[Jack]

Who says peak oil can't be fun?

The term "ford excursion" isn't popular - but SUV is roughly as important as global warming, and both are still above peak oil.

I am reminded of the linux security tools distribution - or, if you prefer, linux STD. Just the thing for computers.

[greenworm]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'l')inux security tools distribution

[Jack]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('greenworm', 'T')hat is a misnomer if there ever was one. Laughing

[Aaron]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'J')ust don’t forget, for every 5 miles per hour you slow down, on a 100 mile trip, you waste over 9 minutes of your life driving. If you’re not driving for the pleasure of driving, that waste of your life adds up. Drive 12,000 miles a year? You’ve wasted over 20 hours of your life for each 5mph you slow down.

And by turning off and restarting your car, you are shortening its lifespan. Don’t forget, it takes energy to build a car, a lot of energy. One study actually showed that the total lifetime energy used by a Hummer is actually less than the total energy used by a Prius - that’s counter-intuitive, but the combination of the energy required to construct the Prius with more exotic materials, the significantly longer useful lifespan of the Hummer, and the significantly higher energy cost of recycling the exotic materials in the Prius resulted in a Hummer being a more responsible vehicle to drive than a Prius. Now, by shorting the lifespan of your car, you’ll have to replace it sooner, and the build energy of a new one, and the recycling energy of the one you destroyed before its time, will significantly outweigh any energy savings you got by shutting it off, and will likely outweigh the cost savings as well.
So, keep your tires properly inflated, reduce drag when you can, don’t carry excess weight unless you expect snow, and don’t drive a hybrid.

[gnm]

lifespan of the vehicle? Now thats reaching but ok, I drive a 20 year old VW. Thats gotta blow the shorts off the hummer even.

Wow I feel so greeeeeeeeeeeennnnn...

-G

[Aaron]

Jevon peaks around the corner & smiles...

[Zardoz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '.')..One study actually showed that the total lifetime energy used by a Hummer is actually less than the total energy used by a Prius...

[ChumpusRex2]

This is the CNW Marketing Research, Inc. study. As I recall, they don't give a very good description of their methods.

In fact, the Hummer v Prius comparison isn't the only odd result.

This is the same study that suggests that a basic Honda Accord is more energy efficient than a basic Honda Civic.

I can think of no reason why this should actually be the case.

[PeakOiler]

Well Aaron, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. If I save energy, it's beyond my control if someone else uses it. Conservation of energy is important if you don't have much available. And so learning conservation skills are important to learn now, and those tips and tricks post peak will be important if one wishes for a "slow crash", because crash we will, imo.
As some have pointed out, a vehicle Total Cost of Ownership (TCO) is often the best way to compare vehicle types.
Aaron: Do you own a Hummer? Care to give us some hard data?
Anyone? Does anyone actually determine your vehicle TCO?
Well, here's mine. I put all the data into a spreadsheet, took awhile, but now it's easy to keep updated.

For my 2003 Honda Insight, bought new at the end of July, 2003, here are the numbers, taken from all the receipts and statements and last updated on 9/14/06:
Car payments: 60%
Interest: 8%
Maintenance: 9%
License Fees and Taxes: 5%
Insurance: 9%
Gasoline: 9%
Total spent so far: $27,836.45
Miles driven: 75,848 (I have a long commute.)
Cost/mile: $0.37
Cost/day: $24.23
Gallons gasoline burnt up: 1,317.853
Lifetime mpg: 56.6 (slightly better than the EPA estimate, btw)

Anyone else want to share your data?
I'd like to see some real data from a Hummer owner, or a Prius owner.
gnm: do your homework: give us your TCO for your VW.
I wish I didn't have to drive at all, but there ya go, wish I had learned about PO long ago.
Move closer to work? I only have two mortgage payments left...
Not yet, if ever...
Please don't slam me too hard.

