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PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby NEOPO » Mon 20 Aug 2007, 18:49:43

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', 'O')K, I'll play. Go smoke a joint and chop down a tree. And don't forget to clean a swimming pool while you're at it! :-D There, are you happy now?


Nope - it is like the alien said to the president in Independence day :shock:

BTW I thought I would take a break from smoking for a while and I was simply culling dead or dying tree's and merely helping a friend clean his pool.

Now, why don't you go smoke a joint and think about that cutey in the front row that you would like to bend over and teach a lesson 8)
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Mon 20 Aug 2007, 19:15:17

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NEOPO', 't')hat cutey in the front row that you would like to bend over and teach a lesson
You do have your moments, NEO and that did make me laugh. But I am not a sheik and I do have a modest ability to sublimate to an appreciation of ideas and intellect. Not that it's going to do me any good as I sit here in my apartment eating noodles while the world collapses.
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby NEOPO » Mon 20 Aug 2007, 19:18:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NEOPO', 't')hat cutey in the front row that you would like to bend over and teach a lesson
You do have your moments, NEO and that did make me laugh. But I am not a sheik and I do have a modest ability to sublimate to an appreciation of ideas and intellect. Not that it's going to do me any good as I sit here in my apartment eating noodles while the world collapses.


Damnit! stop stealing my thunder! :o
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby blukatzen » Mon 20 Aug 2007, 23:38:10

Good Gods, I have been off for several months at the garden centers, and THIS is what I come back to? You 2 guys are STILL at it?..
Some things never change.

Glad to be back, if only for a little bit. How has the summer been treating you two?
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby NEOPO » Tue 21 Aug 2007, 09:51:42

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('blukatzen', 'G')ood Gods, I have been off for several months at the garden centers, and THIS is what I come back to? You 2 guys are STILL at it?..
Some things never change.

Glad to be back, if only for a little bit. How has the summer been treating you two?


Good to see you again.

We visited our first real ecovillage and it did not go well yet of course that will not stop us from continuing to pursue sustainability.

The main issue was that clothing was optional and my spouse simply could not deal with it so instead of trying to push home through an uncomfortable situation for her we left early and are now regrouping.

Those people should most definately state that clothing is optional as there were people building cob houses completely nude yet we were told that this was the case only near swimming area's.
My kids did not mind and neither did I yet I suppose it was alittle much for my wife :)
One thing that did bother me was that I was not suppose to smoke in the common area's (ok np) yet certain people would drop drawer and urinate in the same area like wtf? :o

Good people dedicated to living sustainably yet...
and how did your summer go dear?

BTW - I haven't been to your forum yet this summer as prior to the eco trip we spent 6 weeks camping and before that powering way down.
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby blukatzen » Tue 21 Aug 2007, 13:07:16

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')ood to see you again.


Thanks, Neopo, I've missed your writings, and thoughts, though I am glad to see that you and your family had some great adventures! Nothing strived for, nothing gained. At least you got some mileage under your belt for what *some* ecovillages can be like. Did you get any real practical advise for building cob houses? How about the kids?
How is your sister-in-law faring? Last I left, that part of your family was in straits. I think about that from time to time, and hope she, and the baby are well.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')e visited our first real ecovillage and it did not go well yet of course that will not stop us from continuing to pursue sustainability.


Well, of course not, it just makes your more determined to find the RIGHT one for yourselves. Good luck down the road. Finding the right one will make all the difference in survival. Its's just as easy to throw your luck in with a bunch of knowledgable folks as well as some grade-A doofuses.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he main issue was that clothing was optional and my spouse simply could not deal with it so instead of trying to push home through an uncomfortable situation for her we left early and are now regrouping.
Those people should most definately state that clothing is optional as there were people building cob houses completely nude yet we were told that this was the case only near swimming area's.
My kids did not mind and neither did I yet I suppose it was alittle much for my wife :)


She must be a saint! I think life with you would be a real adventure, Neo, and don't think of it in a bad way at all! I am glad that the kids had that experience, however, remember, that you have to know the other folks' intentions toward the children beforehand..
There was a case of some folks that I know had a get-together, (which didn't even involve nudity) and there was a child molestation there. The guy was prosecuted, and is now in jail. I think her "mom radar" was up, and it was a stressor since she may not have known the people as well as she wanted to. You don't know people's intentions these days, and I can respect her for that.



