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THE Impeachment Thread (merged)

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Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby gw » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 19:28:44

This week, the Senate is planning to quietly hold a vote that would pardon President Bush for breaking the law by illegally wiretapping innocent Americans without warrants. According to Senator Leahy, the bill would "...immunize officials who have violated federal law by authorizing such illegal activities."

President Bush broke the law, and courts are starting to agree. Judiciary Committee Chairman Arlen Specter once said the program was illegal "on its face." But he has now caved to pressure from Vice President Cheney, and introduced legislation that marks a new low: the bill justifies everything the president did. Worse, it makes it legal to wiretap Americans, in secret, without warrants or oversight, whenever the administration wants to.

So far, Democrats and some Republicans are holding strong against the bill, and there are good chances to stop it if enough of us speak up.

Can you sign the petition opposing the Republican move to pardon President Bush for breaking the law?

Petition against pardoning Bush for breaking the Law

See Wiretapping and Surveillance at chimpeach.info for details on how the US goverment is illegally spying on ordinary Americans.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rwwff » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 19:50:40

Republicans have no interest in pardon'ing Bush. Please provide at least a hint of evidence that someone on the right is interested in going there.

Sounds more like a lefty attempt to divert attention from the fact that Pelosi and Co would be forced to make the attempt to impeach the president by their hard core base.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rogerhb » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 19:53:33

How about strap him into ol' sparky?
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rwwff » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 20:03:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', 'H')ow about strap him into ol' sparky?


Sparky's been retired.
We poison'em now... nice and slowwwwww.

edit: referencing Texas Death Row...
Last edited by rwwff on Mon 18 Sep 2006, 22:05:55, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby gw » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 20:04:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', 'R')epublicans have no interest in pardon'ing Bush. Please provide at least a hint of evidence that someone on the right is interested in going there.


Yes, here is an article on what the Republicans are up to:
"Today's Republican circus trick: Legislating in the Dark," Senator Leahy, provided by the Bill of Rights Defense Committee, September 13, 2006

More references can be found here:
http://www.chimpeach.info/OpposePardonBushPetition.html
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rwwff » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 20:06:25

That isn't a pardon, its political cover for Senators whose constituents demand that they support the president's surveilance activities.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby gego » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 20:20:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', 'H')ow about strap him into ol' sparky?


What, and waste the electricity? I bet you drive an SUV too.

Hanging is more traditional for treason.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby gw » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 20:33:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', 'T')hat isn't a pardon, its political cover for Senators whose constituents demand that they support the president's surveilance activities.


If terrorist actions require us to make fundamental changes to our rights under the Fourth Amendment of the Constitution, then the terrorists are winning.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby NEOPO » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 20:33:37

clinton for a blowjob and bush for wiretapping......
How about something more substantial like lets say....... the lies about WMD/Iraq?
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rwwff » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 20:34:26

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NEOPO', 'c')linton for a blowjob and bush for wiretapping......
How about something more substantial like lets say....... the lies about WMD/Iraq?


Lieing isn't illegal. If it was, we'd have to hang'em all.

edit: referencing conviction of a capital crime like treason..
Last edited by rwwff on Mon 18 Sep 2006, 22:07:38, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rogerhb » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 20:42:00

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gego', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', 'H')ow about strap him into ol' sparky?


What, and waste the electricity? I bet you drive an SUV too.

Hanging is more traditional for treason.


You don't have to turn it on, just strap him into it, then throw the completed assembly off the Niagra falls.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby gego » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 21:57:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gego', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', 'H')ow about strap him into ol' sparky?


What, and waste the electricity? I bet you drive an SUV too.

Hanging is more traditional for treason.


You don't have to turn it on, just strap him into it, then throw the completed assembly off the Niagra falls.


Won't work. Dumping of garbage in a public waterway.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rogerhb » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 22:07:57

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gego', 'W')on't work. Dumping of garbage in a public waterway.


