[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GASMON', 'Q')uestion. As far as Gaia is concerned, which is of more value, a down trodden peasant Haitian, living off the land, an industrious but enslaved average Chinese worker, or a 20 stone Big Mac & gas consuming Yank (or Limey) ?.

[gollum]

Like it or not, when we speculate about die-off we are not talking about Berlin, London or Washington we are talking about places like Haiti.

[Pretorian]

and now we have it on live TV-- who would have thought huh. We even funding them so the show will run longer.

[lotrfan55345]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'H')aiti just seems like one of those hopeless cases. There are too many people, too little land, too few domestic resources, and virtually no skills base. Rebuild? Rebuild what? There wasn't anything there in the first place, just a massive shanty town calling itself a city. Haiti is a classic example of a demographic trap. There is literally nothing that can be done. It is already too late.

[yeahbut]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('bluekachina', 'T')he US has 5% of the world's population but consumes 25% of the world's resources.

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lotrfan55345', '
')Well, the land definitely has had the potential to host a prosperous country--look at the neighboring Dominican Republic. It's a There was a tropical rainforest, they have had lots of resources. Port-au-Prince is a bit more than just a shanty town, it has some of the finest examples of French colonial architecture, and hosts some of the wealthiest suburbs (with the best views) in Latin America.

[Ainan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lotrfan55345', 'R')ename as Airstrip One!

[AlexdeLarge]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('bluekachina', 'T')he US has 5% of the world's population but consumes 25% of the world's resources. How do you think that works?

Do you think the rest of the world just gives you all the extra out of generosity?

Or are you just a bunch of thieving pirates pillaging the rest of the world.

Since you are seizing the lion's share, don't you think you owe something back?

It looks to me like you are waging a corporate war against the rest of the world to seize it's resources.

Maybe the rest of the world should fight back.

Maybe when you start complaining about it being your money, maybe you ought to realize just where you got it.

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', 'Y')ou probably missed the latest peakoil news.
"MALPASSE, Haiti -- In October, three Haitian men were shot dead and a fourth was wounded just across the Dominican Republic border from this dusty and impoverished town.
The men were gunned down, investigators say, by vigilantes or a rival criminal group for cutting down trees for charcoal. The remains of the three dead men were found burned inside the very furnaces they were using to produce Haiti's most sought-after fuel.

[TheDude]

Haven't you guys read the book version of An Inconvenient Truth Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha yeah right



Was watching some of the video footage of Port-au-Prince on the BBC, it's worse than NOLA post-hurricane, more like German cities post-firebombing in WWII. Doubt LA or cities in the PNW will do much better when their our Big Ones arrive, either. Just awful.

[Sixstrings]

Getting worse..

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')b]Angry survivors set up roadblocks with corpses to demand quicker relief efforts after the massive quake killed tens of thousands and left countless others homeless and desperate for aid.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE60B5IZ20100114

[Pretorian]

Now lets wait till villagers from all over Haiti that got nothing to do with Port-au-Prince will move in to get some "help" along with some looting opportunities. There is what, a billion in "aid" is coming in? They better get some heavy machine guns aboard.

[frankthetank]

Anyone want to take a shot at how the rebuilding process goes down?

I really have no idea. I would imagine tent cities?

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', 'Y')ou probably missed the latest peakoil news.
"MALPASSE, Haiti -- In October, three Haitian men were shot dead and a fourth was wounded just across the Dominican Republic border from this dusty and impoverished town.
The men were gunned down, investigators say, by vigilantes or a rival criminal group for cutting down trees for charcoal. The remains of the three dead men were found burned inside the very furnaces they were using to produce Haiti's most sought-after fuel.

[Pretorian]

a post from another board

""France, Canada and the USA have failed Haiti too many times before.

This is our watershed moment; Haiti must be rebuilt, and we must foot the bill. The gains of the last 15 years will have been completely erased now, but if we repeat the same half-hearted approach we won't even reclaim those gains.

Learn about Haiti, question why it is the poorest nation in our hemisphere by FAR....""

wow. just wow.

[frankthetank]

Looting/crime/etc is right around the corner... those marines better get in there asap...

[IslandCrow]

The doomer in us will look to this as see it as a possible picture of die-off. Maybe without outside aid it would be, but at present aweful as it is it looks like the death toll will be just a blimp in the population growth of Haiti.

The Red Cross is estimating 45 000 - 50 000 deaths, in an area where 3 million were affected (that is around 1.6%). Overall the population growth rate in Haiti is 2.1% or nearly 200 000 new inhabitants a year.

Unless there is huge increase in deaths (due to aid bottlenecks etc) this disaster will amount to about 3 months population growth.

I can do the figures but I cannot really image what a true die-off in a place like Haiti would be like

[AlexdeLarge]

Can we send them Obama?

He can tax them into prosperity......

(of course union members will be exempt.)

[mcgowanjm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('frankthetank', 'L')ooting/crime/etc is right around the corner... those marines better get in there asap...

[Sixstrings]

Here's a couple well-written pieces on Haiti's colorful history:

part 1:
http://exiledonline.com/homage-to-haiti-a-war-nerd-classic/

part 2:
http://exile.ru/articles/detail.php?ARTICLE_ID=7249&IBLOCK_ID=35

Basically, Haiti has been a shockingly primitive and violent place for centuries. Savage violence and chaos are deeply entrenched in this society, and no short-term relief effort can change all that.

Here's a snippet from part one of the article:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')b]In a way, the only sad thing about Haiti is the way we keep trying to make it into Ohio. Because it never will be, and only looks ridiculous trying, giving the local killers fancy democratic names. If we just let Haiti be Haiti — a crazy, gory voodoo kingdom — people might learn to respect the place. I have, after reading up on it. Haiti’s history isn’t just a lot of killing, either.

A lot of Haitian leaders were brilliant guys who weren’t afraid of anybody — not Napoleon, not Jesus, not nobody. These guys were self-made black Roman Emperors. They came up the hard way, out of slavery in the cane fields, and beat the European armies that tried to take the place back. All comers–French, British, Spanish — the Haitians took them all on and put the fear into them.

Desallines, one of the scariest men who ever ruled Haiti with a bloody machete, said it pretty clearly when it came to racial policy: “For the Haitian declaration of independence, we should use a white man’s skin for parchment, his skull for an inkwell, his blood for ink, and a bayonet for a pen!”

Of course there’s lots of big racial talk in the world, and not much of it means anything. That’s what I respect about Haiti: they mean every goddamn word. Take Desallines; his men killed every paleface they could catch. They were following a good Haitian tradition, dating back to the big slave rebellions, when the black rebels used a white baby stuck on a pike as their flag.