[ennui2]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '
')are you one of those loonies who thinks that Obama is the anti-Christ?

[onlooker]

Well said Ennui
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')f people want to get along, they need to get beyond the us vs. them mentality, and extremely rigid ideology is part of the problem.

[KaiserJeep]

From where I sit, the right wing whack jobs and the left wing whack jobs are about equally crazy.

For what it is worth, I don't think that any POTUS of either major party has ever wanted to go to war. Lincoln did everything he could to heal the Union. Woodrow Wilson did not want to jump into a European war that was already years old, until Germany repeatedly sank US shipping headed for Europe. FDR was doing everything he could to remain neutral in Europe, when the 3rd nation of the Axis Powers struck Pearl Harbor. GWB was genuinely shocked by the attack on 9/11/2001.

Arguably, Eisenhower got us into both Korea and Vietnam. But with his background as a savvy Supreme Allied Commander in WW2 and first NATO Commander, he knew that unlimited nuclear war was unthinkable and a limited war unwinnable. He negotiated an armistice in Korea that remains in place 62 years later. He only ever authorized 900 unarmed "technical advisers" in Vietnam, JFK preserved the stalemate, and LBJ decided he had to "win" and escalated. (LBJ was but a Naval Reserve Lt. Commander, awarded the Silver Star by McArthur for riding in a combat plane as an observer. Then he was forcibly retired and entered government service - he had wanted to go into combat with no command experience, and McArthur had recognized a dangerous nut job.)

Eisenhower warned of the "military industrial complex" and gave good advice on how to avoid problems.

Obama simply lacks any military savvy whatsoever - and thinks that he can retreat until he wins, and that it is OK to have anonymous death fall from the sky as a drone-fired missile, and has repeatedly and seemingly routinely slaughtered women and children. Obama has made more Muslim martyrs than anyone, and he is the most likely POTUS to get us into a major war that we have ever had.

To anyone that feels discomfort today - you are entirely justified, our nation has never been in greater danger.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KaiserJeep', '
')Arguably, Eisenhower got us into both Korea and Vietnam.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ennui2', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '
')are you one of those loonies who thinks that Obama is the anti-Christ?

[PrestonSturges]

Talk about the antichrist (a word only used once in the Bible IIRC) always reveals the "Christians" don't read their Bible, because Christians will fall over each other rushing to worship the the antichrist. I mean, he'd hardly qualify as an antichrist if Christians didn't line up to worship him. It's the Christian fundamentalists who will be the foot soldiers of the antichrist. Oh, and of course the antichrist will mix religion and politics - the Bible is quite specific about that.

[ennui2]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KaiserJeep', '
')Obama simply lacks any military savvy whatsoever

[Newfie]

Ennui,

IIRC from many years ago you live in Greece or the Med?

I tend to agree. I think the EU is taking exactly the wrong approach. Instead of re-erecting the borders within the EU, they should be stregthening the EU's exterior borders.

Then again I kinda think the same of the USA. Which doesn't make me real popular with my Left wing buddies. But what are borders for, fundamentally? If you are not going to protect them then why have them? And what does citizenship mean? If you water down the meaning then it's not meaningful.

To go back to the "false flag" idea, what it is essentially talking about is having a clear idea of the route causes and meanings. To not be distracted but to calmly assess over the breadth of history and to project wisely into the future. We, Western Culture seem to absolutely suck at that.

IS folks are thinking very long term, Dieing today does not matter because we will glory in the afterlife. Eternity is a long time.

Perhaps our short term thinking is a consequence of consumerisim. My parents were something of hoarders, and I have a bit of that. I see something I can do something with, I see it as useful and it is hard to throw it away. But in our consumer society few things have enduring value. They give way to the next big thing, the new iGadget, the new OS, the next season, or release. We seldom construct anything physical with our hands. We have little of practical value to pas on to our kids. I'm an atheist so I can't even pass on the value of an after life.

If I have nothing of value to pass to my kids was my life of any value?

Perhaps this distorts our planning and sense of values.

Perhaps it leaves a void that folks like IS can fill for all too many?

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ennui2', '
')How many years did hawks still cling to the idea if we just kept bombing Vietnam back to the stone age we could have "won"? Some probably still do.

[PrestonSturges]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KaiserJeep', '
')Obama simply lacks any military savvy whatsoever - and thinks that he can retreat until he wins, and that it is OK to have anonymous death fall from the sky as a drone-fired missile, and has repeatedly and seemingly routinely slaughtered women and children. Obama has made more Muslim martyrs than anyone, and he is the most likely POTUS to get us into a major war that we have ever had.

To anyone that feels discomfort today - you are entirely justified, our nation has never been in greater danger.

[onlooker]

I found this quote by Gore Vidal
"You can't have a war on terrorism because that's not a actual enemy, it's an abstract. It's like having a war on dandruff. That war will be eternal and pointless. It's idiotic.

That's not a war, it's a slogan. it's a lie. It's advertising, which is the only art form we ever invented in America. And we use it to sell soap, wars and presidential candidates in the same fashion." End quote.
Again nobody is denying terrorist acts are occurring and terrorists exist. What my OP was about is how the West in fact instigated this state of affairs because it was convenient both abroad and at home. Especially taking into account the much more serious and fundamental threats related to the environment and the economy hovering over all the planet and its people and yet the MSM focuses obsessively with terrorism.

[Cog]

Seeing people slaughtered in the street by ISIS is a bit more concrete than the more abstract doom 10 years from now. Do you really blame people for being frightened more by the former and not the latter?

[onlooker]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cog', 'S')eeing people slaughtered in the street by ISIS is a bit more concrete than the more abstract doom 10 years from now. Do you really blame people for being frightened more by the former and not the latter?

[Cog]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('onlooker', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cog', 'S')eeing people slaughtered in the street by ISIS is a bit more concrete than the more abstract doom 10 years from now. Do you really blame people for being frightened more by the former and not the latter?

[onlooker]

Okay that is a reasonable post Cog which I accept. By the way have a great day.

[davep]

[Cog]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('onlooker', 'O')kay that is a reasonable post Cog which I accept. By the way have a great day.

[careinke]

[quote="Plantagenet
Muhammad (the guy with his hair on fire) ordering a temple and its idols destroyed.[/quote]

It is forbidden to have images of Mohamed (Peace be upon him). Expect a fatwa on you shortly. Sorry.

[Plantagenet]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('careinke', '
')It is forbidden to have images of Mohamed (Peace be upon him). Expect a fatwa on you shortly. Sorry.

[careinke]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('careinke', '
')It is forbidden to have images of Mohamed (Peace be upon him). Expect a fatwa on you shortly. Sorry.