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Gender Relations East and West

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General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby Ayame » Sun 26 Nov 2006, 10:59:49

There is a big difference between making sure your rights are protected and the attitude 'everything for me and my group and the rest be damned'.

It seems to me Kylon that sadly you have fallen into the type of thinking that you find so digusting from the other group. Is that not slightly hypocritical?
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby AWPrime » Sun 26 Nov 2006, 14:01:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kylon', 'I') just don't like it when feminist try and rig the system by modifying educational curriculums against men

examples?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')or make laws that are incredibly biased against men.

Such as?
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby coyote » Sun 26 Nov 2006, 14:56:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('AWPrime', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kylon', 'I') just don't like it when feminist try and rig the system by modifying educational curriculums against men

examples?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')or make laws that are incredibly biased against men.

Such as?

Exactly. Show us what you're talking about.

I think we've got a long long ways to go before men's status is seriously threatened. We just picked up our very first female speaker of the house. Ever. Took us well over two centuries. How ridiculous is that?

Pre-historical societies seem to have been largely matriarchal. I personally wouldn't mind -- the world might just be a much better place.

And I'm not just saying that 'cause there are chicks in the thread. 8)

"If women ran the world we wouldn't have wars, just intense negotiations every 28 days." -- Robin Williams.
Lord, here comes the flood
We'll say goodbye to flesh and blood
If again the seas are silent in any still alive
It'll be those who gave their island to survive...
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby Loki » Sun 26 Nov 2006, 16:22:06

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('coyote', 'P')re-historical societies seem to have been largely matriarchal.

Wrong. This is a myth perpetuated by certain feminist ideologues, but like many of their claims, it is blissfully unanchored in historical fact.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') personally wouldn't mind -- the world might just be a much better place.

Never worked in a place where women run the show, have you? Believe me, they're no better than men, just sneakier.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kylon', 'I') have actually been able to converse quite politely with other males about this subject. It's only when females are around that males become all pro-feminist. They generally do this in order to try and raise their image in front of women and show that they aren't anti-feminist.

The male "feminists" I've met are generally dogs looking to get laid. They talk a good game, but it's all about the poontang.

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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby Benzin » Sun 26 Nov 2006, 16:29:28

Male or female, any person has the potential to do good and/or bad things.

'Nuff said.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby coyote » Sun 26 Nov 2006, 17:01:58

Gideon and Loki: Upon quick research, the studies I had in mind appear to have been debunked. The sacred status of Earth Mother dieties in ancient societies does not necessarily imply social status for women in same. Thanks for the correction.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Sun 26 Nov 2006, 19:30:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Loki', '
')The male "feminists" I've met are generally dogs looking to get laid. They talk a good game, but it's all about the poontang.


For real, dog.

I think men's frustration stems from seeking the kind of unconditional love they got from their mothers. They seek someone who loves them for intrinstic reasons, who they are as opposed to what they do, etc. Like the love a mother has for thier child.

I believe a man's "love" is deeper, more heartfelt and more meaningful than a woman's "love", based on the simple fact that his position is the more desperate. In the realm of sexual politics, women have always ruled, and will forever rule. Women have sex, men need it.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby Doly » Mon 27 Nov 2006, 10:08:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BlisteredWhippet', 'I') believe a man's "love" is deeper, more heartfelt and more meaningful than a woman's "love", based on the simple fact that his position is the more desperate.


Taking into account that it's almost always the woman who cares for the children, and if the couple separates the woman is usually left in the difficult position of taking care for both herself and her children, I'd say there's a good argument that the woman's position is the more desperate one.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby BlisteredWhippet » Mon 27 Nov 2006, 21:04:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Doly', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BlisteredWhippet', 'I') believe a man's "love" is deeper, more heartfelt and more meaningful than a woman's "love", based on the simple fact that his position is the more desperate.


Taking into account that it's almost always the woman who cares for the children, and if the couple separates the woman is usually left in the difficult position of taking care for both herself and her children, I'd say there's a good argument that the woman's position is the more desperate one.


Why, if she can simply trade sex for another man? The man is still redundant and replaceable. Women's love does not collapse as readily into outright need.

Forget kids. Kids are an entirely seperate issue. Regardless of whether kids are in the picture or not, sex is still something she has, and he does not. And besides, children and childbirth are wholly her decision. Women have all the power in the realms of sex and reproduction today. In the past, social and cultural forces moved to check this power.

