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Grief

Discussions related to the physiological and psychological effects of peak oil on our members and future generations.

Re: Transcending Grief

Unread postby knoppix2004 » Fri 16 Sep 2005, 20:23:28

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', 'Y')es, if the world is without humans, it won't be the end of the world, it will just be "different".


Oh G-D human will not be dying because of “passing peak oil”. Well, some will die. Don’t be so dramatic.
We are babies, we must cry.
Oil is Peaking, we must lie.
la la la la la la la...
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Re: Transcending Grief

Unread postby sameu » Sat 17 Sep 2005, 23:51:19

I think I went from apathy to acceptance

I'm not depressed over this. I'm not very optimistic either. But I'm just too curious to see how this will change the world, the biggest chalenge of modern society. I find it kinda exciting.
Ok there will be shit. But face it, we don't now exactly how bad it will be, what exactly the consequences will be.
Maybe will say in twenty years, fiew, close call, but we made it...
Or we'll all be dead :-D

Either way. Party hardy, get prepared, get annoyed by people in denial, follow the oil related news, if you're single it's funny to see how the peakoil awareness becomes a factor in a possible partner choice, practice your 'told you so grin', enjoy the ride, have fun!
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It's About Grief

Unread postby threadbear » Sat 28 Jul 2007, 22:48:49

There is real danger ahead, character testing times. Perhaps we will turn inward, and in so doing, turn our backs on our fellow man. I wonder how many of us will end up embracing philosophies that are anti human. If these philsophies are anti-human, they are essentially anti-social or sociopathic. We could end up becoming the monster we are trying to defeat. Where are we heading? Where is our grief about the present state of affairs leading us, ideologically and spiritually?

From Common Ground:

I’ve heard from so many people who are disgusted by the ascendancy of bullshit and hypocrisy over decency and truth. And even those who avoid the newspaper and evening news are feeling a free-floating anxiety about the world’s state.

They may disguise it with cynical humour or ironic distance, but at its source, it’s about grief. I feel it myself. But there’s an odd thing about grief as an emotional state. It’s only a degree of separation, a hair-breadth away, from joy.


Knowledge, in some esoteric traditions, is considered a false crown. I suspect that it’s not cleverness, but compassion, that will test our fitness as a species. I have no academic citations handy for this, no journalistic references. The closest I can come is an anecdote from Buddhist teacher Jack Kornfield, about one of the twentieth century’s great minds, Aldous Huxley.


As the author of Brave New World lay dying, someone asked what he had learned from a lifetime of studying spiritual practices and traditions, as well as his own experiences. His response: “It’s embarrassing to tell you this, but it seems to come down mostly to just learning to be kinder.

http://commonground.ca/iss/0707192/cg192_future.shtml
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Sat 28 Jul 2007, 22:57:11

Nice post, threadbare. But it is embarrassing to tell you, people are not going to be kind. In fact, I'm pretty sure that they will be as cruel as you can imagine and then some.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby threadbear » Sat 28 Jul 2007, 23:25:29

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', 'N')ice post, threadbare. But it is embarrassing to tell you, people are not going to be kind. In fact, I'm pretty sure that they will be as cruel as you can imagine and then some.


That's an interesting point. It's also a self reinforcing one. If we realize that emotional states are somewhat contagious, can we not do our bit by maintaining a caring state of mind and count on a mirroring effect?
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby HEADER_RACK » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 00:17:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', '
')That's an interesting point. It's also a self reinforcing one. If we realize that emotional states are somewhat contagious, can we not do our bit by maintaining a caring state of mind and count on a mirroring effect?


If it all realy goes to hell. I think the emotional state of most will be numb. You couldn't afford to care about someone else. You will be to busy trying to care about your own survival.
In a starvation it has been noted the mothers will take food from their own daugters and fathers and sons will fight each other over a scap of food.
If it all goes to hell philsophies on caring about others will go right out the window. I think more natural instincts will take hold of people. Certainly the one for self preservation.
When a person drops dead. I don't believe there will be much sorrow, just a mental note of thats one less person I have to compete with to survive. Man is an animal after all and he has instincts though they have been buried deep down a long time.
Nothing is more dangerous than a man with nothing left to lose but has everything left to gain.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby TWilliam » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 00:25:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'T')hat's an interesting point. It's also a self reinforcing one. If we realize that emotional states are somewhat contagious, can we not do our bit by maintaining a caring state of mind and count on a mirroring effect?