$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'O')ne thing that did bother me was that I was not suppose to smoke in the common area's (ok np) yet certain people would drop drawer and urinate in the same area like wtf? :o


Sounds like the garden of Eden! :lol: "Natural"
Neo, you could have told them that while you are appreciative of their efforts at fertilizing the place w/out commercial NPK fertilizers, YOU are doing YOUR PART by adding ASH to the ground to make it EQUALLY fertile! But, on second thought, you're better off out of that particular ecovillage.
Better not to waste your efforts on THOSE little mushrooms...

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')ood people dedicated to living sustainably yet...
and how did your summer go dear?

Oh, dear, THANKS for asking! Well, I am training 2 new managers this summer. I opened my 6th store that I have opened! (we are up to 17 stores, we just cut a deal w/some grocery stores in the city that want us to come in next season and set up our stores in their parking lot, since we are seasonal in business.)
So, that will bump it up to about 28 or so stores, that we have seasonally in the Chicagoland area.
It's been a good season, and I love being in a greenhouse w/the plants.

Personally, I am designing a butterfly garden right now, to incorporate more nectar plants in the backyard.

We are ready to start the Autumn season, and that is the "Pumpkin Patch" alongside all the fall perennials (and fruit bushes, grape vines, etc. that I like to push alongside the decorative stuff.) It is a much more mellow time for me than in the Springtime, when everyone seems so rushed and excited, this time it's more relaxed and carefree. I always ask how folks' gardens went, and they seem to really enjoy talking about what they have accomplished. Good to share the harvest in more ways than one, there are mental harvests to celebrate too..and I enjoy that.

I get a kick out of the kids coming in, for some reason they yell with happiness when they see the pumpkins all out in their orange bountiful glory. Big giant pumpkins just seem to sum up "good harvest" for most folks.
Too bad they may not see what is just coming down the road.. :(

[/quote]BTW - I haven't been to your forum yet this summer as prior to the eco trip we spent 6 weeks camping and before that powering way down.[quote]

6 weeks camping! Sounds like a lot of fun and family togetherness, you must have been having a great time!

I haven't been at the lists too much either, as my fellow mods know that I have this committment at this time every year. Wintertime is more active time for me (or any horticulturist) on the internet.
However, another friend has started a list that has studied the history of ecovillages in Europe, called Lebensreform. This was during the late 1800's, through the early part of the last century. What you really thought was new is just recycled thinking. Nothing new under the sun!
They were the hippies of their generation. If anyone wants more information, PM me and I will send you there to that list.

I'll be sitting on those pumpkins Neo,(and PMS too!) wishing you all here good thoughts....(blows a kiss to you, your wife and kids..)
[smilie=adios.gif]
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby Plantagenet » Tue 21 Aug 2007, 14:09:58

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NEOPO', '
')We visited our first real ecovillage and it did not go well yet of course that will not stop us from continuing to pursue sustainability.

The main issue was that clothing was optional...


We'll all have to make sacrifices when civilization collapses after PeakOil. When the trucks stop bringing food, the supply of other basic things like clothes will also be cut off. 8)
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby Pops » Tue 21 Aug 2007, 23:07:37

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', 'O')K, I'll play.

Wait a minute; I thought this WAS your game?

Funny things are happening here ‘eh PMS?

I kinda thought this was some little gauntlet you were slapping Neo with because of a slight you felt.

I didn’t know you guys had a thing going but though it would be good fodder for the Open and entertainment for my afternoons as you are both entertaining.

But now he finds a long lost friend (I guess anyway; after the first line of bluk’s post I felt I was eaves-dropping and quit reading)

So is this a PMS vs, NEO thread or what?
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby blukatzen » Tue 21 Aug 2007, 23:56:04

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut now he finds a long lost friend (I guess anyway; after the first line of bluk’s post I felt I was eaves-dropping and quit reading)


Hi Pops,

Heineken and I are friends as well. I've written to a few other folk.
I don't get to write as often during this time of year as I am a horticulturist, and help to run garden centers. I know you're involved in farming, and so you know this is our busy season.

As to the doom and gloom factor here, well, I've found it more productive to step away from the computer for bits and actually live my life. Kind of like what Neo and his family did this summer...

But when the need arises, I still refer quite a few folks here, still. You're forum in this list is still very fine for resources and information. I want people to know of this.

I wouldn't write what I wrote if I didn't think we had a community effort here, with feelings that a community..even online..engenders. It's amusing, because Neo and I, and Heineken and I didn't quite see eye to eye when we first met online. But you keep on writing, and reading, and you see you may have been a little thin-skinned, or have given the incorrect expression of your own thoughts..whatever..and you eventually find out that you are more on the same page then off of it. (and maybe if you get really lucky, they may think the same way too, and then there can be *some* meeting of the minds somewhere down the road we're all on together anyway.)

