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Credit Problems, No problem?

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Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby burtonridr » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 15:59:11

So my thinking is that if you have credit problems and are in default, who cares? can they banks do anything? Can the government? Unless you have a lien on the your car or home or something, I dont think there is much they can do besides shake their finger and kick and scream. What happens? They sell the loan to a collection agency and they destroy your credit, but if you plan to be totally self reliant in a few years who cares. dont get me wrong, I have good credit, I believe if you borrow something you should pay it back. However, Im faced with a decision; either keep paying on my loans until I cant any longer because the economy crashes, or stop making payment and start saving $667 a month and use it to buy gold and silver so I can use it to buy a home out right when the economy goes to shit. Really having good credit is only a good thing if you intend to use it, right?

Is there something I dont know? will something horrible happen if I were to do that? I really dont know, it just crossed my mind this morning.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby threadbear » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 16:26:51

They can take your home from you, now that the bancruptcy laws have changed.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby smiley » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 16:28:55

"What the hell, they are not going to care."

Bet Faust thought the exact same thing about Mephistopheles
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby burtonridr » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 16:41:55

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'T')hey can take your home from you, now that the bancruptcy laws have changed.


I would still pay all my monthly service bills and mortgage and insurance, just not on my credit cards or personal loans. Could they do that over a few thousand dollars of debt? I dont plan to file bankruptcy. Im not even sure what bankruptcy is specifically. Who exactly can take my home, the collection agency, government?


Smiley, i dont understand what you were trying to say..
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 16:55:10

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('burtonridr', '
')Smiley, i dont understand what you were trying to say..
just making a witty Europoint I suppose. But if/when it all comes crashing down, Mephistopheles will be laughing.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')urton (1992, p. 61) speculates on Greek elements that may have played a part in the coining of the name, including Greek mē "not", phōs "light" and philos "lover", suggesting "not a lover of light" in parody of lucifer. Variations in mephost- may be due to attraction by Latin mephitis "pungent", and Goethe's Mephistopheles may due to Hebrew tophel "liar".
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby smiley » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 16:58:43

Hmm......... something went pretty wrong there. Computer is starting to revolt on me.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'j')ust making a witty Europoint I suppose. But if/when it all comes crashing down, Mephistopheles will be laughing.



The 'europoint' I tried to make is that credit or debt is not a one way exchange.

When you default on a loan you give the lender just cause to take anything from you to cover their losses. They can take your car, your house, your salary, just about anything, but your wife, kids and pet.

That is the other side of the exchange. The exchange is larger than an a pile of cash against written promise to pay it back. IOU is really IOUIAWIC, meaning I Owe You In Any Way I Can. You exchange control over your life for money.

And surely companies will not exercise these rights at this point. But why do you think they will be more lenient in times that are tough than in times of plenty?

They don't need to bother with hiring a pair of suited gorilla's to repo your stuff at this moment. It only gives them a bad reputation. But I bet in times of trouble the velvet gloves come off and they will put up a fight for every penny.

The reason I referred to Faust (or dr. Faustus) is that Faust exchanged his soul for prosperity thinking that the devil wouldn't bother about actually getting it. (Surely you must know that tale across the pond)

Thinking that banks in times of depression would magically forget about the money you owe them is IMO a similar type of hubris.

Hence the analogy.
Last edited by smiley on Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:51:45, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby burtonridr » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:19:29

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('burtonridr', '
')Smiley, i dont understand what you were trying to say..
just making a witty Europoint I suppose. But if/when it all comes crashing down, Mephistopheles will be laughing.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')urton (1992, p. 61) speculates on Greek elements that may have played a part in the coining of the name, including Greek mē "not", phōs "light" and philos "lover", suggesting "not a lover of light" in parody of lucifer. Variations in mephost- may be due to attraction by Latin mephitis "pungent", and Goethe's Mephistopheles may due to Hebrew tophel "liar".


Thanks for clarifying that for me :)

So still, can the bank or anyone do anything down the line? what happens to a defaulted loan? The way I understand it is the loan is sold to a collection agency that will call you day and night until they dont know how to get a hold of you any longer or they sell the loan to another collection agency, and it continues. Then what? Ive never defaulted on a loan before.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:31:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('burtonridr', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'T')hey can take your home from you, now that the bancruptcy laws have changed.


I would still pay all my monthly service bills and mortgage and insurance, just not on my credit cards or personal loans. Could they do that over a few thousand dollars of debt? I dont plan to file bankruptcy. Im not even sure what bankruptcy is specifically. Who exactly can take my home, the collection agency, government?


Smiley, i dont understand what you were trying to say..