She "has" the kids more than he does, AND the sex.

The Queen is the most powerful piece on the Chessboard. You could define the mating ritual from the male perspective as a temporary ruse to fool a female into believing a particular suitor is more intrinsically valuable than any other suitor... mirroring a basic chess strategy where you attempt to maneuver an opponent into trading away his Queen in exchange for less powerful pieces.

Look at Kylon's mating strategy. Know any females whose reproductive strategy encompasses an effort that shapes their whole lives? Men have to plan and execute complex strategies of seduction. This is not something most women do. Why would they? If Men had something they needed comparable to a man's need for sex, then the situation would be different... but it isn't.

Go ahead, try and poke more holes in my theory. :lol:

l'homme propose, la femme dispose.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Mon 27 Nov 2006, 21:22:57

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BlisteredWhippet', '
')l'homme propose, la femme dispose.
Under my thumb
The girl who once had me down
Under my thumb
The girl who once pushed me around

Its down to me
The difference in the clothes she wears
Down to me, the change has come,
Shes under my thumb

Aint it the truth babe?

Under my thumb
The squirmin dog whos just had her day
Under my thumb
A girl who has just changed her ways

Its down to me, yes it is
The way she does just what shes told
Down to me, the change has come
Shes under my thumb
Ah, ah, say its alright

Under my thumb
A siamese cat of a girl
Under my thumb
Shes the sweetest, hmmm, pet in the world

Its down to me
The way she talks when shes spoken to
Down to me, the change has come,
Shes under my thumb
Ah, take it easy babe
Yeah

Its down to me, oh yeah
The way she talks when shes spoken to
Down to me, the change has come,
Shes under my thumb
Yeah, it feels alright

Under my thumb
Her eyes are just kept to herself
Under my thumb, well i
I can still look at someone else

Its down to me, oh thats what I said
The way she talks when shes spoken to
Down to me, the change has come,
Shes under my thumb
Say, its alright.

Say its all...
Say its all...

Take it easy babe
Take it easy babe
Feels alright
Take it, take it easy babe
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby Ayame » Tue 28 Nov 2006, 05:04:11

Blistered Whippet, you make it sound like all women are scheming harlots and all men are led wholely by their dicks. Thankfully some of us have integrity. You know what they say though about projecting your internal world/past experiences onto everyone else? Maybe your just hanging out in the wrong neighbourhood.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Tue 28 Nov 2006, 07:04:17

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BlisteredWhippet', 'I') think men's frustration stems from seeking the kind of unconditional love they got from their mothers. They seek someone who loves them for intrinstic reasons, who they are as opposed to what they do, etc. Like the love a mother has for thier child.
What kind of Beaver Cleaver family did you grow up in?
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Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
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I lost my way" - OCMS
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby mercurygirl » Tue 28 Nov 2006, 12:56:20

"The desire of the man is for the woman, but the desire of the woman is for the desire of the man."

- Anne Louise Germaine de Stael
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby Kylon » Tue 28 Nov 2006, 15:35:37

I don't think that Blistered Whippet is saying is that men need women more than women based off of their sexual needs, and women have virtually all the power in this realm.

The whole "scheming harlots" and "men led by their dicks" is a rather crude simplification of things. You can have integrity and have needs at the same time. If someone is great they can have a desire for reproduction as well, they can need to reproduce.

As far as the whole "scheming harlots" I don't believe Blistered Whippet ever said anything about them scheming, in fact I believe he said that in contrast to men, whose reproductive strategy might encompass his entire life, a woman doesn't even need to do that, due to the enormous need that men have of women.

So I don't believe he was implying that women are scheming harlots, but rather than men have to scheme in order to effectively get a woman.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby ohanian » Tue 28 Nov 2006, 20:07:28

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ayame', 'B')listered Whippet, you make it sound like all women are scheming harlots and all men are led wholely by their dicks. Thankfully some of us have integrity. You know what they say though about projecting your internal world/past experiences onto everyone else? Maybe your just hanging out in the wrong neighbourhood.


Let's put it this way.

An unmarried woman wants the "best" man that she can marry.

An unmarried man wants the "best" woman that he can get.