[mrobert]

I remember reading this :
"It's not how much it costs, but how much can you save, by purchasing it".
Quotes from the site:
"You save more gas by turning off and restarting your car than you do by idling for a minute."
Sure. And compare the "damage" caused to the engine, starting motor and such, to the cost of gas for idling, and see where that adds up. Plus you reduce the lifespan of your car battery.
Check this out:
Every day in this stupid city I live in, I see people turning off their engines. The lights turn green, and until he starts his piece of junk, 20 cars idle 10 seconds behind him ... or habe to wait until the next green light.
So.
Whatever he saved, the other wasted N fold.

[rwwff]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PeakOiler', 'T')otal spent so far: $27,836.45
Miles driven: 75,848 (I have a long commute.)
Cost/mile: $0.37
Cost/day: $24.23
Gallons gasoline burnt up: 1,317.853
Lifetime mpg: 56.6 (slightly better than the EPA estimate, btw)
Anyone else want to share your data?

[Vexed]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PeakOiler', 'W')ell Aaron, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. If I save energy, it's beyond my control if someone else uses it. Conservation of energy is important if you don't have much available. And so learning conservation skills are important to learn now, and those tips and tricks post peak will be important if one wishes for a "slow crash", because crash we will, imo.
Perhaps conservation is the way of the future but
As some have pointed out, a vehicle Total Cost of Ownership (TCO) is often the best way to compare vehicle types. ...

[Vexed]

I hadn't read your post yet rwwff when I posted mine.
The guy I bought my car from was sure $10.00 was also the screwing point.
Poor guy.
Bad timing.

[NEOPO]

Jevon says that unless everyone gets on board - resistance is futile and we may as well bow down to the Borg!
Jevon also says that unless you put your savings under your mattress OR OTHER and wait for inflation to consume them then your savings will only be used by our system to create more economy and thereby use more and more energy.

My plan is to PLAN on not driving, not working a "normal" job and otherwise not doing what has gotten us into this mess.

Jevon also says I am a fool and will ultimately have to fight off starving hordes attacking my garden.
My only hope is that my faux silk garden trap will work and that my trigger finger won't fail me

[Omnitir]

Resistance is futile. As much as the big car manufacturers want to convince people that their monstrosities are better in the long run, and us much as peak oil pessimists try to support the big car manufacturers with Jevon’s flawed theory, cultural inertia will still have it’s way. Fuel efficient vehicles will continue to grow in popularity and through economies of scale the “more exotic materials” that these vehicles use will become commonplace. It won’t take long for hybrids and even all-electrics to become the norm and the most energy efficient vehicles overall.

Big oil, big auto and certain peak oil pessimists can resist all they want, but they can’t stop our march towards high-tech sustainability. Resistance is futile.

[max_power29]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NEOPO', '.')
My only hope is that my faux silk garden trap will work and that my trigger finger won't fail me

[Frank]

If you look at the thread, that quote was a comment by a poster.

rwwff: our '03 Sienna gets 24-25 mpg; you must not be wasting as much of your life as I am!

p.s.: our Prius has averaged 60 mpg all summer with all different kinds of driving...

[rwwff]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Vexed', 'I') hadn't read your post yet rwwff when I posted mine.
The guy I bought my car from was sure $10.00 was also the screwing point.
Poor guy.
Bad timing.

[rwwff]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Frank', 'r')wwff: our '03 Sienna gets 24-25 mpg; you must not be wasting as much of your life as I am!

[Denny]

It looks like GM is now focusing on the "red staters" for their marketing efforts. See Huffington Post

General Motors has signed on Fox News host Sean Hannity as the new face of GM's latest car giveaway campaign, called "The Sean Hannity 'You're a Great American' Car Giveaway." ...The Hannity-hire comes in conjunction with GM's new patriotic-themed ad campaign for the new Chevrolet Silverado, complete with an anthem by John Mellencamp called "Our Country," echoed by the slogan: "Our country. Our truck." Per ThinkProgress: "The first spot features images from American history and recent events, including Rosa Parks and hurricane-damaged homes." Interesting way to sell cars, that.

...ThinkProgress points out some rather, er, blue-state unfriendly positions, which begs the question of whether GM is writing off liberal buyers of cars

"Our country, our truck"? Doesn't have a great ring to it. a dopey slogan if you ask me.