And you find out you are in a community of sorts...

I feel warmly about some of the folks here, and hope they are doing well, when I am offline not able to see their latest thoughts.
After all, besides our immediate families, who else have we got to speak about these issues to that REALLY understands?

It's important, to appreciate each other, we're all we've got, even IF we disagree. Unless I am wrong, I think the reason Aaron got this board up and running is to inform, and build community. I would think it's to be the life raft for what's to come down the road.

Be well Pops! Frith to your household!:)

(and that's "Blu" NOT "Bluk"..for short, that is.)
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Wed 22 Aug 2007, 00:28:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pops', '
')Funny things are happening here ‘eh PMS?
Something I learned as a boy, pops. If you fight hard enough with someone, you may actually come to like them. I fought behind the little league stadium with a guy who turned out to be one of the meanest SOBs in my high school. He gave me a pass because I fought him when we were 8 years old. Besides that, I find it ironic that NEO is having a hard time finding an ecovillage where they don't want to take their clothes off. Doesn't bother him but it does bother his wife. Reminds me of jato whose wife won't leave Southern California. We're all stuck one way or another.
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby Plantagenet » Wed 22 Aug 2007, 03:17:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', ' ')I find it ironic that NEO is having a hard time finding an ecovillage where they don't want to take their clothes off.



When the New Guinea Highlanders want some clothes, they just pull some giant fronds off a handy plant, and jam them down into a cord they wear around their waist.

When Peak Oil starts to bring our civilization to its knees, we'll have to learn from the so-called "primitive" people how to live in harmony with the earth.

One lesson is that manufactured, imported, store-bought clothes are incompatible with a sustainable lifestyle...... 8)
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby WildRose » Wed 22 Aug 2007, 03:40:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', 'W')e're all stuck one way or another.


Yep. It's extended family that keeps me where I am, well, that and finances. But in the back of my mind, I imagine someday I may have to leave the rest of the family and flee for my kids' sake.
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Re: PMS Versus NEO, How Does It Stack Up

Unread postby NEOPO » Wed 22 Aug 2007, 08:04:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('blukatzen', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')ood to see you again.


Thanks, Neopo, I've missed your writings, and thoughts, though I am glad to see that you and your family had some great adventures! Nothing strived for, nothing gained. At least you got some mileage under your belt for what *some* ecovillages can be like. Did you get any real practical advise for building cob houses? How about the kids?
How is your sister-in-law faring? Last I left, that part of your family was in straits. I think about that from time to time, and hope she, and the baby are well.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')e visited our first real ecovillage and it did not go well yet of course that will not stop us from continuing to pursue sustainability.


Well, of course not, it just makes your more determined to find the RIGHT one for yourselves. Good luck down the road. Finding the right one will make all the difference in survival. Its's just as easy to throw your luck in with a bunch of knowledgable folks as well as some grade-A doofuses.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he main issue was that clothing was optional and my spouse simply could not deal with it so instead of trying to push home through an uncomfortable situation for her we left early and are now regrouping.
Those people should most definately state that clothing is optional as there were people building cob houses completely nude yet we were told that this was the case only near swimming area's.
My kids did not mind and neither did I yet I suppose it was alittle much for my wife :)


She must be a saint! I think life with you would be a real adventure, Neo, and don't think of it in a bad way at all! I am glad that the kids had that experience, however, remember, that you have to know the other folks' intentions toward the children beforehand..
There was a case of some folks that I know had a get-together, (which didn't even involve nudity) and there was a child molestation there. The guy was prosecuted, and is now in jail. I think her "mom radar" was up, and it was a stressor since she may not have known the people as well as she wanted to. You don't know people's intentions these days, and I can respect her for that.



$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'O')ne thing that did bother me was that I was not suppose to smoke in the common area's (ok np) yet certain people would drop drawer and urinate in the same area like wtf? :o


Sounds like the garden of Eden! :lol: "Natural"
Neo, you could have told them that while you are appreciative of their efforts at fertilizing the place w/out commercial NPK fertilizers, YOU are doing YOUR PART by adding ASH to the ground to make it EQUALLY fertile! But, on second thought, you're better off out of that particular ecovillage.
Better not to waste your efforts on THOSE little mushrooms...

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')ood people dedicated to living sustainably yet...
and how did your summer go dear?

Oh, dear, THANKS for asking! Well, I am training 2 new managers this summer. I opened my 6th store that I have opened! (we are up to 17 stores, we just cut a deal w/some grocery stores in the city that want us to come in next season and set up our stores in their parking lot, since we are seasonal in business.)
So, that will bump it up to about 28 or so stores, that we have seasonally in the Chicagoland area.
It's been a good season, and I love being in a greenhouse w/the plants.