Count on? Mmmm... I'm not so sure. Tho' I agree the potential is there.

I believe it's preferable to seek co-operation whenever possible, but I also believe it's naive to assume that everyone you might encounter feels the same.
"It means buckle your seatbelt, Dorothy, because Kansas? Is goin' bye-bye... "
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby bodigami » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 00:29:25

This is my personal opinion:

I know that humans are animals, but compassion is also useful for survival. Unless TS really HTF. But, if one sees the current ecological situation... compassion is mostly for Life as a whole, not humans. In the end, the human population has to go way down for life to continue a healthy course. For about 2 years I am buddhist. I honestly prefer to die and know that less humans is better for life on Earth, than to live vicariously killing humans for food. I still think that the ideal of compassion, peace, love and Nirvana can hold when TSHTF.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby Roccland » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 01:24:36

Every November 24 at 5AM we get a brief glimpse of our true being.

Next time you are on the freeway...and a car wants to merge with blinker on...almost involuntarily you want to speed up.

How very pathetic we are.

Humans are hard wired to cheat.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby I_Like_Plants » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 01:54:51

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Roccland', 'E')very November 24 at 5AM we get a brief glimpse of our true being.


What happens every November 24 at 5AM?
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby Baldwin » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 02:15:44

I have two goals for life:

Tell the truth, even when it is incredibly hurtful and inconvenient.

Life isn't fair....I hope to try and change that in what ways I can.
Only a city man would carry a bag of iron instead of a bag of rice.

-Ling Tan, from the movie Dragon Seed, 1944 (more wisdom from Turner Classic Movies)
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby Roccland » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 02:23:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('I_Like_Plants', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Roccland', 'E')very November 24 at 5AM we get a brief glimpse of our true being.


What happens every November 24 at 5AM?


A large group of zombies herd at the entrances to toy-r-us and Wal Mart awaiting the annual running of the zombies - I think it is called Black Friday - the busiest shopping day of the year in the good ol US of A.

Someone usually always gets killed during the stampede to get laughing elmo.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby wisconsin_cur » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 05:20:26

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('HEADER_RACK', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', '
')That's an interesting point. It's also a self reinforcing one. If we realize that emotional states are somewhat contagious, can we not do our bit by maintaining a caring state of mind and count on a mirroring effect?


If it all realy goes to hell. I think the emotional state of most will be numb. You couldn't afford to care about someone else. You will be to busy trying to care about your own survival.
In a starvation it has been noted the mothers will take food from their own daugters and fathers and sons will fight each other over a scap of food.
If it all goes to hell philsophies on caring about others will go right out the window. I think more natural instincts will take hold of people. Certainly the one for self preservation.
When a person drops dead. I don't believe there will be much sorrow, just a mental note of thats one less person I have to compete with to survive. Man is an animal after all and he has instincts though they have been buried deep down a long time.


I think we could agree that there are also cases of parents sacrificing themselves for their children or caring for them as they all starve together. What we bring to the table as far as character determines how we respond to crisis. The question we should be asking is how will the people in my neighborhood respond to the crisis. Perhaps we will all kill each other for the privlidge of being the last one to starve. That attitude will be out there is some communities. Others, however, will respond differently. They will suffer together and, live of die, walk through the troubles ahead together.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby OilIsMastery » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 05:36:26

Everything Communist Ground stands for is antihuman and immoral.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby HEADER_RACK » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 10:38:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('wisconsin_cur', 'I') think we could agree that there are also cases of parents sacrificing themselves for their children or caring for them as they all starve together. What we bring to the table as far as character determines how we respond to crisis. The question we should be asking is how will the people in my neighborhood respond to the crisis. Perhaps we will all kill each other for the privlidge of being the last one to starve. That attitude will be out there is some communities. Others, however, will respond differently. They will suffer together and, live of die, walk through the troubles ahead together.


