more fuel and significantly more labor than working bronze, and the quality of iron produced by early smiths may have been inferior to bronze as a material for tools.

by **Sunspot** » Sun 08 May 2005, 09:15:45

If you're betting on the bike, which is a good bet, then you'd better get one now. And an extra one. Extra tires, inner tubes, brake pads, cables. The point of Post-PO is that it's going to be hard to get anything. Especially things that will be in great demand, like bikes and bike parts. And you'll need shoes - we don't manufacture shoes in the US anymore. Buy extra shoes now, I score 'em at Payless for ten bucks a pair! What a world, gonna miss it...
Of course this principal applies across the board. Betting on Solar? Get solar panels now! Buy that windmill now! Laying in some extra food may help, that bike still requires energy to make it go...
Donald Trump on the day of the crash: "Joe, I wanna buy rice right now!!"
"Well, Mr. Trump, rice futures are a little high..."
"No, you fool, I want rice! Actual, physical bags of rice! Fill that warehouse down on 47th. Wheat, barley, get out there and get it now!!"
"Oh yeah, and buy every bicycle you can get your hands on"

"Nuthin' left to do but Smile, Smile, Smile..."

THE Private transportation after PO Thread (merged)

How to eliminate the private automobile

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