Personally, I am designing a butterfly garden right now, to incorporate more nectar plants in the backyard.

We are ready to start the Autumn season, and that is the "Pumpkin Patch" alongside all the fall perennials (and fruit bushes, grape vines, etc. that I like to push alongside the decorative stuff.) It is a much more mellow time for me than in the Springtime, when everyone seems so rushed and excited, this time it's more relaxed and carefree. I always ask how folks' gardens went, and they seem to really enjoy talking about what they have accomplished. Good to share the harvest in more ways than one, there are mental harvests to celebrate too..and I enjoy that.

I get a kick out of the kids coming in, for some reason they yell with happiness when they see the pumpkins all out in their orange bountiful glory. Big giant pumpkins just seem to sum up "good harvest" for most folks.
Too bad they may not see what is just coming down the road.. :(

BTW - I haven't been to your forum yet this summer as prior to the eco trip we spent 6 weeks camping and before that powering way down.$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')
6 weeks camping! Sounds like a lot of fun and family togetherness, you must have been having a great time!

I haven't been at the lists too much either, as my fellow mods know that I have this committment at this time every year. Wintertime is more active time for me (or any horticulturist) on the internet.
However, another friend has started a list that has studied the history of ecovillages in Europe, called Lebensreform. This was during the late 1800's, through the early part of the last century. What you really thought was new is just recycled thinking. Nothing new under the sun!
They were the hippies of their generation. If anyone wants more information, PM me and I will send you there to that list.

I'll be sitting on those pumpkins Neo,(and PMS too!) wishing you all here good thoughts....(blows a kiss to you, your wife and kids..)
[smilie=adios.gif]

Blu - We went, we saw and ultimately we did not learn anything new except the limitations that we all face although it was indeed awesome to actually witness, touch and get a true taste of limited sustainability. I feel that this particular ecovillage is doing the best that they can and considering the unsustainability of the culture they are head and shoulders above 99.99% of the rest. The kids loved the experience but the 6 weeks camping was probably the highlight of their summer besides all the T&A they were allowed to witness 8)
The kids were fine with the women but when the men started dropping trow the culturaly ingrained homophobia made an appearance :)

My sister in law is getting along alittle better these days but of course the pain is always going to be there. She and the kids have some okay death benefits coming and she is now back to work. They came down to visit for a few days and we spent some quality time with her and the kids which seems to help us all heal. The little girl "Emma" is gorgeous and such a good baby. I am not sure if I can describe the mix of emotions that playing with my nephew gives me, its like pain and love, hope and despair all mixed into one. Ultimately, they are well and overcoming and thank you so much for the best wishes.

Eco people - well I do not think we had too much to worry about yet yes we are always on gaurd and on the look out like any good parents should be. Yeah, crap happens sometimes in the least likely of places so I think the extreme nudity may have bothered my wife because of the children rather then from her own apprehensiveness. I asked her to try and overcome it, maybe get naked with them yet she was not having any of that :lol:

Yes, we informed them of our reasons for leaving and they said to not worry, they understood and that we were not burning and bridges of sorts.

I do not know about sainthood yet my wife has definately been patient and supportive. She understands most if not all of what we have both learned so it isn't like I have had to twist her arm to get the team motivated and I am most thankful especially after reading the "spouse" threads here that I have a mate that is willing to accept change and head toward sustainability.

Well it sounds like you are doing well and prospering in a much more sustainable way then most. If my career does not pan out I might come begging for employment one of these days. Heck you might even decide to form some sort of ecovillage yourself!

While camping, one night my older son says "it is perfect" and I replied "what do you mean exactly and he looked around at our impressive yet primitive campsite and he said "this place, our camp and all that has happened" I smiled and quipped "great so this means we will not have to hear you complain ever again then right?" yet of course the next morning he was back at it and upset that we would not let him have more then a small cup of "cowboy coffee" :)

We camped on a hillside with zero flat spots so we worked our butts off, lost alot of love handles and in the end were all proud of the time spent.

Perhaps we will visit chicagoland one fine day and look you up as I would definately enjoy meeting you and also seeing how the greenhouses operate etc etc. We did not have a garden this year but we did help some others and got to enjoy some of the fruits of our labors. I like it when people smile as they pick large maters, peppers, onions and cukes and then make a salad that did not travel 1500 miles on average to get to their plate. It really is inspirational and empowering.

Thanks for the thoughts, I will stay in touch besides this board and "yer my girl blu!" 8)
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