Working together to overcome a crisis situation is not compassion or character. It's a survival tool. You join together to better your chances of coming out alive.
If your little survival community has crops and one year they fail. You take stock of what you have hidden and it's just barely enough to get you and your wife through to next harvest. Do you share with those who don't have enough to make it? If you do you, then you are inviting certain death for you and your wife.
Alot of people hate the fact that some of us have the thought of take care of me and mine and damn the rest. Well hate to say it but thats how nature truly is. Nature is cruel and unforgiving and shows no mercy.
A pride of lions will work together to feed the pride. They don't share with other prides and if one of them gets crippled or mamed they are left to their own devices to live or die.
It might sound harsh and cold but animals have been fighting for their survival for millenia. They are better at it than we are now. It is prudent to look to them to see how we might need to be in order to make it. As in inhumain as that may sound.
Nothing is more dangerous than a man with nothing left to lose but has everything left to gain.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby TheTurtle » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 11:27:44

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'A')s the author of Brave New World lay dying, someone asked what he had learned from a lifetime of studying spiritual practices and traditions, as well as his own experiences. His response: “It’s embarrassing to tell you this, but it seems to come down mostly to just learning to be kinder.


:) I believe kindness is an essential part of whatever the future holds if we hope to be able to cope with it.

Remember Katrina. In all the chaos that ensued, the scene that still comes to my mind is a group of mostly white people hauling a makeshift raft through the nasty water, trying to get a large old black woman to safety.

IMO, taking care of each other will be essential in chaotic times ahead.
“Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves.” (Ted Perry)
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby threadbear » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 12:24:43

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilIsMastery', 'E')verything Communist Ground stands for is antihuman and immoral.


So you feel that cooperation, in and of itself, is Communist? It's actually what modern capitalism is founded on. The elites cooperate and for everyone else, it's every man for himself.

Belief in the stark reality of ongoing cut-throat competition is self-neutering. If you wish to remain powerless, good for you, but some people may object to being harassed by a lone poverty stricken oddball traipsing through a thread, with a sandwich board board pronouncing "You too, can be more like me"
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby OilIsMastery » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 12:34:33

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'S')o you feel that cooperation, in and of itself, is Communist? It's actually what modern capitalism is founded on. The elites cooperate and for everyone else, it's every man for himself.

When Communist Ground says "cooperation" what they really mean is "subjugation." It's exactly like Newspeak in George Orwell's 1984. In the context of Communist Ground, freedom is an euphamism for slavery.
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby threadbear » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 12:41:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilIsMastery', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'S')o you feel that cooperation, in and of itself, is Communist? It's actually what modern capitalism is founded on. The elites cooperate and for everyone else, it's every man for himself.

When Communist Ground says "cooperation" what they really mean is "subjugation." It's exactly like Newspeak in George Orwell's 1984. In the context of Communist Ground, freedom is an euphamism for slavery.


You'll have to back that up. Where is the Communist model endorsed?
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Re: It's About Grief

Unread postby OilIsMastery » Sun 29 Jul 2007, 12:47:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilIsMastery', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'S')o you feel that cooperation, in and of itself, is Communist? It's actually what modern capitalism is founded on. The elites cooperate and for everyone else, it's every man for himself.

When Communist Ground says "cooperation" what they really mean is "subjugation." It's exactly like Newspeak in George Orwell's 1984. In the context of Communist Ground, freedom is an euphamism for slavery.


You'll have to back that up. Where is the Communist model endorsed?

http://commongroundmag.com/

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')op Ten pages recommended to friends:

1. Beyond Eco-Apartheid
2. One Great Big Plastic Hassle
3. Dr. Bronner’s Magic Media Soap Opera
4. Let’s Get Vertical
5. Green Cities and the End of the Age of Oil
6. The Sound of Science
7. Prison Practice
8. How Green is Your Diet?
9. Features
10. Death Midwifery and the Home Funeral Revolution

I rest my case.
The Lies Of Richard Heinberg

http://oilismastery.blogspot.com/
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