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Michael Ekin Smyth: "Peak oil is nothing but ... "

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Michael Ekin Smyth: "Peak oil is nothing but ... "

Postby ohanian » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 07:45:40

link Michael Ekin Smyth says "Peak oil is nothing but horse dung to fool the masses"
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'P')eak oil theorists are one sub-branch of this proud line, which reaches from Malthus through the Club of Rome. All energetically pluck at slightly different strings but the tune remains the same. We must limit the freedoms of the present generation for the sake of the unborn. Otherwise, how will our grandchildren survive this or that threat?

And, who is going to dictate those limitations to our freedom? Well, those who define the problem naturally. It is an old wheeze but a good one. Dictators and authoritarians use it all the time. It is a key to power and influence and, let's face it; it's a whole lot of fun. We really do enjoy a snake-oil salesman, particularly when he posits salvation or damnation.

Where this comes from is difficult to pin down. They have the same attraction as old time preachers and, despite the odd charlatan; they are, almost always, sincere in their beliefs. Sincerity is a winning characteristic. No cynics or sceptics these, they tend to be true believers. They really do think that this or that catastrophe is about to happen, or is already underway.

But, let’s not let them off too lightly. Malthusian ideas lead to protectionism and xenophobia. Resource shortage theories lead to rule by bureaucratic fiat and repression of fundamental rights. These are not harmless cranks. Whilst amusing they are socially reactionary and can also be politically dangerous.
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Re: Peak oil is nothing BUT horse dung

Postby eric_b » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 07:54:59

...plonk
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Postby Aaron » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 07:58:26

Hmmmmm...


Michael Ekin Smyth

Image

Michael Ekin Smyth began writing for the voice as a journalist with the Australian Broadcasting Corporation in the late 70s. Beginning his career as a newspaper journalist, he became a radio and television reporter.

Following four years as a speech writer for Prime Minister Michael Somare in Papua New Guinea he was a speech writer for the Chief Minister of Australia's Northern Territory.



Moving to Europe, he became an editor in the United Nations Information Service in Vienna and also worked on local English language radio.



In the early 90s he began a four year stint writing news and speeches for OPEC. In 1996 he joined Shell International as a speech writer. In 1998 he established WordSmyth Ltd.
Last edited by Aaron on Thu 03 Mar 2005, 09:05:51, edited 1 time in total.
The problem is, of course, that not only is economics bankrupt, but it has always been nothing more than politics in disguise... economics is a form of brain damage.

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Postby Taskforce_Unity » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 08:57:35

well how about mathematics, second law of thermodynamics, geology and basicly common sense.....
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Postby Wildwell » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 09:06:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Taskforce_Unity', 'w')ell how about mathematics, second law of thermodynamics, geology and basicly common sense.....


And present him with 'The Oil industry book of excuses' as the price keeps rising.

I don't think there's any motivation on this site other than to inform or discuss. All political views have been discussed, if anything I'd say there is a lack of political direction. It’s simply about ‘What next?’. This is why I don’t believe in conspiracy theories much, because jokers like this start them
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Postby Cynus » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 09:54:17

What liberties is he talking about anyway? I don't see anyone talking about taking away liberties, only urging that something be done to forestall the disaster that will indeed result in the loss of liberties. Saying, let's use the billions of dollars that are being spent to construct and maintain soon-to-be-useless highways and airports to build solar or wind generators is not taking away liberties.
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Postby killJOY » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 10:12:12

He even looks like a dink. I hope he has a fleet of SUVs and lives in the 'burbs.



:-D
Peak oil = comet Kohoutek.
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Postby Jack » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 10:13:04

Anyone with a shirt collar that fits as poorly as this Smith fellow's should be careful about mentioning horse dung. Others may connect it to his fashion sense. Which is about the same quality as his logical reasoning.

Please notice that I did not use the minor honorific of "Mr." in connection with his last name. 8)
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Postby some_guy282 » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 10:24:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cynus', 'W')hat liberties is he talking about anyway? I don't see anyone talking about taking away liberties, only urging that something be done to forestall the disaster that will indeed result in the loss of liberties. Saying, let's use the billions of dollars that are being spent to construct and maintain soon-to-be-useless highways and airports to build solar or wind generators is not taking away liberties.


I think he means the liberty to get in your huge gas guzzling Hummer, and drive alone to the grocery store which is two blocks away, and back again. That liberty.
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Postby Wildwell » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 10:43:28

In big cities and new garden towns, you could put in some sort of smallish underground goods delivery system. It could work on automatic routing codes, bit like a telephone exchange - similar to stuff now in warehouses and factories. The tunnels would not be much bigger than a large sewage pipe and could carry Tv, internet and other cables too. It would have to be durable and energy efficient, but it could be done. These ‘Automatic goods traverser systems’ would be connected to some houses, factories and localised centres. The whole lot connected to larger, semi-auto electric rail served distribution centres, working in pallets and containers. Orders would be made by Internet, Call centre etc and slots would be bought and quotas allocated to manage capacity and energy. This does anyway with the need for postal services, milk delivery, couriers and moving light goods, most shopping requirements and traffic. Therefore assuming the passenger side is taken care of with light rail and trolley buses for the 90% of the population in urban areas and the other 10% have hydrogen cars I think this Horseshit problem in cities is just that. Horseshit.
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Postby tokyo_to_motueka » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 11:07:09

I started to read the comments attached to the article, but there are so many and some of them are very long (the author's attempted rebuttles of critical comments seem to be the longest and most tedious) that i gave up.

