[EnergyUnlimited]

Hi guys,
And what about quantum vacuum phase transition?
We would certainly have enough (or even more than enough) energy from that.

[sch_peakoiler]

I think it is unwise to wipe this theory off as bullshit. I mean in the end the mainstream science can not explain the microworld either. According to quantum mechanics an electron is somethere outthere, and his whereabouts are unknown. Further, nobody has given a plausible answer of "what is between the nucleus and the electron, or what is between atoms"...

Anyway, this ether or vacuum theory may indeed be true.

What I do not believe, however, is the fact that a couple of con artists can make a device out of a tin can only using a solder-iron, which will convert the energy of the vacuum into electric energy... I mean I do not really believe it is possible - it is pretty obvious that this vacuum works on other layers of "existance" than our macro world, why should it be able to supply us with "human grade electricity". I mean, why would we expect, that the internal energy of the ether could be converted into electricity? Is this not the same as expecting the aliens from outside Milky Way have english as their mothertongue?

Most MEG websites state things like : I hit with a hammer on that empty beer can and now it has acquired the property of being able to tap the resources of the outerworld. Or... I rasped on that crow bar and now this crow bar is magic-micro-freakin-wave-device.

That is why I do not belive it in general. But I will never say the theory itself is bullshit or true, until it is explored and proven to be either.

I would rather say, it is a good working theory with maths behind it also, which has been misused by all kinds of conartists out there.

[Caoimhan]

All I can say is that I hear a lot of scientists saying, "WE don't understand it, so it couldn't possibly be real."

They say, "It APPEARS to us to violate our most precious of Laws - that of Conservation, so it must be snake-oil."

That's a lot of hubris.

Could it possibly be that the models that all these scientists have been learning are flawed? Could it be that most are not brave enough to think outside of their education box to contemplate a universe that behaves differently?

What if there is a dynamic quantum field in the universe? Anything that moves can possibly be tapped to harness that motion. Where there is force in motion, there can be work generated from that force.

I know the scientists ask, "If it's moving, then what is moving it?" Maybe it's leftover energy from the Big Bang, and it's so vast, we don't have to concern ourselves with the underlying source of that motion.

And yes, Tesla was marginalized. Most of the work that he gets credit for in our society was done by him before 1900. He spent nearly first half the of the 20th century experimenting with "radiant energy", that has only peripheral application to electro-magnetism.

Polyphase AC? Fluorescent Lighting? Radio? All of these important contributions of his were from his earliest work.

Even today, who hears the name Tesla except for perhaps Coast to Coast AM radio listeners in the middle of the night? Ask anyone who Edison was, and they can at least tell you he has something to do with electricity... his name in big bold letters on the electric company vans in my area. But we don't study Tesla in our history books, because... well, a lot of scientists thought he was a nutjob.

Oh, and from what I understand, there ARE a number of people who have built Tesla-esque devices and are running their homes on it. They just don't like to stick their necks out. If it's not the government or oil companies shutting them down, it's the rest of the alt-energy community who starts pointing fingers of "patent violation".

[EnergyUnlimited]

Regarding "Tesla devices" and patent violation.
Those patents are obviously so old, that they had expired long long time ago.
For this reason "violations" are legally impossible.
Those wonderful "energy out of nowhere" devices are neither there.

However many conspiracy theories are always around (and always will be).

[sch_peakoiler]

Caoimhan, the answer is yes to most of your questions. We people do not understand A LOT. Actually far more than we understand.

Yet I doubt that a kind of energy we can not feel, which does not really relate to our macroworld can be tapped by an "out of the garage device" build with a hammer, pliers, crucible and a solding iron.

[ChumpusRex2]

The mechanism of operation of the Bearden MEG is well known.

The key is incorrect measurement of the input power. In the prototype, he used a shunt resistor to measure currents - but accidentally performed his calculations with a misplaced decimal point in the value of the resistor.

