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TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

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TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Zardoz » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:26:25

Here's their latest:

World Oil Forecasts Including Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the UAE - Update Feb 2008

Oh, my:

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$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')orld total liquids production (Fig 1) remains on a peak plateau since 2006 and is forecast to fall off this peak plateau in 2009. Increasing numbers of oil experts are forecasting impending peak production plateaus. According to the International Energy Agency (IEA), the current peak production of 87.2 mbd occurred on January 2008. As long as demand continues increasing then prices will continue increasing.

Although crude oil & lease condensate (C&C) production is forecast to continue declining, the total liquids supply remains on a plateau until 2009 (Fig 1), due to offsetting production increases from natural gas plant liquids (NGPLs), ethanol and XTL (BTL - biomass to liquids, CTL - coal to liquids and GTL - gas to liquids). The main causes for the end of the total liquids plateau in 2009 (Fig 1) are that the C&C production decline rate accelerates to 3%/yr in 2009 (Fig 3) and the production growth from natural gas plant liquids stalls (Fig 15).

Is future total liquids production likely to exceed the current peak of 87.2 mbd on January 2008? It might be possible but it appears unlikely. North Sea production continues to decline. Mexico's production is also in decline. Former USSR production might increase by a small amount. Canada's production should increase slowly but the oil sands are experiencing production constraints and despite claimed reserves of up to 315 Gb (billion barrels), the oil sands will probably produce, at best, a maximum of only 2.5 mbd (million barrels/day). Biofuels production should also continue increasing. Non OPEC total liquids production might increase slowly, assuming that no unexpected disruptions occur.


So, they're saying that by 2012 we'll see crude production down to less than 80 MBPD, theoretical demand at about 92 MBPD, and a price per barrel of about $190.

We're screwed.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby roccman » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:28:34

Ummmmmmmmm...we are good till september...

then...

Mad max
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby gnm » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:31:31

OK, I'll bite - what happens in September Rocc?

-G
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby roccman » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:33:50

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gnm', 'O')K, I'll bite - what happens in September Rocc?

-G


according to the graph in sept 08 demand goes north and supply south...

that would indicate to me increased volitility on a number of different levels...

yes?
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Iaato » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:37:38

Throw in a good hericane or two come September--we're overdue by two years for pounding landfall with some GOM rig/pipeline disruption.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby gnm » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:40:31

So you are guessing that perhaps around sept. 2008 begins the actual widespread shortages and such? I think it will take actual shortages to wake up the general consumer right now. The public is in such a stupor that only actual hardships will wake them up now.

"hurricane" Laato

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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby yesplease » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:49:44

How will demand continue to increase while supply drops?
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Zardoz » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:54:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('yesplease', 'H')ow will demand continue to increase while supply drops?

Theoretical demand. What would be consumed if it was available.

They're saying there'll be a shortfall of something like 12 MBPD from what we would burn up if we could get it. Hence the $190 price.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby basil_hayden » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 19:54:57

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('yesplease', 'H')ow will demand continue to increase while supply drops?


Could you stop with the semantics already?

It's theoretical...obviously demand can't exceed supply, but desire can.

Christ, let's move on already.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Ferretlover » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:00:19

HHhmmm... Is there a reason that the second half of the lines for supply and price are repeats (the ups and downs)..?
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby davep » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:01:18

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('basil_hayden', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('yesplease', 'H')ow will demand continue to increase while supply drops?


Could you stop with the semantics already?

It's theoretical...obviously demand can't exceed supply, but desire can.

Christ, let's move on already.


I don't see why demand can't exceed supply. It's actual purchases that can't exceed supply.

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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Zardoz » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:04:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('basil_hayden', 'C')hrist, let's move on already.

I second the motion.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby yesplease » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:24:25

Desire can exceed supply? M'kay... :razz:

The amount purchased=the amount available, and price is the mediator as to who purchases how much. No semantics there, just what actually happens. Theoretical price is speculative, and w/o any long or short run information/sources on elasticity I trust TOD's price estimates as much I trust a local car salesman's guess as to how much the shiny new SUV would cost me to fuel per year.

Edit- Not to say they are equally credible, just that w/o detailed info I wouldn't trust either about the statements that seem to be simplistic assumptions.
Last edited by yesplease on Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:34:11, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Starvid » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:24:50

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('roccman', 'U')mmmmmmmmm...we are good till september...

then...

Mad max

Like we haven't heard this 10 times before.

I think they are too conservative.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Valdemar » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:25:23

Given Ace's price prediction history, I don't see why.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby vision-master » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:29:08

It does seem like peak keeps getting moved into the future?
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Valdemar » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:32:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vision-master', 'I')t does seem like peak keeps getting moved into the future?


Why the question mark at the end of a statement?

And peak is only being pushed back marginally by an explosion in bio-fuels, GTL and other liquids trying to supplement the loss in crude production. Without the megaprojects coming on-stream on time, this trend will slow and then reverse.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby yesplease » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:40:47

How can bio-fuels, GTL, and other liquids have even made a dent in available supply?
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby Starvid » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:43:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('yesplease', 'H')ow can bio-fuels, GTL, and other liquids have even made a dent in available supply?
I think they make up something like 1-3 mbpd, the vast majority being ethanol.

If tar sands and Orinoco sludge are counted you get another 1-3 mbpd.
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Re: TOD's oil production forecast: Not so good...

Unread postby yesplease » Fri 15 Feb 2008, 20:48:44

Have any sources? Seems like it mirrors the drop in growth compared to '04 on the high end, on and the low end may result in a drop of about 4mbpd compared to the '05 estimates of peak assuming they used the same growth rate.
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