[steam_cannon]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Forney2008', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('CrudeAwakening', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'P')enn and Teller are dickheads.

[steam_cannon]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos', '
')Peak oil is sort of like a mental Everlasting Gobstopper, except it
tastes like ass and you can't get it out of your mouth.

--BigTex

[essex]

Hilarious, that popped a few balloons.

[alpha480v]

I never cared for these guys.

[kokoda]

Penn and Teller are idiots.

What they forget is that the environmental movement has made a change to the way government and big business treat the environment.

Had there not been an environmental movement in the 60s and 70s then god knows what the situation would be like now.

I grew up in a place that used to be covered by forests. The timber industry clear felled everything in sight and now those forests are gone. They tried to use that barren land for agriculture but there wasn't enough water and the soil was too poor to make those farms viable.

When trees went so did the saw mills ... so all that was left was virtually wasteland. The land still hasn't recovered and is now so eroded that it probably never will.

This all happened in the late fifties and early sixties before there was any strong environmentalist movement.

Another example is a place like Haiti.

Haiti used to be covered in trees. Lack of concern for environmental issues resulted in Haiti chopping down nearly all of its forest. Haitians now have to resort to eating mud to stay alive.

Perhaps Penn and teller could do an amusing little piece on that.

Penn and Teller are a couple of mildly entertaining magicians/comedians. They should stick with their chosen trade and avoid making biased, poorly researched crap like this.

[Kingcoal]

Well so far the commentary has been that "Penn & Teller are idiots." I think we have a consensus? Since we have a consensus, the issue is "settled science," right? Every one knows that Penn & Teller are idiots, that's settled science. Well, I think they are great! Science is debate, not polemic arguments and ad hominem attacks.

Actually, all kidding aside, the former Green Peace guy did touch on a big issue. The post industrial countries have pretty much cleaned up their act IMO. The problem of environmental destruction is largely a third world problem. Logging industries replant new forests, it's a sustainable industry, just like the Christmas tree industry. Every year, I drive about 10 miles up the road to a tree farm and get a fresh cut Christmas tree. The farm is huge and works like most any other form of advanced agriculture; crops are harvested and new ones planted for future harvests. The farm does not encroach on neighboring forestland. There is still the problem of environmental runoff, though. We aren't perfect, but we are a hell of a lot better at it than we used to be.

The environmental destruction in China, India and other developing nations is huge. In Brazil, old forests are forever lost to slash and burn techniques. The problem is that people are poor, poorly educated and engaging in wanton destruction of the environment literally BECAUSE of their lack of scientific approach provided by corporate organization. You need environmental law in concert with technology to properly harvest wealth from the environment and we in the post industrial nations have that. Unfortunately for planet earth, developing nations lack that and that is literally criminal.

We in the post industrial nations are a big part of the problem. We have built huge economies fueled by cheap products from developing nations. If we we really cared about the planet, we would boycott those products and tell those countries that we will pay more for them but only if they use modern environmentally sound methods and technologies. That takes money, a lot of it, and would make the computer I use to connect to the internet far more expensive than I paid for it. We in the post industrial world are much like the plantation owners in the old south. We benefit from slavery and environmental destruction. We are different in that we are well insulated from this "worker class" who slaves away, destroying their own environment so we can export our inflation for free and reap all the benefits. We in the post industrial nations are the ruling class of an economic tyranny. Unlike past tyrannies, we don't have to live near the workers who support our lifestyle. Because of cheap oil, we can keep them well at bay, hidden away in the sweat shops of other countries.

There is a huge environmental problem as well as a lack of humanity. Protest that by recycling everything. Buy a used car instead of new, drive as little as possible, cook your food from scratch instead of throwing instant meals into the microwave. In short, buy everything used and recycle in other ways as much as possible and above all, conserve. Stop corporations from building non environmentally sound installations in countries that don't enforce any kind of environmental protection. Stop the throw away economy, it's killing planet earth and killing the people who have to live and work in the industrial waste.

[steam_cannon]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', 'W')ell so far the commentary has been that "Penn & Teller are idiots."
I think we have a consensus? Since we have a consensus, the issue is
"settled science," right? Every one knows that Penn & Teller are idiots,
that's settled science. Well, I think they are great! Science is debate,
not polemic arguments and ad hominem attacks.

[mos6507]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', '
')There is a huge environmental problem as well as a lack of humanity.

[AlexdeLarge]

Apocalypse now,,,,,damn it..... Penn & Teller get left behind! Penn and Teller at the End of the World

News at 11...Armageddon - Women and minorities hardest hit!

[outcast]

And they were right to at least attempt to debunk the doomsday end of the world garbage we keep hearing about.