[rogerhb]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', 'W')hich particular economic law states that everyone will earn enough to feed themselves?

[kabu]

I was being facetious. I'm pretty much a "godless commie".

[MrBill]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', 'W')hich particular economic law states that everyone will earn enough to feed themselves?

[MyOtherID]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MrBill', 'M')eanwhile, some rich world workers, seem intent to squandering every natural advantage which they have been luckily enough to have been born into? They live in debt despite earning 40:1 compared to the average Asian worker and 80:1 compared to those Africans who can also not help where they were born.

[jaws]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MrBill', 'C')omparative advantage does not guarantee anyone has enough to feed themselves. Witness sub-Sahara Africa in the middle of a drought. They do not have enough to eat and they have no jobs no matter if they are only willing to work for enough to eat. A failure, but not due to the market, but ironically failures in humanitary aid, failures of the victim's state/government to take care of them;

[MyOtherID]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', 'T')herefore it is socialism that causes starvation and malnutrition. The free market allows people to supply themselves with all the food they need.

[jaws]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MyOtherID', 'N')onsense. There is no real socialism in Africa, you armchair expert.

[kabu]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MyOtherID', 'N')onsense. There is no real socialism in Africa, you armchair expert.

[rogerhb]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MrBill', 'B')ut NZ is also a borrower of capital to fund their own current account deficit. Therefore, they have not earned the right to criticize others. Eat your sheep! ; - ))

[CrudeAwakening]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '
')Therefore it is socialism that causes starvation and malnutrition. The free market allows people to supply themselves with all the food they need.

[rogerhb]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('CrudeAwakening', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '
')Therefore it is socialism that causes starvation and malnutrition. The free market allows people to supply themselves with all the food they need.

[jaws]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kabu', 'I') wouldn’t worry about the exact definition of socialism because whatever it is, it completely excludes any private control over any and all resources that everyone’s in need of. This key aspect does not exist in Africa, does it? If it did, Africa would be absent of any significant corporate gains to be had there, which I believe is not the case. Capitalism and real Socialism, by definition, aren't likely to exist within the same state. Maybe I'm wrong- I haven't studied Africa- but why bring up socialism when you could simply just talk about a corrupt, centralized, incompetent system of governance?

It’s almost as if you just love capitalism so much that’ll you jump on any opportunity you can to blame a civilizations problems on anything that even remotely resembles a system that opposes it!

I myself am not going to blame Africa’s problems on present day, capitalist activity- not that’ll I rule out its hand in perpetuating them. Africa and its people were exploited for a long, long time, its culture thrown completely out of whack; and then all of a sudden its exploiters were politically motivated to feign having a conscious and decided do a bunch of food drops, helping to give it a human population that’s completely oversized, and out of sync with its environment. A differing political system in itself will not correct the situation. Simply pointing your finger at “socialism” is ridiculous.

[Shadizar]

Could you please expain comparative advantage to me Jaws? I am having trouble coming to grips with it in the current global environment.

It seems to me that the U.S. is getting no real advantage from global trade right now. U.S. banking seems to be doing well in the deal, but I have trouble seeing how U.S. based (i.e. workers actually making products) manufacturers are benefiting from the lower wages and lower base material costs of other countries. They are doing great but jobs in the U.S., wages, and the trade defecit are hurting (as far as I can tell).

From what I've read (and its limited I'll admit) comparative advantage relies on lower wages, or lower material prices. How exactly is the U.S. economy benefiting from comparative advantage? The way I perceive it companies are benefiting more from employing overseas workers instead of U.S. workers for nearly any kind of manufacturing jobs.

Service jobs are wonderful in our booming economy, but what good are they in any kind of consumer retreat? That will happen someday. Maybe not today, but its inevitable at some point (am I wrong about that?).

I do think that we (U.S.) are winners in comparative advantage today, I just don't think the winner is the U.S. I have a suspicion its great for the free market and capitalism in the end, but in the short term the U.S. is the loser. What am I not seeing?

-Shadizar

[rogerhb]

My understanding of "comparative advantage" is that different communities will produce different goods, where you produce the goods that you will make the most profit on and sell those to people who would find it more expensive to make those goods themselves.

A good example is coffee only naturally grows near the equator, so it would be expensive for Inuits to get into the coffee growing business.

You do what you can do best and import the rest.

However this theory all depends on free trade, which we don't have. If you watch the news and see about "free-trade agreements" being signed between two countries, this highlights the problem that we don't actually have free trade and you have to go into special bilateral agreements to get it.

The two enemies of free trade are tarriffs and subsidised production, and of course Europe and the USA are the most guilty parties to this behaviour.

It also depends on cheap transport of goods.

[CrudeAwakening]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '
')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')s socialism responsible for all imbalances of supply and demand?

[jaws]

The easiest way to explain comparative advantage is with a desert island, "Robinson Crusoe" scenario. Picture Robinson Crusoe living on a desert island. Robinson is a successful banker on the mainland, but on a desert island his survival skills are mediocre. He can catch one fish per hour or forage 10 mangoes per hour, and that's all he has to sustain himself.

One day Robinson Crusoe runs into Friday. Friday has lived on the island for many years and has developped advanced skills at survival. He can can catch 2 fish per hour and forage 12 mangoes per hour.

The cost of producing a fish for Friday is 6 mangoes. The cost of producing a fish for Robinson Crusoe is 10 mangoes. Crusoe, being a clever banker, makes an exchange with Friday. He says I will trade you 8 mangoes for each fish that you catch.

Before the trade Robinson, by working 12 hours a day, could either catch 12 fish or get 120 mangoes (or a mix of both). But if he trades with Friday, he can catch 120 mangoes and exchange them for 15 fish! He thus gets 3 more fish than he would have caught by himself if he specializes in mangoes.

Friday, by working 12 hours a day, could either catch 24 fish or get 144 mangoes (or a mix of both). He can exchange his 24 fish for 192 mangoes, thus get 48 more mangoes than he could if he had foraged them himself.

Thus it doesn't matter if Friday is a lot more talented at surviving on the island. If both men cooperate and trade with one another, they are both going to increase the goods they can produce. If they don't want to consume more goods, then they can reduce the time they spend working.

For the global economy, it doesn't matter if Americans are getting more out of the deal than Chinese. They are both getting something, they are both getting more goods than they could have had if they didn't cooperate. Wages aren't being lowered, they're being increased.

[jaws]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('CrudeAwakening', 'D')oes this apply to the oil markets too? That if only we left things to the market and stopped socialist meddling, there'd be enough oil for everyone's needs from now till eternity? Are all shortages truly due to socialist market-meddling?

[CrudeAwakening]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rogerhb', 'I')t also depends on cheap transport of goods.

[MyOtherID]

These small/no government idiots want a world where they don't have to pay any taxes, where it's dog eat dog and may the best man win. They resent every cent they pay in taxes, seeing it as "wealth redistribution". They measure life in terms of possessions, and they have no concept of the communal good. They cannot see that their own safety and happiness will decrease in direct proportion to the extent the state is starved of funds used to fund health, education, transport and other systems.

It's a peculiar form of dementia they suffer from, most widely seen in the USA, but you'll also find sufferers in New Zealand, it seems.

[kabu]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jaws', '
')Dictatorship, Monarchy and Democracy are political systems. Socialism is not a political system, it is an economic policy that can be pursued by either of the previous systems.