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THE Thunder Horse Thread (merged)

General discussions of the systemic, societal and civilisational effects of depletion.

Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby joewp » Wed 07 Feb 2007, 16:11:40

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DantesPeak', 'H')ayward also said the start-up of Atlantis, another Gulf of Mexico project, is now due by the end of 2007. The company had previously said production was scheduled to start in the second half of the year. The platform's planned capacity is 200,000 barrels of oil and 180 million cubic feet of gas a day.
About Thunder Horse, Hayward said "it will happen." The project is now three years behind the original schedule. Thunder Horse is "something that hasn't been done before...We probably pushed the technology envelope a little bit too far," he added.
Hayward said the new guidance, more cautious than previously announced, was largely due to supply-chain issues, with the oil services sector now running at full tilt. "There was no new incident. It's just recognizing the reality of the industry today," he said.

So how much does this take off the expected production increases this year that were supposed to offset depletion in old fields? 450,000 barrels a day altogether? Now they won't be pumping until next year (or next decade, if the trend of delays continues).
Like many have said, all the cheap, easy oil is gone. It's probably a good bet we'll never see jackshit from Jack 2. But in their collective delusion, the mainstream economy keeps buying houses farther from work, buying new SUVs and generally tries to find new ways to waste energy.
When it hits the fan, it's going to hit hard, I think.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby AirlinePilot » Wed 07 Feb 2007, 17:34:14

I have to agree with you Joe. It's almost macabe the dance we are doing. The daily analyst story, the constant delays. There is just so much out there pointing in the wrong direction. How could it be so that just a few of us can actually see the massive wreck coming?

Some times I wonder about that. While I hope for a slow slide it just doesnt look like it will play out that way. As for timing its anyones guess, but i see the whole thing like an avalanche. Once it lets lose, its going to be large and there will be no stopping it.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby seldom_seen » Wed 07 Feb 2007, 17:44:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('seahorse2', 'I')t makes one wonder whether the new "JacK" discovery will ever amount to anything.

The "Jack" discovery has produced a bonanza of press releases and PR for the cornucopian cargo cult. That will be the sum of its output. Otherwise, that oil may as well be on the moon.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby joewp » Wed 07 Feb 2007, 18:00:42

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AirlinePilot', 'I') have to agree with you Joe. It's almost macabe the dance we are doing. The daily analyst story, the constant delays. There is just so much out there pointing in the wrong direction. How could it be so that just a few of us can actually see the massive wreck coming?
Some times I wonder about that. While I hope for a slow slide it just doesnt look like it will play out that way. As for timing its anyones guess, but i see the whole thing like an avalanche. Once it lets lose, its going to be large and there will be no stopping it.

I think people don't want to know. Just the other night I was telling someone about Cantarell being down half a million barrels over the last year and they brushed it off, they didn't even ask what it meant. People really think the tar sands in Alberta are going to give us "energy independence" and don't think much past that. They're only worried about their next fill-up, just like addicts. It's like we're on a collective high that masks reality and don't want to come down.

I think that's typical, look at Easter Island, statues were stopped in mid-construction and tools were just left on the ground. "Normal life" just went on until it couldn't anymore.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby nth » Wed 07 Feb 2007, 18:07:45

BP is just plain screwing up. Shell, Chevron, and Exxon are able to get back to at least 90% after the hurricane.

From what we know so far, Thunder Horse would be delay even if no hurricane came through. For some reason, the other oil majors were able to secure their required resources. As for Jack, if they ever decide to do the go ahead, I am sure it will be a category 4 safe FSPO. Also, they may just move the ship if hurricanes are too much a threat like they do for ice bergs in Arctic.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby DantesPeak » Wed 07 Feb 2007, 18:11:22

This is the first news on Jack in some time, apparently further development of Jack has not yet been “sanctioned”. Previously we have learned in December(?) that absolutely nothing will be going on at the Jack #2 site for at least six months.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')P Alert - Energy 7 Feb 2007 OK DevonEnergy Q4ern 02 07
Devon and its co-owners conducted a successful production test of the deepwater Jack No. 2 well in the Gulf of Mexico's Lower Tertiary Trend. During the test, the Jack No. 2 flowed at a sustained rate of 6,000 barrels of oil per day from approximately 40 percent of the total net pay measured in the well. The successful production test was an important milestone in moving the Jack project toward sanctioning and development. Devon has a 25 percent working interest in the Jack prospect.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby seahorse2 » Wed 07 Feb 2007, 18:13:45

If they describe Thunderhorse as "pushing the envelope" how will they describe the development of Jack? At the time Jack was in the news, they were talking about not only the depth of recovery which had never been done, but they weren't exactly sure how or what to put the oil into when they pumped it up from 20K feet.

Its definitely the end of cheap oil but, for all practical purposes, it may be the end of oil if we can't get it out of the ground in sufficient amounts to satisfy demand.

Further, with BP down etc., there is growing evidence we are getting ever closer to the significant "crossover" event where nonopec production plateaus or falls and is overtaken by Opec production.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby nth » Wed 07 Feb 2007, 18:38:07

Chevron is the operator of Jack.
They have their resources tied up in other GoM fields. Tahiti is the main one. This will be their main hub for further deep water production. Fields like Jack will be tied back to Tahiti.
Basically, Walker Ridge and Green Canyon will be tied back to Tahiti.

