[Novus]

Well the CD/DVD/Blu-Ray disks all Rot over time. If you have any CD's from the mid 80s to early 90s they are probably unplayable right now in 2007. The phosphorus inside the disk will oxidize after a while unless stored in a zero oxygen environment. I remember reading an article saying that scholars in 100 years will know more about Lincoln and Jefferson then they do about Bush because they will still have the physical letters they wrote while G.W.B's e-mails will have long been lost forever.

In about 300 years most of what was built during the oil age will be gone. Ancient wonders like the pyramids will look almost exactly the same. The only thing we Americans maybe remembered for is Mount Rushmore which will be recognizable for at least 10,000 years. What Ancient civilization carved this mountain and where did they go?

[Zardoz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', '.')..ours was built a hundred years ago and it's falling apart bit by bit. We don't have the means or the resources to replace it now...

[PenultimateManStanding]

What's done is done, Z. I'm speaking about from here forward when I say we haven't got the resources to rebuild the infrastructure. And we don't have the time either. It's Duncan's Olduvai theory that I'm thinking of: 100 years for industrial civilization from cradle to grave. These breaking water mains are a symptom and I don't think the militarism issue has much bearing on it.

[Bas]

Actually I don't think humanity ever intended to built anything that would last longer than a life time, or maybe two; it's pretty much the natural maximum time horizon for people to plan for: planning their whole life ahead and leaving something worthwhile for at least part of their children's lives. Still much better than animals that only plan maybe for the next winter. The only real exception that I can find to this rule are the building of the pyramids, which were built with eternity in mind; I can't think of any archeological structure more sturdy than a pyramid.

If we really want to plan ahead more than 1-2 generations I think we would have to lose any sense of identity or even self and become not unlike the "borg" in Startrek; a unified being with an unlimited lifespan rather than billions of individuals.

I also would like to say I really don't agree with people saying we're some sort out of control yeast colony. Ofcourse it's a good analogy for a lot of the topics we discuss on here, but in the end it's still that; an analogy: I hear it way too much out of context, often in a sort of "defeatist" comment. It's fine if you define yourself as a yeast thingie, but don't call me one.

/rant

[PenultimateManStanding]

Bas, don't they have cathedrals in Europe that took many generations to build? btw, I was watching a documentary that showed giant natural conical shapes in the Egyptian desert that were carved by wind and sand. When I saw that my jaw dropped. They've been there for ages and ancient Egyptian desert nomads must have seen them. There's even a natural feature that looks like the Sphinx.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TheDude', 'i')n Central and East Asia sometimes you'd see shards of these records decorating yurts.

[MD]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TheDude', 'i')n Central and East Asia sometimes you'd see shards of these records decorating yurts.

[Plantagenet]

The older denser records are pretty rigid and fly like frisbees. The thin version of 33 1/3 records are pretty flimsy and floppy and don't fly as well.

You can get the record throwers on EBAY sometimes.....thats where I got mine.

[Bas]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', 'B')as, don't they have cathedrals in Europe that took many generations to build? btw, I was watching a documentary that showed giant natural conical shapes in the Egyptian desert that were carved by wind and sand. When I saw that my jaw dropped. They've been there for ages and ancient Egyptian desert nomads must have seen them. There's even a natural feature that looks like the Sphinx.

[eastbay]

It's true these medieval wonders took generations to complete and require constant maintanance. All this effort can't stop an earthquake from destroying them. Or they'll be destroyed by mindless bombing such as the USA did in Hue and in Monte Cassino.

No matter what we build and create, 99.9% of it will be gone in a few generations and the rest won't be understood after a few hundred years.

[PenultimateManStanding]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('eastbay', '
')No matter what we build and create, 99.9% of it will be gone in a few generations and the rest won't be understood after a few hundred years.

[eastbay]

You silly rabbit PMS, saying 99.9% of what we create will be gone after a few generations isn't whining, it's optimism!!

[PenultimateManStanding]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('eastbay', 'Y')ou silly rabbit PMS, saying 99.9% of what we create will be gone after a few generations isn't whining, it's optimism!!

[eastbay]

PMS, in a few generations no one will know what we're talking about, thankfully. You and I and our offspring may be the last ones to discuss such controversial topics. What's coming at us all in the 21st Century will make all previous human catastrophes and wild tales of wrongdoings seem really, really insignificant and petty.

And those few who live to talk about it afterwards will not be exaggerating about it for religious or political reasons. The evidence will not be limited to a few scaps of paper, museum reconstructions, and crazy anecdotal tales but will be clearly visible and smeared all around them.

Doomer Level approaching 10

[PenultimateManStanding]

yeah, well our doomer levels are about matched. As for that other stuff, I don't see any point in debating it. Things will get ugly soon enough and it won't matter. Cheers, pal. Besides, I'm not even a Jew.

[eastbay]

You may not believe this, but I'm not Jewish either, which has no bearing whatsoever on the price of oil. Oh, I've been told many times I 'look' Jewish but as far as I know I have no Khazar ancestry. I do have a light sprinkling of Eskimo ancestry, however, which combined with the Finn may be why cold weather, thankfully, doesn't bother me very much. Or my kids.

Incidentally, our home heater stays off until the inside temperature is below 59F. We never heat the house above 60F. In fact it's 61 inside our house right now and everyone is in a t-shirt. Funny how we all get accostomed to it.

[PenultimateManStanding]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('eastbay', ' ')Oh, I've been told many times I 'look' Jewish but as far as I know I have no Khazar ancestry.

[bodigami]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'T')he older denser records are pretty rigid and fly like frisbees. The thin version of 33 1/3 records are pretty flimsy and floppy and don't fly as well.

You can get the record throwers on EBAY sometimes.....thats where I got mine.

[bodigami]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('eastbay', '(')...)
No matter what we build and create, 99.9% of it will be gone in a few generations and the rest won't be understood after a few hundred years.

[eastbay]

Yes, it's indeed ironic zensui. It's meant to be. The march of time over the past 2500 years has offered humans ample opportunity to apply those wonderful 2500 year old basic precepts and truths. However, few have.

We can consider ourselves fortunate if written language survives the next 250 years. Impermanance will certainly become clear to all. I believe the time of Maitreya is undoubtedly getting close.