[Iaato]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')How then, do we move backwards? How does a society, with most of the people having no clue of future events, move from being dependent on a vast and intertwined network of goods and services produced by the indigenous people of whereever, to a local resource and renewable energy based society, and do so in the timeframe available (20-30 years using the most liberal extimates, 10-20 with resonable estimates, 5-10 with worst case scenarios), all the while prices on everything increasing, world politics getting more militaristic, governments continuously reducing civil liberties, shortages of goods on the market and weather patterns resembling bad Hollywood movies?"

[Iaato]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')I don't think demand destruction is going to keep "oil at bay". Demand destruction is the MANIFESTATION of peak oil. That's why I think Campbell's Oil Depletion Protocol is a nice concept but redundant. Every time the price ratchets up, people make individual and household economic decisions that reduce consumption. Declining production will then follow suit. If demand destruction drops below production capacity, then there will be a glut and prices will fall back to damn-near free again. Then demand will go back up. But it will take less time than before to get to the hurtful price, because capacity is diminished. And destruction ensues again. So it won't keep the price held down; it will plummet back down to some ridiculously low price, then as demand comes back it will soar back and we'll talk about restricting speculation and windfall profits again. Wash, rinse, repeat."

[roccman]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Iaato', 'T')he credit machine has failed in response to peak oil, not as causation for economic crisis. Peak oil begets economic contraction begets credit collapse begets demand destruction of wasteful stuff we don't need like Hummers and McMansions and suburbia. Don't make the economists' mistake and think that monetary phenomena drive the real events. Money does not literally make the world go round.

[Iaato]

Keith_McClary wrote:
Relax, it won't be much worse than the GREAT DEPRESSION and nobody died from that, people ate rabbit and gopher stew with turnips and potatoes and carrots and sat around the campfire singing happy songs (I can't think of any examples right now. Maybe if I go to the fridge I will find some inspiration)

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Micki', 'U')S population 1929 - 122Million.
You probably need to add mudcakes to the food list.

[dunewalker]

...

[kpeavey]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Shannymara', 'k')peavey wrote:
I've been sooooo doomerish lately, could sure use a pickem up.

Hang in there.

[RedStateGreen]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'H')elping someone with a skill is not the same as giving them free access to your pantry

[mercurygirl]

Ludi said:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hese changes can't be made at the macro, or state, level, only at the micro, or local, level. We can expect no help or support from the state. The state exists to support the status quo. If we're extremely lucky, we will be allowed to make micro changes without interference. But we should not expect any kind of support from the state.

[dohboi]

Twilight wrote: "$100 oil is less affordable than $140 oil once the latter eliminates your job."

Note to mods: You might want to consider using this one soon, as its relevance will be lost when the price soars back up to $140 in the next few weeks/months...

[wisconsin_cur]

At the very least worthy of an honorable mention:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')nd for every China or Iraq graph you post, I can post a US, Mexico, North Sea, Indonesia, Venezuela or any of the other 60 or so countries that are long past their peak of oil extraction. You're grasping at straws in a feeble attempt to continue your cushy, fossil fueled, lazy-ass lifestyle. You're gonna hurt so bad when you find out the free ride is over and you're literally going to have to work for your food.

[dohboi]

Lore wrote:

"That's why it's called Global Warming! Not in my state warming, or in my town warming, or on my deck this afternoon warming.

I see you're resorting to "it's a religion" to discount your statistical inadequacy. When all else fails, project."

on this thread

[Roccland]

link
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('shortonoil', 'N')YMEX Crude Oil (Light) ........................121.20 5.64
NYMEX NYH RBOB Gasoline (Globex) ...... 3.0421 .1318
Don’t worry, just a little bump - $70 is just around the corner. Short traders just keep making those margin calls, mortgage the house if you have to. Fortunes await you! PO is for pansies and doomers. At $70 short some more ..... it is going back to $22 .... the world is awash with oil ........ reality has nothing to do with it, its all in those charts!!!!!!!!!! SELL SELL SELL

[joewp]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', 'W')hen, oh when, will we get a clue? The unifying issue is the vast and still-expanding size of the human population and its bottomless demands.

[roccman]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('sittinguy', 'M')aybe my prize is pride though. I can hold my head high and tell my story and be proud. All you defaulters don't be mad when your on the side of the road one day picking up garbage trying to pay off your depts, and I nail you in head with a chicken nugget.

[Plantagenet]

The Dude posted:

Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 2:36 am Post subject: Re: Obama calls for using strategic petroleum reserve now

"This summer has been a test run for peak oil, the resource depletion equivalent of Germany annexing the Sudetenland. Our politicians have proven themselves to be neo-Chamberlins one and all, and we now await the resource depletion equivalent of a staged Polish attack on a radio station. Will you remain in the country?"
_________________

[Daniel_Plainview]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Shannymara', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kpeavey', 'T')he future will not see masses of people moving to farms to raise food and sing Kumbaya. The future has lots of running, screaming, starving and dieing. The problem before us has no practical solution. Mother Nature rules the nest and she has no remorse, no pity, no sympathy, no feelings. We have long since overstepped the boundaries of what the Earth can provide and kept on populating. When the crash comes, it will be hard, it will be fast, it will be inescapable. You, me, them, everyone, everywhere will take it up the arse. There will be no money, no food, no fuel, no law, no peace, no heat, no rest, only death, with a whole lot of violence and injustice just before that.
I'm going to stop there, time to cool off. I'll go store wheat in mylar bags.

[dohboi]

Something about this struck me as quite funny. Mr Bean wrote:

"Even Amish exponential growth cannot continue indefinitely."

link

[TheDude]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('shortonoil', 'A')merican banks have been incurring tremendous losses for a very long time. Remember Enron? Its called cooked books, the magic of creative accounting and mark to miracle. It called crooked and incompetent regulators; greed and its called everyone has had their hand in this big fat juicy and un-scrutinized pie. Do you think the world’s financial system lost $15 trillion in just 14 months. This has been building for two decades. It is what happens when you hire the fox to watch the chicken coup!

[Iaato]

I dunno. It's hard to surpass flying chicken nuggets, but I'll try.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')So clearly we have to hit up on the Europeans to ship over some gas, except how are we gonna PAY for this gas? You really think any European would take a Note from Ben & Henry for a promise to pay back tomorrow for the gas they loan us today? So maybe George can call up his buddy Vladimir and ask him nicely to send the Europeans more gas from the Crimea so they will loan us some gas? Sorry about that Georgia thing, that was just a misunderstanding. LOL.

Whereas after Katrina/Rita our good buddies the Europeans were right there with a floating gas tank for us, they aren't so well off these days and have their own economic toilet to deal with.

Maybe the Chinese will loan us some Gas so we can keep driving to Walmart to keep buying their stuff. I don't know. You tell me how its going to work, I'll stop preaching Doom."

[roccman]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('RdSnt', 'S')ensible preparation is to have enough (which is always going to be some type of guess) to get you past the panic phase.
In a multi-year depression, people simply adjust. At least those that are left standing and have done prudent prep.