In this sense, both type are scheming and denigrating those that they have rejected as unsuitable material.
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Tue 28 Nov 2006, 21:25:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Shannymara', 'I') feel sorry for anyone of either gender who believes women don't need sex.
that's the point of the Rolling Stones post. men and women dance differently on the DNA strings, but we all dance nonetheless. I posted a couple years ago about the aged Roman who was asked if he didn't miss the sex of his youth. He answered, on the contrary, that he was glad to be free at last. There was a career con artist from the early 20th Century who remarked that men were all insane all the time except for a few minutes after coitus. Here's an interesting question: is age more merciful to men or women?
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 01:02:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gideon', ' ')Working for women is a nightmare.
I think it's a really tough thing for women figuring out the boss role. The flip side of your experience is a syndrome I refer to as "bastards in pantyhose". My last boss was a great example of this. This was at Planned Parenthood (a 501c3 non-profit). They took over our clinic and within a couple of months doubled the prices for patients, began refusing to take medicaid, and started wasting truckloads of money on frivilous administrative crap. They turned a previously profitable clinic into a $20K per month loss. The CEO absolutely would not listen to anyone. Didn't care about staff. Didn't care about patients. Just interested in ruling her little fifedom with an iron fist. She had everybody else in the organization so cowwed that they just did what she said without questioning. Yes mamm. No mamm. Three bags full. Me and my partner were basically disinclined to be bullied and more importantly were disinclined to watch our patients get screwed. We tried to fight her on stuff, so one day she fired the entire staff of our clinic except one person (The one that was willing to suck up to her.)

I think that's what happens when women in positions of power try too hard to avoid being seen as "emotional".
"We were standing on the edges
Of a thousand burning bridges
Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
The way things were before
I lost my way" - OCMS
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 02:32:18

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gideon', ' ') The women bosses that I had were less direct with what they wanted done. I always got the impression that I had to be a bit of a mind reader. I'd get "why isn't that done?" Because I didn't know you wanted it done, is why. Of course I wanted it done.

With coarse jerk guy I'd get "have the memo done by tomorrow 8 am."
One huge difference in the way women and men interact is the hierarchy thing. When men are interacting with other men there is almost always a hierarchy. Someone is in charge giving orders. Someone else is subordinate-recieving orders. When you played army as a boy, someone was in charge...you may have squabled about who it was...but someone was in charge.

Women, by in large, don't interact that way. With women, things are generally much more collaborative. When girls are playing house, the decisions tend to be much more collaborative and influencing them is a much subtler process of persuasion.

Your perception was that your boss wasn't clear in what she wanted you to do. I would be willing to bet that hers was that you didn't listen when she told you what she wanted done. A woman is unlikely to thunder into your office and say "Have this paper on my desk by 8 am." To do so would be seen by other women as overbearing. A woman is much more likely to say something like "We need to get this project done by tommorrow" and assume that you will infer when your part needs to be done or ask if you aren't sure. If you're waiting for someone to call you to attention and give you an order, you're going to totally miss out on what's going on.

You say you don't like people being in positions of power over you. Well...that's the big potential advantage of working for a woman. If you pay attention and figure out what needs to be done, things are probably going to be a lot less hierarchical. The down side is that requires more attentiveness, thought, and initiative on your part and maybe asking some questions if you aren't sure. "Say Suzy...you said we need to complete the project tommorrow. What part of that can I help with? The memo? Sure. When would be a good time for that to be done? 8am. No problem. We'll get it done."
"We were standing on the edges
Of a thousand burning bridges
Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
The way things were before
I lost my way" - OCMS
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby Ayame » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 03:11:24

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', ' ')I posted a couple years ago about the aged Roman who was asked if he didn't miss the sex of his youth. He answered, on the contrary, that he was glad to be free at last.


There is always the other way :lol:
Buddhist monk cuts off penis, renounces refix
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Re: Gender Relations East and West

Unread postby mercurygirl » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 13:34:57

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Gideon', ' ')From my perspective, however, I'd rather dig ditches for 5 bucks an hour than spend my time making up for the aggravating inability to communicate of others - whether they are male or female.


You sound just like my husband. :lol:

Running through your post is the idea that your way of communicating is superior and any other way is inability to communicate. This is far from the truth, that being that there are many different styles of communication. If you spent a little time discovering them and seeing them as just different instead of inferior, you'd put others at ease and save yourself much frustration.


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BlisteredWhippet', 'I') think men's frustration stems from seeking the kind of unconditional love they got from their mothers. They seek someone who loves them for intrinstic reasons, who they are as opposed to what they do, etc.


Hmm. I thought that's how we loved. I could not care less what a man does, maybe that's just me. I'm always turned off by a person who always has to trot out their accomplishments.
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