Okay, 'ang 'im then.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rwwff » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 22:10:46

It should be noted by the casual reader that we are discussing appropriate penalties to be used upon conviction of a capital offense such as treason.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby master_rb » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 22:33:28

NEOPO now you're talking, these are BS case, let's go for the biggies and show those idiots at the top that human lives are worth SOMETHING after all

very good point, in ether cases you mentioned nobody lost lives just some privacy and light stuff like that, but the war with so many killed and more on the horizont to be killed with no reason, there's a good reason to go after him
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby gw » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 23:05:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('master_rb', 'I')n ether cases you mentioned nobody lost lives just some privacy and light stuff like that, but the war with so many killed and more on the horizont to be killed with no reason, there's a good reason to go after him

Absolutely. Bush faces even more serious charges of breaking both domestic and international laws prohibiting "outrages upon personal dignity, in particular humiliating and degrading treatment" of prisoners. These are very serious charges - war crimes even.

Last week the Senate Armed Services Committee rebelled against his proposals to legalize human rights violations and passed their own measure for vote in the Senate instead.

Here is an excerpt from Countdown:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'K')eith Olbermann: "The president's rush - fury to get this done in only his way is not about getting new information, not about new threats but about somehow making the way we have been treating detainees retroactively ok? Is he covering his own backside with this?"

Jonathan Turley replied, "Quite frankly, there is evidence that he is." Turley feels that the administration is trying to get legislation passed as soon as possible because there is "a lot of trouble coming down this mountain." Turley said that the United States, and "specifically the President will be accused of a very serious violation of international law."

See the dossier on Torture and Detentions at chimpeach.info for more information about these serious crimes commited by the Bush administration.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby elocs » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 23:17:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gw', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', 'T')hat isn't a pardon, its political cover for Senators whose constituents demand that they support the president's surveilance activities.


If terrorist actions require us to make fundamental changes to our rights under the Fourth Amendment of the Constitution, then the terrorists are winning.


No, if actions by terrorists cause us to willing give up our rights under the Fourth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America, then they have already won. Bush took an oath, twice, to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States as it now exists. There was nothing in that oath that gave Bush the right to ignore the Constitution due to terrorism. The Constitution is not simply a bill he can amend with one of his many signing statements and follow it if he feels like it. The Constitution is now written in pencil so Bush may simply erase the portions he does not like, as much as he would love to do so. Isn't this timely since 18 September is Constitution Day. I am sure that Bush does not honor it and I doubt that he has ever read the Constitution (no pictures, not even of a pet goat).
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby rwwff » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 23:22:29

Bush would give the same sorta "but but.." arguments for his "interpretation" as Clinton gave for his of the 2nd. It would be interesting to see how many liberals can accept that some people feel as strongly about the 2nd as they might feel about the 4th. Even more interesting to see how many would respect those others by not stomping on the 2nd just because they don't find it particularly relavent or important.

I'm personally happier having the 4th trampled than the 2nd trampled, but I'd much prefer it if they'd both get the respect they deserve.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby elocs » Mon 18 Sep 2006, 23:45:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rwwff', 'B')ush would give the same sorta "but but.." arguments for his "interpretation" as Clinton gave for his of the 2nd. It would be interesting to see how many liberals can accept that some people feel as strongly about the 2nd as they might feel about the 4th. Even more interesting to see how many would respect those others by not stomping on the 2nd just because they don't find it particularly relavent or important.

I'm personally happier having the 4th trampled than the 2nd trampled, but I'd much prefer it if they'd both get the respect they deserve.


The amendments to the Constitution are a set, not a buffet where you can pick or choose what you like and disregard others. It's childish to claim that since you believe Clinton did not uphold the Second Amendment as you think he should have, it should be ok for Bush to abridge the Fourth Amendment. That's the kind or arument you would expect to get from your kids.

For those unfamiliar with the Second and Fourth Amendments, here they are:

Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.


Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Since it is apparently so easy to explain away the "well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state" clause of the Second Amendment I suppose it is just as simple a matter to explain away the entire Fourth Amendment. Don't kid yourself. Once they get the Fourth Amendment they will be back for the Second Amendment and they will be more than willing and happy to pry your gun from your cold, dead hands.
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Re: Pardon Bush for breaking the Law?

Unread postby coyote » Tue 19 Sep 2006, 00:30:11

At this point this guy is completely out of control. I've always looked to 2009 as the end of the political psychosis that's gripped the country this decade. But now, for the first time, I'm tasting fear.
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