[jeezlouise]

Sometimes you fight the good fight and still get your arse handed to you...

Link

I've been watching this story, and as both an urban farmer and a human being, boy this pisses me off.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ralph Horowitz', ' ')"If the farmers got a donation and said, `We got $50 million, would you sell it to us?' I would say no. Not a chance," Horowitz told the Los Angeles Times. "It's not about the money."

[vision-master]

Sorry, ain't thier land bucko.

[quizz]

Yeah, but the city offered to pay for it. Basically the guy is going to profit handsomely from what was a public owned property to begin with. But then I was also reading that the folks running the garden are pretty heavy handed and people have been booted out or intimidated (I'm just going from memory here). So there's alot to the story and I stopped following it. There is a CSA (Community Supported Agriculture) 3 miles from me. They have a great group of people. So I guess it can be a good thing, or it can go wrong, like anything else.

[the_sword]

Too bad they just didn't leave, that just taught everyother land owner never to allow urban farmers on private property because they won't be grateful, nor willing to leave when asked.

[jeezlouise]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vision-master', 'S')orry, ain't thier land bucko.

[MattSavinar]

Don't know if it was mentioined but the warehouse is going to be used primarily as to store goods destined for Wal Mart.

Best,

Matt

[canis_lupus]

If it wasn't their property to begin with, every argument that can be made for the farmers is irrelevant.

The guys sounds like he's a crotch, sure, but at the end of the day, it's his property, protected by the Constitution.

Unless, of course, you envision a socialist / communist state where governments or organizations that think they know better than the individual and can force folks to give up their property so they, the government or social group can do what they want with it.

This would not have made anyone's radar if it wasn't farming. I ride motocross and when I was younger, we'd find every bit of unloved property in the western suburbs of Chicago to turn into a motocross track. I wonder if I could have gotten Daryl Hannah to climb a tree for me when the cops kicked us out?

[MattSavinar]

Don't know if it was mentioined but the warehouse is going to be used primarily as to store goods destined for Wal Mart.

Also, the "good guys" in this are not a group likely to get sympathy from most AMericans. They are going to view them as a "bunch of freeloading mexican immigrants who get what they deserve!!!" Few people will make the connection between the urban farm and our impending energy disaster. Hence, not much of an uproar outside the hollywood elite who, quite frankly, will latch on to pretty much any cause likely to get them face time. (In this case, I'm glad they did though.)

If the "good guys" had been a group of white people who had put up a giant solar energy farm supplying cheap electricity to white homeowners in the suburbus, or a biodiesel plant provideing at cost fuel to white suv drivers, you'd have seen a much bigger uproar.

Just surf around the peak oil blogosphere. This story really hasn't recieved much coverage when you think about what it should be getting.

Best,

Matt

[FireJack]

This was even in the toronto star today, assuming this is the same place that celeberties were protecting. Its sad but the loss of this is nothing compared to the amount of forest that is lost everyday.

We (ie young people today) are going to pay for this capatilistic gread that grips this world. I expect the majority of people are going to be struggling to survive on a wasteland before this is over.

[MattSavinar]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('canis_lupus', 'I')f it wasn't their property to begin with, every argument that can be made for the farmers is irrelevant.

The guys sounds like he's a crotch, sure, but at the end of the day, it's his property, protected by the Constitution.

Unless, of course, you envision a socialist / communist state where governments or organizations that think they know better than the individual and can force folks to give up their property so they, the government or social group can do what they want with it.

This would not have made anyone's radar if it wasn't farming. I ride motocross and when I was younger, we'd find every bit of unloved property in the western suburbs of Chicago to turn into a motocross track. I wonder if I could have gotten Daryl Hannah to climb a tree for me when the cops kicked us out?

[Windmills]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('canis_lupus', 'U')nless, of course, you envision a socialist / communist state where governments or organizations that think they know better than the individual and can force folks to give up their property so they, the government or social group can do what they want with it.

[canis_lupus]

Matt -

First, let me dispense with the hero worship -- I think you have done more to advance the PO meme than anyone else I have run across. I think your message rings in its accessible tone. You are not a shrill scream but a reasonable conversation kin to that my friends and I have over drinks, and for that reason I believe your words stick a little bit more with mainstream America than some of your colleagues. For that reason, yours is the site I send newbies to first.

If you find yourself in the Chicago 'burbs, ping me and let's get some beer!