Ultimately it comes down to your state laws and how much stuff you have. Any debtor can sue you if you don't pay them. Once they get a judgment against you in court, they can take that to the county sheriff and try to get your property seized. State law allows you certain exemptions which are property that can't be seized because of a judgment. Usually you are allowed a certain amount of value for your primary dwelling, a certain amount for clothes and household furnishings, etc. If all of your property is worth less than the limits in your state's exemption laws, then you are what is called "judgment proof". It is the situation you described above. There's really not much your creditors can do. If you have property that's not covered by the exemption laws in your state, then the sheriff can seize it and give it to your creditors.

The other situation where you can loose your property is if you have secured creditors. A secured creditor is where you borrow money and use something as a security. Typical examples would be a mortgage or a car loan. In those cases the property that was used as a security isn't protected by exemption law.
Last edited by smallpoxgirl on Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:35:45, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby Bas » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:31:56

as long as those evil foreigners don't call in the debt, everything is fine? (looking at the accounts though, it looks like developing countries are financing America's growing debt, how ironic :cry: )
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby burtonridr » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:35:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'I')f all of your property is covered by your state's exemption laws, then you are what is called "judgment proof". It is the situation you described above. There's really not much your creditors can do. If you have property that's not covered by the exemption laws in your state, then the sheriff can seize it and give it to your creditors.


So how would I find out if it exempt?
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:36:38

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('burtonridr', 'S')o how would I find out if it exempt?


What state do you live in?
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby burtonridr » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:56:58

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('burtonridr', 'S')o how would I find out if it exempt?


What state do you live in?


Idaho
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby smiley » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 17:57:00

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')urton (1992, p. 61) speculates on Greek elements that may have played a part in the coining of the name, including Greek mē "not", phōs "light" and philos "lover", suggesting "not a lover of light" in parody of lucifer. Variations in mephost- may be due to attraction by Latin mephitis "pungent", and Goethe's Mephistopheles may due to Hebrew tophel "liar".


cool

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he Tragical History of Doctor Faustus is a play by Christopher Marlowe, based on the Faust story (Faustus is Latin for Faust), in which a man sells his soul to the devil for power and knowledge. On a deeper level, this play shows the decay of a person who chooses material gains (by commanding the devils to suit his desires) over spiritual belief and in doing so, loses his soul. Doctor Faustus was first published in 1604, eleven years after Marlowe's death and at least twelve years after the first performance of the play.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tragic ... or_Faustus
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 18:09:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', '
')There's really not much your creditors can do.
Suppose the system is going to collapse, because, say, oil exports begin to decline, what's it going to matter who owes who what? We need some intellectual consistency here. Hundreds of millions of people in debt, hedge funds collapsing, CDOs worthless, no diesel for the trucks, etc. Mephistopheles will have a field day.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby burtonridr » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 18:52:17

Another option, does anyone know what would happen if I were to move from here (US) to Canada? Can they legally still in force a debt in another country? Im guessing they can because we are so close to canada, but I may be wrong.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 19:55:58

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('burtonridr', 'I')daho


link

The page says bankruptcy exemptions at the top, but the same exemptions are generally applicable to non-bankruptcy debtor law as well. If you want more details about how these would apply to you, you should probably talk to a lawyer.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby smiley » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 20:24:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he page says bankruptcy exemptions at the top, but the same exemptions are generally applicable to non-bankruptcy debtor law as well.


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A') dwelling house or mobile home, and the lands on which said structures are situated, with a total exemption not to exceed the lesser of: (i) the total net value of the lands, mobile home, and improvements thereon, or (ii) the sum of $50,000.


If I interpret this correctly: unless you live in 50k shack, you're better off moving to Brazil and not leaving a forwarding adress.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Fri 24 Aug 2007, 20:41:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smiley', 'I')f I interpret this correctly: unless you live in 50k shack, you're better off moving to Brazil and not leaving a forwarding adress.


I think that's right. If you live in Idaho and have real estate in excess of $50k, then your creditors could probably force a sale and take anything over $50K.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby burtonridr » Sat 25 Aug 2007, 01:06:18

Thanks Smallpox, sounds like that may work if I foreclose and move out of the country.

Anyone know if debt is carried over when you move out of the country (from the US to Canada)? Can they still enforce a debt if your in another country? Anyone know how Vancouver BC is? I like Sqaumish BC, it looks nice, its just north of Vancouver.
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Re: Credit Problems, No problem?

Unread postby DeLosMuertos » Sat 25 Aug 2007, 01:25:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smiley', 'I')f I interpret this correctly: unless you live in 50k shack, you're better off moving to Brazil and not leaving a forwarding adress.


I think that's right. If you live in Idaho and have real estate in excess of $50k, then your creditors could probably force a sale and take anything over $50K.


Wrong. 50K is the amount of equity that is exempt. If you have more than 50K in equity the bankruptcy trustee will sell your house, cut you a check for 50K and give the remainder to your creditors.
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