But really, he says in the article (which was written in rebuttle of a PO piece) that PO theorists are wacko conspiracy theorists who want to take away our freedoms. Then when a whole lot of people write in the comments (let me paraphrase): "Doh! the oil's gonna run out dude, even the oil companies have admitted it", he comes back and says: "yeah, resources deplete, but so what? technology will make this irrelevant".

so which is it mr smyth? wackos or not? oil depletion, or not?

he's a washed-up, spin-doctor who sadly over estimates his own rhetorical skills. pitiful, really :oops:
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Postby Lehyina » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 11:30:01

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '.')... they [peak oil theorists] are socially reactionary and can also be politically dangerous.


On the world stage who is more politically dangerous, peak oil theorists or George Bush?

As for the desription 'social reactionary' does Smyth actually know what he is talking about? Let's just check a dictionary definition of reactionary and consider if it applies to peak oil theorists.
reactionary —adj. tending to oppose (esp. political) change or reform. —n. (pl. -ies) reactionary person.

May be I'm just dumb but my impression is that peak oil theorists are the opposite of socially reactionary. Far from opposing change they are crying out for it.
The media loves spin doctors because they sound good. Doesn't matter if what they say is crap (or should that be DUNG). One way to identify them is that the 'more they talk the less they actually say'.
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Postby aahala » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 12:02:46

Let's take what we can from Mr. Smyth's comments -- horse dung
could be a future energy source. :-D
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Postby JoeW » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 12:18:57

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lehyina', '
')reactionary —adj. tending to oppose (esp. political) change or reform. —n. (pl. -ies) reactionary person.


I believe the word "reactionary" implies even more than this definition. It means tending to oppose progress, and instead believing that regression to a previous state would be in the best interests of society.

So to label peak-oilers as reactionary implies that our agenda is to somehow get society to revert to the way it was some number of years ago, prior to the rampant use of hydrocarbons. This is incorrect, of course, because our argument is that we want to find a way to *avoid* exactly this type of regression. The peak-oil dilemma is this: what can we do as a species to continue progress in the face of a resource problem that could lead to regression?
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Postby ararboin » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 15:05:51

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')nyone with a shirt collar that fits as poorly as this Smith fellow's should be careful about mentioning horse dung. Others may connect it to his fashion sense. Which is about the same quality as his logical reasoning.


I don't even own a suit, thus I don't have to worry about poorly fitted collars. So I sure wouldn't want to be writing anti-peak oil diatribes and have you guys guffawing over my dirty overalls and straw hat. How humiliating.
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Postby Pfish » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 15:29:18

Dude loooooks like he has been drinking moo tuch. Nice Rooosey cheeeks and all.
"If what we had was a dog and pony show what we have now is a canine-equestrian extravaganza"
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Postby oowolf » Thu 03 Mar 2005, 16:16:14

Smyth should hang crepe on his nose; his brain has apparently suffered a post-natal abortion.
Horse dung=great investment. I'm buying up all I can get.
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Postby wordsmyth » Thu 10 Mar 2005, 04:20:42

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Lehyina', ' ')".... May be I'm just dumb but my impression is that peak oil theorists are the opposite of socially reactionary."


Yep Lehyina, you're just dumb. Peak oil cultists - along with all the other Malthusian finite resource theorists, are reactionaries in every sense. It is the oldest political game in the book: conjure up a threat and then grab more power and influence by saying you are the only one with the solution to the threat.

If you ever thought any of these people were in any way serious, just read this thread. They are childish, abusive and, without exception, nasty little people. Like most pre-pubescent boys - they are semi-literate and emotionally retarded.

That's why they are attracted to way out whacko theories - and why no-one will ever take them seriously.
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Postby wordsmyth » Thu 10 Mar 2005, 04:23:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pfish', 'D')ude loooooks like he has been drinking moo tuch. Nice Rooosey cheeeks and all.


Yeah, Pfish, the pic was taken at the wedding reception for a friend - and I had consumed a few pops by then. The large collar is partly due to the camera angle and partly due to the fact that I had lost a lot of weight just previously.

What any of this has to do with my ideas is not, as yet, apparent to me.
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Re: Peak oil is nothing BUT horse dung

Postby wordsmyth » Thu 10 Mar 2005, 04:30:18

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ohanian', ' ')Michael Ekin Smyth says "Peak oil is nothing but horse dung to fool the masses"


Ohanian - try to quote accurately. I didn't say that at all. I used the example of horse dung pollution in 19th century urban streets to show how problems, ludicrously narrowly defined, could be blown out of perspective.
That is exactly the same intellectual error that is made by finite resource cults. Peak Oil people focus on oil resources alone - without considering them in relation to other sources of energy and - critically - ongoing technological advances.
My article put that sort of 'expert stupidity' in a political and social context.
Try to understand something.

Michael

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www.shellcrisis.com
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