[frankthetank]

So i'm reading this article from National Geographic and come across this little snippet:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')n American corporation began operating the first huge pulp mill in 1954 near the fishing town of Ketchikan. A second was built soon after in Sitka by a Japanese consortium. Alaska's biggest industrial facilities in the era before North Slope oil, each hired some 500 people at relatively high wages. Many more were employed as sawyers, bulldozer operators, and drivers to keep an annual volume of 200 to 600 million board feet (470,000 to 1.4 million cubic meters) of timber (about 20,000 to 60,000 logging truckloads) flowing to the mills. There, the straight trunks of big hemlocks and the dense-grained, incredibly strong wood of Sitka spruce, many of the spruce trees born two or three centuries before Europeans knew the New World existed, were shredded and soaked in chemical brews—pulped. The pulp was shipped off to make rayon, cellophane, newspaper, and absorbent filling for disposable diapers.

[frankthetank]

Some more good stuff.

Normal human?
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')I'm kinda bitter," he told me. "This is a damn rain forest. It was put here to log."

[frankthetank]

Just to finish it off. Now it looks like the cruise ship industry has provided the jobs that were lost when logging went elsewhere (Canada/etc). What happens when that dies? (it will!) People will start looking back at the trees and seeing money again/or firewood!

[gampy]

One thing that strikes me as odd, is that many people begrudge and berate the forest industry, yet continue to use the products they harvest, or clearcut.

Paper, lumber, cellophane, wood furniture, wood frame houses, you name it - it comes from old growth forests. tree farms do not meet the requirements of much of the downstream industries. Paper mills maybe. Furniture, and 2 by 4's, no.

Use google earth and take a look at Vancouver Island, parts of Washington State, and Alaska. You zoom in and you can see what the demand for wood products has done to the forests. What looks like little squares are clearcuts. You won't see these from the roads, oh no.

If people are concerned about the destruction of old growth forest, they should be concentrating on reducing demand for wood. But our society cannot function without it. Much like oil.

Governments are loathe to regulate, and legislate the timber companies because of the jobs (and revenue) lost. Governments are not good stewards of natural resources. They are in conflict of interest. They throw a few crumbs to the Greenpeace and Sierra clubs, and aboriginal groups, but they have no real interest in turning what good stands we have left into preserves. Too many conflicting interests.

Sad, but true. These old forests will be denuded just like eastern North America was in the 1800's.

The worldwide demand for these timber resources is just too great.

They have saved a few areas from logging, but that doesn't matter, because they still log everywhere else, and the rivers and watersheds are ruined.

[seldom_seen]

The destruction of the Tongass rainforest is subsidized by the US taxpayer and cheap fossil fuels. Both of which are in depletion.

We're closing in quickly on the day when the chainsaws will seize up for lack of fuel. The road building will cease due to lack of funding.

This is good, it makes me HAPPY. We need to be more optimistic around here and focus on all the benefits of peak oil.

[eastbay]

This is good, it makes me HAPPY. We need to be more optimistic around here and focus on all the benefits of peak oil.

Seldomseen,

Excellent.

The entire earth, other than one single species, is very eagerly anticipating the arrival of the bottom of the PO slide. For about 9,999,999 different species living on earth peal oil is an unbelieveably huge blessing. And for one single species it will spell the end of their reign of terror on earth. There's plenty to be HAPPY about with peak oil.

[frankthetank]

Thats what i'm hoping for.

Yes i agree, we all use the products. We (most) are guilty to some extent.

I guess if we all lived in squalor slums and didn't have any money, the planet would be better off. Since we can afford junk, the planet is doomed. Cheap oil is the key here. Its doing all the heavy lifting, not man.

[strider3700]

I wish we ground a lot of that big wood up and turned it into pulp. The vast majority of the back roads around here are gated and locked year round. This is officially done for the publics safety but really it's done to limit access and keep reporters out. If pictures ever got out to any of the major world papers of just how wasteful our forest practice is it could devastate our tourism friendly image that we push so hard lately.

The way forestry works here depends on the type of land.

Private land means you must meet environmental regulations and thats about it. So I think it's 50 feet from a highway and river you can't cut it bare everything else goes unless you are unlucky and have important nests or something in your land. If no one knows about that eagle nest cut it down and you never saw anything. Basically private lands end up moonscapes if thats what the owner wants.

Public/Crown land you have to meet environmental regulation and pay your stumpage fees for everything you cut. What you can cut is determined by the ministry. Basically how that works is you apply to cut an area and come to an agreement on what the stumpage will be. Small players get told $X/stump big guys can work deals. Here's where things get real ugly. When given the OK to cut an area the costs work out that you want to cut every single tree in the area. Clear cutting is safer on the workers and cheaper so they do it and in a big way. If an area is 95% fir 5% cedar you only want the 5% fir because the fees involved in sorting that 5% cedar out and then doing all the paper work to do something with it (export, mill, pulp...) isn't worth the cost. So realistically that 5% should be left standing but the government wants it's dollar on that wood too so it wants it dropped. So the best thing the companies can do money wise is cut the cedar and leave it laying there.

When you go back into some of these cuts you'll see years and years worth of firewood and maybe a few houses worth of good wood laying rotting or pushed up into giant piles to burn. I've always believed a small milling operation could go in clean up behind the major players and make a fine living off of the scrap left behind. Years ago my family went up every year and collected truck loads of wood for the winters. They do their best to stop this now in most areas.

The pictures of mountains of good wood not quite perfect for export would be a PR disaster for the industry and our government.

As critical as I am to the industry, I also make my living in it so I'm not some tree hugger wanting to save the forests. I just don't like the rampant waste.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('frankthetank', '
')I guess if we all lived in squalor slums and didn't have any money, the planet would be better off.