Had the land belonged to the city, ergo the taxpaying community, I'd line up in your corner. The town where I live has community garden plots which my mom and dad used to use until we bought land out of state and built a monster garden there. I think community farming and sustainable agriculture is a hell of a great idea as well as something that is so very, very, necessary.

Nuts to the city for selling it when they had a good thing going. If the group is organized, they could save the money they'd pay the lawyers ( ) and find some additional property nearby and make it their own. It's not the best solution but sometimes you have to make do.

If we cut the "peronsal property / common good" salami too thin it turns into a slippery slope, IMO, where everyone loses. Look at the case where the government evicted homeowners where they want to put retail space.

Have you been watching what's been going on with the greening of Detroit? Sustainable farming within city limits. Could the LA folks learn something from the Detroit folks?

I think the safest way to proceed it to raise public awareness and develop sustainable urban farming with the blessings of the cities. That means debate and democracy...which will take forever.

But do you really trust the government to provide solutions for us?

[gigacannon]

I've always had a problem with undeveloped land being bought and sold as a commodity. The land belongs to no-one.

On the other hand, there always is a need to zone land to manage the growth of a city. However, in this instance, I'd side with the farmers. An urban farm has many positive effects for the people living in the area, as a means of productive entertainment. You just can't justify the erection of another douchy warehouse on the site of some farmland, the existence of which is supported by locals. It just makes no civic sense.

[uNkNowN ElEmEnt]

If this guy has been letting them use the land for 8-9 years and loosing 30,000 a month doing so? I think he has contributed to his community sufficiently and should try and make some money back from it. That amounts to 8yrs at 30,000 a month =$2,880,000. ]

It would be nice if he then bought land elsewhere and did the same thing adding to the community for several years. but like someone else said, kinda, now that they've done the entitlement dance and invoked the media gods, I hope they go up in flames.

Now they have the experience they can go elsewhere or use container gardening and teach others. time to move on, welcome to the new world.

oh, and P.S. thanks for taking and taking (vegies and land etc) and not giving anything back yourselves in the unselfish spirit which gave to you the goods in the first place.

[ashurbanipal]

Maybe I'm off my nut here, but IIRC, the current owner purchased it from the city in a private auction for a small fraction of its actual value, even though the city had, in the past, knowingly allowed the people to use it. The farmers were not even notified of the impending potential sale until it was a done deal. Had they been, they might well have been able to do something. So while the ownership might be legal, it also stinks.

[jeezlouise]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('uNkNowN ElEmEnt', 'I')f this guy has been letting them use the land for 8-9 years and loosing 30,000 a month doing so? I think he has contributed to his community sufficiently and should try and make some money back from it.

[uNkNowN ElEmEnt]

So when is greed, greed or just a good deal? One of the previous posters said they'd been using it for 8-9 years so I guess I misunderstood and thought he'd owned it all this time. At least they got 8-9 years out of it.

Major shame to pave it over for a China-mart store warehouse though. Waht a waste.

[FairMaiden]

I know nothing about this issue...but that article said the guy paid $5 million and was going to sell a portion of it back to the farmers for $16 million...thus, making a hefty profit and still having the land for his warehouse. Sound pretty shady to me.

[holmes]

ahh yes the LA urban farm. Absolute sustainable living! Yes the poor and downtrodden. Yes a model for sustainability. A benchmark for the future!
Yet...
the supporters of this illegal immigrant commie haven are 100% in favor of wide open borders and unlimited population growth. Let em all in! Breed!
That beutiful kumbaya one world society! Aztlan!
The ones that rage against the machine as long as their pockets are not touched. Dismissing and promoting lunatic immigration and breeding rates. Changing our immigration laws!
Cant have your cake and eat it too lefties. There are some out here that see through your cheap facade and see the twisted half baked truths. Sorry!
But I admit its a hollow victory. More land added to the 2.2 million a year loss. Collapse is a given. LA is a death zone anyway. That farm will be overrun and ruined in the collapse anyway. Sad stuff.
commies and socialists love to spew as long as their cash is not being touched.
actually its a new hybrid breed now: capitalistsocialist.
one in the same!

[formandfile]

Im wondering what it took (in the way of inputs) to make land in the LA city core suitable for agriculture? Im also wondering what kind of toxic crap is in the soil to begin with that could possibly be passed on to the end consumers. Finally, it should be noted that argriculture is best suited to serve as a greenbelt buffer around the city instead of within it...it reinforces growth boundaries.