[ubercrap]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Licho', 'O')mg 200 amps at 240V?? I have 10A (@ 220V) fuse in my flat! And it's enough for everything (lighting is seperate).. well ok, microwave + electric kettle + all my computers can cause troubles, considering I have only 2200W avail, and I'm heading for upgrade, but 200A seems extremely huge to me, do you have 5cm thick cables to handle it inside walls too?
(It's really huge unless you need to heat whole house with electricity or something like that)

And is 3kWh system usefull? I mean your car has what, 50kW power? Or much more if it's SUV? You can assume that reasonably powerfull car (can run uphill with cargo) needs some 20-30kW ...
And with 3kWh battery thats about 6 minutes of power

I believe that you can charge 3kWh battery in hour or two, I calculated with some 10-20 amps as maximum current you can drawn from your grid. But decent cars will need to have much more powerfull batteries..

And yes, heavy too, no way people could change it with bare hands

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')nd is 3kWh system usefull? I mean your car has what, 50kW power? Or much more if it's SUV? You can assume that reasonably powerfull car (can run uphill with cargo) needs some 20-30kW ...
And with 3kWh battery thats about 6 minutes of power

[tees]

Hi, I understand the basics of how a PEM fuel cell works, but there's just one thing I can't seem to find the answer for.
When the negatively charged electrons meet up with the hydrogen protons at the cathode, why is oxygen added to the mix to make water?
Why are the hydrogen molecules not reused and sent back to the anode? Is it impurities in the hydrogen?

[EnergySpin]

Cause that would create a perpetual motion device.
Hydrogen is a pure element .....
The reaction which generates the energy is 2H+ + 2 e-+ 1/2 O2->H20 + Energy. If you wanted to reverse the reaction then you would have to give back the energy you gained (much more actually d/t 2ndLaw)

[tees]

Thanks for your reply, ES. I'm still not sure that I understand though,. What would happen if O2 wasn't added to the mix?

Thanks again.

/tees

[ChumpusRex]

In a fuel cell you start with Hydrogen.

Hydrogen consists of a proton bound to an electron.

In a fuel cell, you split the electron off - this needs a little bit of energy

Under normal conditions, the electron and the proton could just recombine - this would give you hydrogen again (and give you your small energy payment back) so no net change in energy.

However, if you add oxygen to the mix then the protons can combine with the oxygen. This combination is extremely hungry for electrons - much more so than a proton on its own. The result of this combination and replacement of the missing electrons is water (which can then be removed from the fuel cell).

In a fuel cell you arrange for the hydrogen to give up an electron at one electrode. (This gives an excess of spare electrons at that electrode - anode).

At the other electrode you arrange for protons to combine with oxygen and electrons. (This creates a shortage of spare electrons at that electrode - cathode).

The membrane is used to separate the 2 reactions - so that only one can occur at each electrode.

In water, the hydrogen and oxygen atoms are strongly bonded. (Forming this bond is what pushed the electrons around the circuit). You have to apply an external source of energy to break the bond, and get back to hydrogen and oxygen. (This is what happens in electrolysis).

[nedgar1980]

Hello,my name is Edgar Villarreal and I'm a researcher at the University of Seville, Spain. We have bought the 1.2 kW Nexa Fuel Cell Power Module from Ballard. With it, we are investing on its installation on a light vehicle. Before the installation we are going to test it so we will apply some control methods on a system based in the fuell cell and a DC Electronic Load. But there is a problem, we need know all the information about the sensors installed into the cell and we can't identify the wires, which are outside the cell, with the corresponding sensors, especially in the cooling fan and in the air pump (there is a cluster of wires of different colours going out the compressor). I ask it to you because we don't want to open the framework of the cell.

We will be very greatful to you if you provide us any information about the electric diagram or any similar thing.

If you can't help me, Do you know anybody who works with a fuel cell like mine?

THANKS!! My email: nedgar1980@hotmail.com

[foolcell]

Ask Ballard for a wiring diagram they should supply it....

[azreal60]

Definately contact the manufactor for a wiring diagram. Even a small difference between cells might result in you screwing something up, if Ballard sends it it should be 100 percent correct.

[nedgar1980]

Thanks, but Ballard doesn't want to give it to me. I don't understand them.

[plcow]

I have spent 2 months trying to get information about the compressor from ballard and from my own tests. I know this much, the wires arn't a positive, negative, ground combo. I have no experience dealing with wiring so I hope someone can post some help.

[foolcell]

The compressor is most likely a just a variable speed fan, nothing particular fancy. The fan just sucks/blows air across the fuel cell plates depending on the circuit load. Are you trying to design a system?

[Frank]

Where did you buy it? http://www.fuelcellmarkets.com/article_ ... bsite=1102

[homerj]

The PEM is an electrochemical cell. You have an oxidation reaction at the anode to create the protons, and a reduction reaction at the cathode. In this case you have an oxygen reduction reaction (ORR) using oxygen from the air. You could reduce something else at the cathode, it is just that oxygen, from the air, is convenient.

[Brandon]

Direct coal to electricity, trash to electricity, etc. 70% conversion possible. If this works, it could be huge. Any comments?

Fuel Up With Banana Peels:
http://www.wired.com/news/planet/0,2782 ... _2techhead

SRI International Presents Novel Direct Carbon Fuel Cell Technology at Industry Event:
http://www.sri.com/news/releases/11-11-05.html

Direct Carbon Conversion Workshop:
http://www.fuelcellseminar.com/free_workshop.asp

[lorenzo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Brandon', 'D')irect coal to electricity, trash to electricity, etc. 70% conversion possible. If this works, it could be huge. Any comments?

Fuel Up With Banana Peels:
http://www.wired.com/news/planet/0,2782 ... _2techhead

SRI International Presents Novel Direct Carbon Fuel Cell Technology at Industry Event:
http://www.sri.com/news/releases/11-11-05.html

Direct Carbon Conversion Workshop:
http://www.fuelcellseminar.com/free_workshop.asp

[Dukat_Reloaded]

Thats good news, Liquid fuel problem will be solved, these devices could use coal or other carbon matter and directly generate electricity to power an electric motor. Looks like we are going to invent our way out, I think the only thing that will peak in the future is "Peak Human".

[ThunderChunky]

Cheaper Fuel Cells

A new membrane makes fuel cells more powerful and less expensive to produce.

By Kevin Bullis

http://www.technologyreview.com/read_ar ... x?id=16665

Not even all the doomers on the net can stop technology.

[Doly]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ThunderChunky', '
')Not even all the doomers on the net can stop technology.

[ThunderChunky]

The article said the technology is being tested with hyrogen- and methanol-based fuel cells.