Later versions, including some made by other 'inventors' such as jean Naudin, have made exactly the same mistake.

Some other versions, have failed to account for duty cycle on the measurement of average current/voltage and power.

[avo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('EnergyUnlimited', '
')And what about quantum vacuum phase transition?
We would certainly have enough (or even more than enough) energy from that.

[emailking]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('avo', '
')The good news is that you won't even see the wall coming before you get vaporized, because light signals from it will reach you just a tiny fraction of a second before the wall itself hits ...

[EnergyUnlimited]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('avo', '
')Except for the small problem that the bubble of true vacuum, expanding at near-light speed, would wipe out everything in its path, leaving behind a thin gas of new kinds of particles obeying laws of physics quite different than those that hold in our (false) vacuum.

[sch_peakoiler]

EnergyUnlimited,

cool post man! But you are forgetting one good point. Not only do those guys claim to have built tesla devices but also to have done that in a dirty garage with DIY tools:) And thats where it starts to get suspicious.:)

[Markos101]

Let's do a reality check here.

Firstly regarding our knowledge of Physics, Bearden is right in pointing out the inadequacy of Maxwell's equations in explaining Aharonov-Bohm effect. To understand it, you need to look at it at the (real) quantum level.

With regard the quantum level, one way of explaining how electrons flying past a solenoid (who's magnetic field is inside the magnetic material only, not outside of the solenoid) seemingly get deflected without travelling through a magnetic field is that the wavefunctions associated with each electron 'overlap' the B-field in the solenoid.

But there is also the fact that if one takes the Schrodinger equation, you obtain the magnetic vector potential (A) as a component of your resultant form of the Schodinger equation.

Note however, that no one in the whole of Physics actually knows why Schrodinger equation works. It basically takes a couple of experimental observations by de Broglie, and does some basic differential maths assumptions, and hey presto - the Schrodinger equation.

Not one situation has been found yet where Schrodinger equation does not agree with experimental observation. And that's about the size of human kind's most fantastic modern scientific achievement.

Also, can anyone explain why several highly qualified, highly trustworthy government defense workers with top secret clearance agree with Bearden, having studied government documents? Are these people just having a laugh? Who is more qualified to judge?

Also, I think you overestimate the 'magic' factor regarding machines that large company factories own to make goods. They are simply more compact and complex versions of simple electronic components - what other components could you use to investigate the behaviour electrons and magnets?

[Caoimhan]

Markos, you mention experimental observations by de Broglie being the basis of Shroedinger's equations, and that no one understands why they work.

This is the same thing that happened with Tesla. He was experimenting with high voltages of direct current through ultra thin wires (vaporizing the wire in a very short period of time), when he discovered a longitudinal "electrical" wave effect. Fine tuning it experimentally, he developed his "Radiant Energy".

A lot of people mistakenly believed that these experiments had something to do with high-frequency alternating current, which Tesla was very interested in, as well. But electricity and magnetism are both transverse waves in what Tesla perceived as the Aether.

When the concept of Aether went out of vogue in the realm of theoretical physics, people scoffed at Teslas hypotheses regarding these waves. Tesla's radiant energy violates a number of rules and theories by Hertz, and Maxwell's equations. And it behaves very differently than EM fields/waves.

Examples:
1. Radiant Energy is not inhibited by much at all, including faraday cages.
2. Radiant Energy doesn't follow the inverse square law in intensity.
3. Radiant Energy "sparks" are white, and are completely harmless, as opposed to the deadly blue sparks generated by electricity.
4. Radiant Energy does not flow longitudinally down wires, like electricty, nor does it propogate in lines of force like magnetism. It flows perpendicularly over copper wires.

As far as I am aware, the world of physics has yet to explain these phenomena with any kind of theory.

Tesla claimed that he had developed a Grand Unification Theory partially based on the observations made in working with Radiant Energy. Yet all his papers were confiscated by the U.S. Government right after his death.