It will be interesting to see which one Chevron will green light on next for the Walker Ridge and Green Canyon area. There are several fields for them to go after. Jack is the least explore one, but probably holds more potential in my opinion. Big Foot had a few sidetracks done. I am not geologist or expert, but I think Jack will not be next on the list.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby DantesPeak » Thu 08 Feb 2007, 10:59:30

Jack #2, after laying covered in the dark murky depths of the Gulf of Mexico for a year or so, will be revisited by Chevron later in the this year:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A') second delineation well will be drilled at the Chevron Corp. (CVX)-led Jack project in the second half of 2007, Hadden said. Jack serves as the bellwether for the exploitation potential of the lower Tertiary trend, a rich hydrocarbons layer buried deep beneath the Gulf's subsoil.
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby Leanan » Thu 08 Feb 2007, 20:26:00

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('nth', ' ')From what we know so far, Thunder Horse would be delay even if no hurricane came through.

Very true. I think the issue with Thunder Horse is that it's so damned deep. They're dealing with problems we never knew existed. This article is from August 2006: Thunder Horse Delay Due to Subsea Manifold Cracks There's some speculation that the extreme pressure is to blame - that it may be causing problems the engineers did not anticipate. This is what Deffeyes meant, when he said the second half of the oil will be much harder to extract than the first half.
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Thunderhorse

Unread postby Aaron » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 09:37:32

link
A friend who works this project told me yesterday that the recent delays announced for this project are the result of problems with much of the infrastructure. Apparently, technical difficulties have forced them to disassemble the active drilling components... ship them back to the mainland to be retooled or replaced.

Basically they are going to rebuild much of the drilling apparatus due to mechanical failures associated with the depth of this project. 2008 is now their best guess for beginning to produce oil. (I think that's irresponsibly optimistic myself)

This neatly illustrates the problems associated with finding & exploiting less conventional resources. The oil is there, it's just damn hard to get to it. ... & it's expensive.

I see this as yet another confirmation that big oil understands very well about peak oil & is turning to increasingly difficult to extract resources. The older petrologist's I know laugh at these kinds of projects... hearkening back to the glory days of wild cats when truly giant discoveries were made.

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Re: Thunderhorse

Unread postby skyemoor » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 09:49:09

I wonder how much of this is also related to hurricane damage? I still find significant irony in the possible involvement of AGW-induced storms limiting our access to more AGW feedstock...
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Re: Thunderhorse

Unread postby Kingcoal » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 11:21:26

We all know that the thunderhorse story will be a more and more common one in the future.
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Re: Thunderhorse

Unread postby mekrob » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 11:40:18

Rigzone reports that Thunderhorse (250kpd) and Atlantis (200kpd) are both delayed. Thunderhorse until the end of 2008. So now we have two more years for more delays for Thunderhorse.
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Re: Thunderhorse

Unread postby DantesPeak » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 12:36:12

Aaron, I read something similar to what you said near the end of last summer. Therefore I knew it was a lie for them to say they could have got it back up and running before well into 2008 – at best.

Considering that there are strict rules made by the SEC to prevent inaccurate forward projections and forecasts, one wonders why they are lying. My own opinion is that they are doing this to show they are doing something important for the country. Therefore they are undeserving of further 'windfall profits' and other kinds of new taxes. As some of you know by reading the Weekly Inventory thread, there was a new 'inventory' tax put into effect last year on 75% of the unrealized gain on oil inventories (but this only applies to large oil companies).
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Re: Thunderhorse

Unread postby nth » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 15:24:07

I don't think they purposely lie about this. This sort of thing goes on even for non-oil projects like software or hardware or even airplane production. Project planners and engineers disagree constantly on when projects will get completed with planners pushing the envelope.

As for the end of cheap oil, does anyone know any oil company who publicly states that cheap oil will return in the future? The only oil expert that I heard such nonsense is from CERA, which puzzles me as their papers do not claim as such, but Yergin is always quoted saying that he won't be surprise to see oil prices fall. &*(&^#$
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Re: Thunderhorse

Unread postby Leanan » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 16:01:45

Seems like the extreme pressure may be causing problems that were not anticipated by the engineers.
"The problems of today will not be solved by the same thinking that produced the problems in the first place." - Albert Einstein
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Re: Atlantis, Thunder Horse Platforms Delayed Again

Unread postby nth » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 16:17:22

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DantesPeak', ' ') Rigzone

I did not know Devon would spill the beans. Chevron is going to give a very indepth presentation next month about all their oil projects and resources including ships and where they are drilling. Hopefully, we can post some of their discussions.
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Re: Thunderhorse

Unread postby Aaron » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 16:36:29

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Leanan', 'S')eems like the extreme pressure may be causing problems that were not anticipated by the engineers.

That's exactly what I was told... & it pretty much means rebuilding. I don't see how they can possibly begin pumping by end of year 08 if that's the case.
The problem is, of course, that not only is economics bankrupt, but it has always been nothing more than politics in disguise... economics is a form of brain damage.

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Re: Thunderhorse

Unread postby grabby » Sun 11 Feb 2007, 20:18:01

Look up "Able Archer 83" on wikipedia. interestingly it is the topic for today, kind of interesting. Remember today we have even quicker and more accurate tools than the one that gave them the worries last time.
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