I know that there are a lot of conspiracy theories regarding Tesla. But the fact is... he made a lot of claims about being able to produce a "Death Ray" that could knock down planes from hundreds of miles away, among other claims of great interest to the military community. While they mostly ignored him as a kook during the 20s and 30s, when we went to war against Japan and Germany, our government was looking for any kind of technological edge it could find.

The fact that he died in January, 1943... during the middle of the Manhattan Project.... you fill in the blanks.

[sch_peakoiler]

I have three questions.

First - is there a proof or evidence or a hint that papers were really confiscated by the US Government? Or is it a fact? I am just curious - I am not that informed on details of his death.

Second - so there is a possibility that all those cool devices are confiscated by US Government and are waiting for the moment to be used, right? And in 50 Years never came out? Then probably we should stop worrying, Peak Oil is a non event in this case? And the American Hegemony will last forever?

Third - Lets assume it is so. Everything works as in a good movie, ya know? Illuminati, US Government etc. Then those guys will have to use the things sooner rather than later, right? I mean when things start to get out of control?

[Lighthouse]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Caoimhan', '.')..

The fact that he died in January, 1943... during the middle of the Manhattan Project.... you fill in the blanks.

[emailking]

I find it really unlikely that he was correct, but no one has ever managed to replicate his results.

Not impossible, but very unlikely.

Also, if we really had a secret "death ray" then presumably WW2 would've been a cakewalk.

A cursory search of "radiant energy" + Tesla in google and I don't find anything that really convinces me as a physicist. Again, maybe his real work never made it out. I just doubt it.

History is ripe with examples of true experts making claims that could never be reproduced.

[small_steps]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Markos101', '
')I'm healthily sceptical, but I've read his paper and I understand much of his thesis, particularly regarding experiments involving the Aharonov-Bohm (AB) effect.

In the AB effect, electrons fired passed a solenoid (magnet) get deflected, even though the electrons themselves do not pass through the magnetic 'B' field of the magnet. This suggests the presence of another magnetic field which appears to be generated via gauge freedom in the region surrounding the solenoid, even though the solenoid's B-field magnetic field is only located within the solenoid's shaft.

By 'gauge freedom', I mean a quantum effect that's strange, because it's produced by the requirement that the waves associated with the electrons in QM must be phase-indepdendent - i.e. if you vary the electron's wavefunction (a mathematical gimmick that works to explain particle behaviour in QM but has no particular physical interpretation in itself), you mathematically get the result that there should be another magnetic field outside of the solenoid. <i>No extra work is done to obtain this 'outside' magnetic field</i>.

By varying the strength of this further magnetic field, you create an <i>electric</i> field, which can be used to generate a voltage, and hence current.

[Markos101]

Smallsteps,

Whilst I'm sure you impress with your use of your Physics dictionary, you should lookup AB effect.

In AB effect, the experiment setup such that the B-field produced by the solenoid is localised, and the region through which the electrons 'travel' are not subject to it. They are, however, subject to a magnetic vector potential, A, where B=0 and hence we should have no A.

There are 20,000 scientific papers on AB effect describing the setup - take a read of one of them.

[emailking]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('small_steps', '
')If there is current around that solenoid, there will be flux distributed around it, not just inside the solenoid. Any introductory electromagnetics text should make this clear. So an electron will interact with the energized solenoid (or magnet), sounds a bit like lorentz force to me.

[Caoimhan]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('sch_peakoiler', 'I') have three questions.

First - is there a proof or evidence or a hint that papers were really confiscated by the US Government? Or is it a fact? I am just curious - I am not that informed on details of his death.

[sch_peakoiler]

Ok, the last one sound reasonable, they will probably wait for a dieoff with this device. But there is one this that can spoil their plan. What it if the impact of PO will lead to the building of a new alliance of oil exporting countries - Venezuela, Russia, Iran - which would successfully defend itself. This would mean the dieoff can strike America also. And in this case those guys will be forced to use the technology, right? Or do you think they do not care about americans either?